Testwiki:Property proposal/Archive/37

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Template:Property proposal

Discussion
Template:O Use Template:P:
Template:Claim
Template:Claim
Josh Baumgartner (talk) 08:56, 20 September 2015 (UTC)

Template:Not done Not enought support. --Tobias1984 (talk) 11:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

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Yair rand (talk) 11:21, 14 October 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
Template:S - Mbch331 (talk) 11:23, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
Template:S but I'm not sure about the data type. In general those values have measurement uncertainties, so Quantity might be better. Why restrict this to the sun? Apoapsis would be more general. Same for periapsis. --mfb (talk) 13:14, 16 October 2015 (UTC)
Number and quantity are the same when creating a property. You can't create a number-type property, only a quantity or string. Mbch331 (talk) 14:26, 16 October 2015 (UTC)
Template:Done --Tobias1984 (talk) 11:40, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

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Yair rand (talk) 11:21, 14 October 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
Template:S - Mbch331 (talk) 11:23, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
Template:Support but need a change of name to periapsis. -- Innocent bystander (talk) 20:08, 18 October 2015 (UTC)


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Motivation

Verify existence of Mexican municipalities and verify associated data. 91.9.113.154 13:01, 5 October 2015 (UTC)

Discussion


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Motivation

Common in infoboxes. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 13:07, 28 September 2015 (UTC)

Discussion


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Motivation

Needed for describing ski areas. Sjoerd de Bruin (talk) 19:39, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

Discussion

Template:Not done No support. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:20, 22 September 2015 (UTC)


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Motivation

The 2012 ACM Computing Classification System can be utilized in semantic web applications. It relies on a semantic vocabulary as the single source of categories and concepts that reflect the state of the art of the computing discipline. This classification system plays a key role in the classification of publications in the computer science. This property will help to link the concepts of Wikidata (and so, also wikipedia) to scientists' publications. Open Science is near... Karima Rafes (talk) 22:31, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
Template:Ping Please provide an example that relates to a stated, existing Wikidata item, as done for other property proposals. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 09:04, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping I inserted examples. It's ok ? --90.44.36.135 11:47, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
Thank you. It seems that the ID is, for instance "10002997" and the formatter URL is "http://dl.acm.org/buildccscode.cfm?id=$1&lid=f". Is that pattern consistent? (i.e. can we always replace "$1" with an ID and get a vaid URL?) Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:56, 17 July 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping It seems, we can always replace "$1" with an ID and get a vaid URL. The two solutions are good for me. I'm prefer URL because the user of wikidata can see directly the page of ACM about this ID but it's true, the URL is not very nice... We replace the type URL by a integer ? --Karima Rafes (talk) 08:34, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping Not quite; we actually use "string" datatypes for such things. I've made the necessary changes, above, but I see that both of your examples use the same value. Please check. Thank you. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:57, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping Great ! Now, we wait the validation ? --Karima Rafes (talk) 09:03, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping No, we need to resolve "both of your examples use the same value". Is that correct?
Template:Ping Yes this is correct. For the same ID, there will be hundreds of entities. Here Template:Q Template:Q will have the same id 10002997 --Karima Rafes (talk) 16:04, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping, So each of these numbers corresponds to a class ('category') of items. In that case shouldn't this property be used on the wikidata item corresponding to the ICM category, rather than using it on every item in that category? Will adding it to every item breach any ICM copyright?
Note that the ICM categorisation has only one property (the category) so it may well be better to add the ICM category to every item rather than trying to bend the wikidata statements to fit the ICM categorisation. Template:Ping what do you think? Joe Filceolaire (talk) 15:39, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
So how many of these IDs does ICM have? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:52, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping Sorry, I do not know ICM. I speak about ACM Computing Classification. I suppose, ICM is one of hundreds of classification in the world. Here, the question is not to give again (and again...) a new category in Wikidata. I do not know if ACM is the best or not. The question is : How do you link the "million" of scientific publications with ACM's ID with the page of Wikipedia via Wikidata ? My proposition is to show the old publications in relation with a page of Wikipedia via a gadget that will use the ACM's ID in Wikidata. Have you an other manner to do that ? This new property is not nice but it's the more simple solution for linking Wikipedia to computer science's publications. I hope you are convinced. Bye --Karima Rafes (talk) 07:59, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping Which proportion of the ACM categories don't have their counterparts in Wikidata items ? I bet only a few ... This is a case for Databases interlinking, and Wikidata is quite good at it. We can ask for a "mix and match" (https://tools.wmflabs.org/mix-n-match/?#) dataset to directly map the ACM categories to their Wikidata items. Wikidata has not to replicate any classification in the world, but has to find nice ways to interlink databases. I'm afraid adding a property to reflect another classification is not the custom here, we use this to source our own classification statements and properties like Template:P. author  TomT0m / talk page 09:15, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
Sorry; I meant ACM. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:03, 3 August 2015 (UTC)
Template:PingTemplate:Ping Another solution, it's to change the name of this property by : "ACM 2012 ID" and the description : "ACM's ID for databases interlinking". So the wikidata's users will not use this property for creating another classification in Wikidata. This property will be only an ID for "Databases interlinking". What do you think ? Bye --Karima Rafes (talk) 10:16, 4 August 2015 (UTC)
I would say to leave the label alone and rewrite the description to make clear it is only for the wikidata item corresponding to that ACM category and not for the members of the category. Joe Filceolaire (talk) 16:16, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping But the aim is to link the entities of Wikidata with ACM's categories via this property. It's exactly the same problem with the Template:P for the occupations and there are no problems with other classifications in wikidata. I simplified the description and label to avoid using it as a category (like the property Template:P). It's more clear now ? Bye --Karima Rafes (talk) 20:08, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
Karima property Template:P can be used to label wikidata items (not "entities". On wikidata "entitities" = "properties" + "items"). Property Template:P is then used to link items for persons to these occupation items.
Similarly the proposed "ACM Classification Code 2012" property can be used to link to the corresponding wikidata items (items with the "Template:P" property) but individual wikidata items associated with this category will use a number of different properties to link to it, including Template:P, Template:P, Template:P, Template:P so it may be difficult to harvest all of these associated items (but if you manage to do so you will have more info than the ACM "category" relation would give you.
Having said that I Template:S the creation of this property. Joe Filceolaire (talk) 17:23, 8 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks Joe Filceolaire. I Template:S the creation of this property. --Karima Rafes (talk) 07:57, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

Template:S As this classification has its own article in Wikipedia, it's well-known and should be used here. Moreover this will allow us to link the articles with some reference publications on the sites like https://hal.archives-ouvertes.fr/. JackPotte (talk) 09:59, 10 August 2015 (UTC)

I Template:S the creation of this property. --Gregory Grefenstette (talk) 15:55, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
I Template:S the creation of this property. --Julien.Nauroy (talk) 05:06, 19 August 2015 (UTC)


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Template:Property proposal

Motivation

Template:P and other properties are still on Wikidata , so Wikidata should have an entry for Template:Q ★ → Airon 90 10:20, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Discussion

Template:Comment This should be Template:P. -- Gymel (talk) 10:36, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

I looked for it but I didn't find it. Maybe I'm not good in it. Thank you very much! --★ → Airon 90 18:26, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

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Template:Property proposal

Motivation

Template:Q is a great work and Wikidata should have an entry for it ★ → Airon 90 10:32, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Discussion

Template:Comment This definitely is Template:P (and related is Template:P). -- Gymel (talk) 10:38, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

I looked for it but I didn't find it. Maybe I'm not good in it. Thank you very much! --★ → Airon 90 18:26, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

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Template:Property proposal

Motivation

By using seconds it is possible to obtain full duration divided by hours, minutes and seconds. Used in w:it:Template:Tracce. --★ → Airon 90 13:04, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Discussion
Template:Support, but item is wrong datatype. --Stryn (talk) 07:47, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support --NaBUru38 (talk) 23:22, 25 February 2013 (UTC)
  • Template:Support and comment: we also need badly need running times/durations for films and such. So "duration" can apply across different art forms. no? Shawn in Montreal (talk) 04:26, 27 February 2013 (UTC)
Agree with Shawn --Viscontino talk 10:09, 2 March 2013 (UTC)

See Template:P. — Ayack (talk) 12:13, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

Template:Not done use Template:P Almondega (talk) 05:20, 21 October 2015 (UTC)

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Template:Property proposal

Motivation

See Kansallisbiografia ★ → Airon 90 22:02, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
Template:S Jonathan Groß (talk) 21:00, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

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Template:Property proposal

Motivation

See Finnish parliament ★ → Airon 90 22:02, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
Template:S Jonathan Groß (talk) 21:00, 17 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:S - seems straight-forward. Josh Baumgartner (talk) 23:43, 21 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:S - seems useful Silverfish (talk) 21:00, 30 September 2015 (UTC)

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Motivation

Another important database from the Finnish politics to define items on Wikidata. ★ → Airon 90 20:26, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

Discussion

FYI I don't know why but on Finnish Wikipedia the following URL is used:

http://145.247.195.5/tietoa-valtioneuvostosta/hallitukset2/vuodesta-1917/tulokset/fi.jsp?report_id=M2&selectedCriterion.ministeri_henkilo_id=$1

I propose the following one because it has link to the official website, it is the one used in the website if you start surfing from the homepage (and because the language is English, of course)

http://145.247.195.5/tietoa-valtioneuvostosta/hallitukset/vuodesta-1917/tulokset/en.jsp?report_id=M2&selectedCriterion.ministeri_henkilo_id=$1

--★ → Airon 90 20:26, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

Template:S Jonathan Groß (talk) 21:00, 17 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:S. Note that property 'Template:P' can have multiple values each with a qualifier (such as 'language'). One (or none or all) of these can be marked as preferred. How many languages are available? Joe Filceolaire (talk) 04:22, 20 September 2015 (UTC). Fixed Joe Filceolaire (talk) 21:44, 21 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping
As I don't know the meaning of "preferred" - though I can understand it - I'd not set a preferred link by now. --★ → Airon 90 13:40, 21 September 2015 (UTC)
See Help:Ranking for how to set preferred rank (it's the three small squares that appear next to the value/item when you edit a claim). In this case I think the three 'formatter' values can probably all have equal rank, provided they each have a 'Template:P' qualifier. It can always be changed later if there are problems. Joe Filceolaire (talk) 21:37, 21 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:S Josh Baumgartner (talk) 23:43, 21 September 2015 (UTC)

average gradient on a railway

Template:Property proposal

Motivation

This is a key property for funicular railways. I'm not sure which units are best for this though? Thryduulf (talk: local | en.wp | en.wikt) 23:13, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

Discussion

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Template:Property proposal

Motivation

Needed for describing ski areas. Sjoerd de Bruin (talk) 19:32, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

Discussion
Template:O I would use Template:P with qualifier Template:P. e.g. Template:Claim --Pasleim (talk) 15:58, 25 August 2015 (UTC)
Template:O Use Template:P with Template:P as per Template:User. Josh Baumgartner (talk) 21:25, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

Template:Not done No support. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:18, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

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Motivation

This is a key property for funicular railways. I'm not sure which units are best for this though? Thryduulf (talk: local | en.wp | en.wikt) 23:13, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

Discussion


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Discussion

This is a spatial extent for an object. Also called maximum width some places. Other proposals include the discussion at Wikidata:Property_proposal/Pending/2#length and Wikidata:Requests for comment/Dimensions and units for the quantity datatype#Length. I believe it is a difference between a spatial objects length across the main axis (length across the secondary) and some width. The later would use a qualifier. An alternate name could be width extent, or even spatial width extent. Jeblad (talk) 20:37, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

Note that #Spatial extent is an alternate and more general solution. Jeblad (talk) 01:41, 30 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold pending data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:56, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

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Discussion

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Discussion

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Spacecraft are moved and drift so the longitude is only accurate at a certain moment in time, although many craft remain at a working longitude for years. Secretlondon (talk) 13:58, 27 April 2013 (UTC)
We can apparently have qualifiers so this is fine, we can say this was accurate at X date. Secretlondon (talk) 15:41, 28 April 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support Secretlondon (talk) 10:11, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support - I corrected the template form numeric to number. --Tobias1984 (talk) 14:05, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support with the qualifier for the time. This property could be useful also for Astronomy task force. --Paperoastro (talk) 13:30, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Oppose -- "Longitude" is only valid for a small subset of all satellites; for example, it is a "nominal longitude" or "assigned longitude" or maybe "licensed longitude" (licensed by the ICC or some such) only for Earth satellites in Geosynchronous or Geostationary orbits. This parm makes no sense at all for orbital satellites in any other orbit. N2e (talk) 02:29, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
Geosynchronous orbits are important subset of orbits. The most communication satellites are placed on geostationary orbit. Longitude is important characteristic of these satellites. This characteristic is mentioned in every source that describe geostationary satellite, for example see [3]. 17:37, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment We wouldn't use it for satellites that are not in geosynchronous orbit, like we do with the longitude property in satellite infoboxes currently. It doesn't need to be used on every spacecraft. Secretlondon (talk) 19:27, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
Template:S Filceolaire (talk) 00:32, 20 August 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment I'd like to move this proposal to "approved/pending", but imho the name is too much generic. It is possible to choose a more general name (e.g. "longitude of ascending node")? --Paperoastro (talk) 21:52, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
Template:Done Name changed, ready to be moved to the archive.--Micru (talk) 20:42, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

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Proper motion / Eigenbewegung / Mouvement propre

Radial velocity

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Discussion

cruise speed

Template:Property proposal

Template:Comment - can be a qualifier for speed. "type of speed" links to item "cruise speed", "max speed", "min speed"... --Tobias1984 (talk) 14:01, 16 May 2013 (UTC)
Generic: Speed. --Tobias1984 (talk) 14:18, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment Agree, qualifiers would be best. Danrok (talk) 16:03, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment i think should be a qualifers for speed LucaBiondi (talk) 12:41, 18 August 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support It is more useful for data entry and access for common data points such as maximum speed, cruise speed, etc. to have their own distinct properties instead of relying on qualifiers. Joshbaumgartner (talk) 00:39, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Orbital period

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Template:Collapse top I think the datatype is wrong: it is not a date, it is a quantity (of time), which is not yet available. --Zolo (talk) 21:26, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

Hi, Zolo. You are right, it is a quantity, but it can be expressed as day, hour, minutes and second, fraction of day, fraction of hour... Imho time datatype has the right precision to save data as e.g. planet rotation period. --Paperoastro (talk) 21:53, 29 May 2013 (UTC)
I do not think you can add a number of days without specifying a year using the date datatype, can you ? Given that there will be a quantity datatype, I think it is better to wait for it. It will probably only accept decimal notations (so days and fractions of days, not days and hours), but the meaning will be more accurate and the formatting can be done through templates. --Zolo (talk) 07:21, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
Good observation! The problem, for me, is how the official values are given: if they are expressed in days (or hours, or milliseconds for pulsars) the most correct datatype is number. Nevertheless in some cases the official values are given in "time" format: e.g. rotation period of en:Earth is 23h 56m 4.100s. In "hours and fraction of hours" format it would be 23.934472222... that it is quite different. Do we need another data type? --Paperoastro (talk) 12:13, 30 May 2013 (UTC) P.S.: Thanks for this discussion: I would like to do it when I proposed this property! Is Time a pure "calendar" datatype? --Paperoastro (talk) 12:13, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
Yes, I think it is meant only for calendar, you can try it in Template:Q. Is it really bad to use 23.934472222 hour when the official value is 23h 56m 4.100s ? --Zolo (talk) 12:40, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
In 23.934472222 "2" is en:repeating decimal: the conversion in hours, minutes, seconds depends on the number of decimals we choose. But now it is not important: the "official value" of Earth rotation (and also for the other planets) is given in day and decimals (see the reference in en:Earth), so there is no more problem to use "number" datatype for this property and also for Template:P. --Paperoastro (talk) 21:13, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
It should be something like Python's "timedelta" --Ricordisamoa 22:04, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
Yes, exactly! Could be a good idea try to propose this kind of datatype. --Paperoastro (talk) 22:45, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
Ok, so I will delete this property and move it back to proposals as a quantity. I think you can suggest new datatypes at WD:contact the development team, but given that several of those thay were originally planned are still missing, I do not know if they will be willing to do it ;). --Zolo (talk) 07:25, 31 May 2013 (UTC)
For me it is ok. For the same reasons, it would be better to delete also Template:P. There is a manner to save this discussion? ;) --Paperoastro (talk) 07:51, 31 May 2013 (UTC)
Ok; I'll delete P572 too. I can simply copy this discussion on the property proposal page. --Zolo (talk) 08:37, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

I am also wondered why it has datetime datatype. It should have float number with unit.--Ahonc (talk) 11:10, 31 May 2013 (UTC) Template:Collapse bottom

Move to pending.--GZWDer (talk) 02:55, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Rotation period

Template:Property proposal

Move to pending.--GZWDer (talk) 02:55, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Template:Comment Updated from P572 Almondega (talk) 05:41, 21 October 2015 (UTC)


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Discussion
  • Template:Support. Awesome idea. The fact that currency units are somewhat unwieldy due to exchange rates is an issue that needs attention, but it should not prevent us from creating interesting and relevant properties like this. Emw (talk) 19:00, 10 May 2014 (UTC)
  • Template:Comment I think issues are more about verifiability/privacy/volatility than with exchange rate fluctation (very large fortunes are often stocks, and often mostly in just one company, which means that the volatility in local currency will often have more impact than exchange rate fluctation). It means that we should have a date qualifier providing a day, not just a year, if we want something a bit precise, and I am not sure such data exist. This best known source about large wealth is Forbes 500 but it is not really a model of precision and transparency. I cannot even find any indication about how they got their data. And even if we say "this is what we have, so let's go with it", their might be a copyright issue as their is arguably an element of creativity about determining these wealth data (not sure about that actually, maybe its ok as US laws are more permissive than Europe's in this respect). All that does not mean I am opposing this property, just wondering about its practical implementation.
  • Also about the datatype, I do not think that currencies are planned as a unit anytime soon. Should we rather create a "currency" qualifier ? --Zolo (talk) 07:28, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
The concerns about copyright and sourcing seem like a stretch, and, in the seemingly remote chance they're valid, applicable to many if not most of our existing properties. More information on the Forbes ranking is in The World's Billionaires. The "currency" qualifier seems like a reasonable workaround for proper unit support. Emw (talk) 13:00, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
Yes, a currency qualifier is a good idea. Not sure why there are privacy problems (this appears in infoboxes already) or copyright (Wikipedia is CC-BY-SA and uses that info). --Jakob (talk) 13:27, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Ping What was not planned were currency conversions, but IIRC currency units are feasible. Anyhow, just in case check with WD:DEV.--Micru (talk) 17:26, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
Micru, done: Wikidata:Contact_the_development_team#Currency_units. Emw (talk) 15:14, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
Micru, John says: "Yes, currency will be among those units." Emw (talk) 00:51, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Reply to. Currently, we are refraining from importing European population data, following the official advice from the legal team. Much of it is CC-BY-SA but that does not appear to be permissive enough. I am not saying that we can't find uncopyrightable data about this, just that importing the full Forbes list may not be ok - and that in most cases the data are imprecise and debatable. --Zolo (talk) 16:38, 17 May 2014 (UTC)
Zolo, could you please provide a link to that advice from the legal team regarding European population data? If that data can't be included on Wikidata because it's CC-BY-SA (is population data even copyrightable under US law?), then presumably we should delete Template:P, since the Dewey Decimal Classification is not freely licensed, or at best licensed under CC BY-NC-ND, which is not compatible with CC0. A comment in Wikidata:Property_proposal/Archive/17#P1036 mentions it's "free to use the simple ID" from DDC, but the statement is rather tenuously sourced. If we're using DDC ID without formal approval from the legal team on the presumption that it's OK, then why prevent this property from being created?
You mention "importing the full Forbes list may not be ok". I just semi-randomly went through the Wikipedia articles of several people in http://www.forbes.com/billionaires/list/, and Dietrich Mateschitz (#142), Joseph Lau (#143), and S. Truett Cathy (#214), Karl Wlaschek (#312), Ronald Lauder (#410), and Anil Agarwal (#534) all have net worth claims sourced to the Forbes list. If you're basing your rationale on copyright standards, then shouldn't we delete most coverage about net worth in Wikipedia's prose content? It's essentially all cited to Forbes.
And again, regarding the precision and debatability of the data, that is not unique to this property, nor, in my opinion, a compelling reason in this case to not source statements to Forbes. Forbes seems far and away to be far and away the most cited source for this data in the world -- presumably the reference source is good enough for Wikidata. Also, properties like Template:P and Template:P are debated among biologists, and more accurate values regularly supersede less accurate values, but this doesn't mean those properties aren't appropriate. The same holds for claims about Template:P, Template:P, etc., etc. It doesn't mean we shouldn't have these properties, it simply means that we need to cite our sources. Emw (talk) 00:46, 18 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Reply to Citing a source in a article and make a machine-readable copy of a list are two different things. The advice of the legal team is meta:Wikilegal/Database Rights. Apparently, things are simpler for the US than for the EU though.
If it is legally ok to import the Forbes list, I have nothing against it, I am just warning that it is very imprecise (and also, some data are given for "X and family" and I am not sure we can use that in the item about X without family).
I realize I have not replied to the more general point about privacy/verifiability. The sort of issue I had in mind was more like there is a strong suspicion that politician X has accumulated 20 millions but nothing is reallly proven. That does not mean this property should not be created, but I think its usage would deserve a close watch. --Zolo (talk) 06:49, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

Template:Outdent Zolo, thanks for the pointer. Is European law applicable to storing data on Wikidata? My understanding is that only United States law is applicable in that regard. If European law is applicable then it seems the Forbes data (and a vast swath of other data currently used on Wikidata) should not be on Wikidata per the sweat of the brow doctrine. If it is not applicable, then an important question is: do Forbes's net worth statements amount to a creative expression? Is a set of statements about the net worth of 1,645 people copyrightable? Forbes describes the methodology behind their 2014 Forbes Billionaires List as follows: Template:Quote That methodology isn't obviously subjective, original or creative. I think another important point to make here is that using the Forbes list data (even all of it) to cite individuals' net worth claims would not be "importing the Forbes list". Claims for this property would not be directly compiled in a list; they would go onto Wikidata pages about individuals. This seems to avoid the "selection and arrangement" criterion for database or list protections.

Finally, I see no fundamental difference between these claims existing on Wikipedia (which they already do) and them existing here on Wikidata (which is being proposed). The sampling of Forbes data in Wikipedia articles described in my previous post indicates that Wikipedia uses at least a substantial portion of the Forbes list. Much of this exists in highly structured infoboxes as the 'net_worth' parameter. Those infobox statements on Wikipedia are trivially machine-readable. Statements about net worth Wikipedia's prose are also very machine-readable, e.g. with a simple set of regular expressions. If copyright concerns surrounding the Forbes list prevent this property can be created on Wikidata, then the logically consistent thing to do would be to delete almost all claims in the Template:Infobox_person parameter 'net_worth' from Wikipedia. If you don't support doing that, then why not support this property? Emw (talk) 17:00, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

I am not opposing this property, and tend to support it even. But as the datatype is not here yet, we may as well discuss it here :).
There may not be a fundamental difference between copying the list of in Wikipedia and in Wikidata, but still there is a difference in degree (I 'd say machine readability/data-minability of Wikidata > Forbe's website > Wikipedia). And I am not sure their data can be considered orginal or creative (asset valuation implies methodologicla choice but their do not appear extremely sophisticated not particularly original, and their appear to be gaps in their list but that probably does not qualify as active selection of data). Yes, it's quite possible that everything is fine, but sometimes, law is a bit surprising so I don't know. --Zolo (talk) 20:14, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold To be re-opened when the datatype is there. --Micru (talk) 13:45, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I agree with Jura. Emw (talk) 01:27, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

cost

Template:Property proposal

Discussion
  • Template:S. Year could be added with the date qualifier. ----- Jura 10:26, 10 May 2014 (UTC)
    Year ~has to be added in order to do comparison. Snipre (talk) 10:11, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
  • Template:Support. Emw (talk) 02:32, 14 May 2014 (UTC)
  • Template:Support. Should not we use more neutral --Oursana (talk) 21:41, 26 May 2014 (UTC)production costs/Entstehungskosten also to use it for films etc. or are there similar properties? --Oursana (talk) 21:41, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
Oursana, great point, I agree. Jakob, if you agree, please move this proposal to Wikidata:Property proposal/Generic. Emw (talk) 00:25, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold To be created when the datatype number with units is available.--Micru (talk) 11:32, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

  • Template:Support also with new label ("cost" instead of "construction cost"). Maybe we need a qualifier to describe the nature of cost (if it isn't entirely clear from the context). --- Jura 09:38, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Prize money / Preisgeld / prijzengeld / gains en tournois

Template:Property proposal

Discussion

Every professional tennis player has this information in the infobox, and it is changing about weekly. This field can be used on many languages, which makes that an updated value will be updating all languages instantly. Until now, infoboxes of many players are not updated for more then two years (while they ARE updated on other languages already). Edoderoo (talk) 20:08, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

  • Template:Support I have been waiting for this. Vinkje83 (talk) 21:25, 28 April 2013 (UTC)
  • Template:Comment how to handle with differents decimals etc.? Some examples: da-wiki: US$ 14,171,097, de-wiki: 15.035.740 US-Dollar, es-wiki: US$14,171,097, sv-wiki: 4 208 335 US$, lv-wiki: $14 171 097 --Stryn (talk) 15:38, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
    • It's the number that is changing. The thousand-separator is an issue that goes beyond this property, as all numbers have this issue (also population, for example, and square km of a country, lake, etc). Wikidata should first of all hold the number, then it's up to the "language" how to show the currency. But I'm open to good ideas! Edoderoo (talk) 20:01, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
  • Template:Support Of course ! — Hawk-Eye (talk) 07:34, 14 May 2013 (UTC)
  • Template:Support Can this apply to any other sports persons? Danrok (talk) 16:08, 25 May 2013 (UTC)
* Template:Support per Danrok, this could be used with all professional sportspeople. It is also useful for sporting events (e.g. en:The Championships, Wimbledon).--Kompakt (talk) 06:27, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
Addition: it should be possible to specify the currency (but as I understand, the number type will provide a unit field anyway).--Kompakt (talk) 08:30, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Template:Hidden end

Nominal gross domestic product

Template:Property proposal

Discussion
nominal GDP Mcnabber091 (talk) 15:06, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

Template:Done moved to pending. --Tobias1984 (talk) 17:15, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Real gross domestic product growth rate

Template:Property proposal

Discussion
I think it would make more sense to use the given statistic provided from the World Bank rather than calculating it ourselves. If feel like if we did internal calculations the number might be different than what is provided from professional sources. If internal calculations are the norm on Wikidata then I am okay. Mcnabber091 (talk) 18:45, 26 August 2013 (UTC)
I still prefer stored rather than calculated.Mcnabber091 (talk) 03:39, 3 September 2013 (UTC)
  • Template:Oppose can be calculated from GDP and inflation property. --Tobias1984 (talk) 15:19, 26 August 2013 (UTC)
    • Real value does not count the inflation rate. I wonder how you can calculate with GDP growth rate. ((GDP_Nominal_current - inflation_current) - (GDP_Nominal_previous - inflation_previous))*100/(GDP_Nominal_previous - inflation_previous)? Quite complex. Kwj2772 (talk) 08:01, 27 August 2013 (UTC)
  • Template:S Even if we can accurately calculate it, we have to be careful about calculating on our own, as that starts to get into being original research. It is far better if we can simply find a source which tells us the data and cite the source, than for us to calculate the data ourselves. Joshbaumgartner (talk) 06:08, 7 October 2013 (UTC)
  • Template:Support per other supporters. Emw (talk) 03:09, 15 October 2013 (UTC)

GDP per Capita

Template:Property proposal

Discussion
I think it would make more sense to use the given statistic provided from the World Bank rather than calculating it ourselves. If feel like if we did internal calculations the number might be different than what is provided from professional sources. If internal calculations are the norm on Wikidata then I am okay.Mcnabber091 (talk) 19:02, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal

Discussion
Couldn't we have a more generic property that could be used for companies as well with a qualifier like 'specifically' to specify which accounting rules apply? We could just call it 'Debt'. Filceolaire (talk) 01:34, 14 December 2013 (UTC)
Template:S I support this property proposal as being separate from 'Debt'. This is the total debt for governments within a country, not just the federal debt. Mcnabber091 (talk) 13:23, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:22, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Total Reserves

Template:Property proposal

Discussion

Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:23, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal

Template:SupportMcnabber091 (talk) 10:14, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Support Amir (talk) 21:32, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:S --Zolo (talk) 19:53, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
Template:S --Eurodyne (talk) 22:31, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:28, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal

Template:SupportMcnabber091 (talk) 10:14, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Support Amir (talk) 21:32, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:S --Eurodyne (talk) 22:32, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:28, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal

Template:SupportMcnabber091 (talk) 10:14, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Support Amir (talk) 21:32, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:S. --Zolo (talk) 19:55, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
Template:S --Eurodyne (talk) 22:32, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:27, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal

Template:SupportMcnabber091 (talk) 16:44, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:28, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal

Template:SupportMcnabber091 (talk) 10:14, 16 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Support Amir (talk) 21:32, 23 May 2014 (UTC)
Template:Comment What is this? The total revenue of a company or the total revenue of the sale of a specific product, — or both. English Wikipedia has a specific definition of "total revenue", i.e., " otal receipts of a firm from the sale of any given quantity of a product". The proposal gives no example or context. — Finn Årup Nielsen (fnielsen) (talk) 09:37, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:26, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal Template:S Mcnabber091 (talk) 16:26, 7 June 2014 (UTC) Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:40, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal Template:S Mcnabber091 (talk) 16:26, 7 June 2014 (UTC) Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:45, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal Template:S Mcnabber091 (talk) 16:26, 7 June 2014 (UTC) Template:On hold Pending currency data type. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 08:29, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Flux

Template:Property proposal

Discussion

Property complementary to apparent magnitude. Now it used in few infoboxes, but can be extended also to other infoboxes of astronomical objects Paperoastro (talk) 22:02, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Sandbox-NumberUnit / Spielwiese-NumberUnit / Bac à sable-NumberUnit / Pagina delle prove-NumberUnit

(needed only if Number (dimensionless) and Number (with dimension) do not have the same datatype!)

  • Description: any kind of values
  • Datatype: QuantityValue / Number (with dimension / unit) - (1 Sandbox type per available data type)
  • Domain: any kind of values
  • Infobox parameter: any/generic (but more for testing than productive)
  • Comments:

To be honest I am badly informed about wikidata, just to make that clear. I do think that I need a property to be created in order to store values, please confer Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Bot/DrTrigonBot and Wikidata talk:Infoboxes task force#Feasibility of DrTrigonBot/Subster to update Wikidata. Thanks for all your help and patience. Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 20:54, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Sorry. What do you need ? An property with a numeric datatype ? Or a property representing a numeric concept with a string as datatype ? If I take your example with swiss franc you want something like "currency division" to give the nominal value of each coin/note ( 0.05, 0.1, 0.2, 0.5, 1, 2, 5, 10, 20, 50, 100, 200, 1000)? Snipre (talk) 21:03, 22 March 2013 (UTC)
In fact I think a good thing would be a generic property (e.g. "DrTrigonBot Value" or even more generic "Bot Value") for the bot in cases when it has data to write for which no property was created yet - as it is the situation right now for a property "Currency Exchange Rate" (or similar) that is needed for swiss franc. This would allow the bot to already be tested or used without having the need to create always the suitable/correct property before being able to check if the bot works at all (in that specific situation), e.g. That would be a really good and useful/helpful thing! Thanks a lot for considering this and Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 21:41, 22 March 2013 (UTC)
Just for a test you can see if there is a property in request for deletion using string as datatype or a property which not used in a lot of item or finally try on the demo version of wikidata. Snipre (talk) 22:05, 22 March 2013 (UTC)
Thats clear, currently I am using something else. Also the demo was already used to adopt the bot code. What I need is something permanent. In future and daily (usual) operation there will always be a case where you have to test, since the bot is freely configurable from here - by any user. --DrTrigon (talk) 22:36, 22 March 2013 (UTC)
I think testing bots should not be done on the productive Wikidata, except in the sandbox.--Faux (talk) 17:04, 23 March 2013 (UTC)
It is not testing bots, but testing setups - as on wikipedia itself you will always have situations were you have to change something, modify setup of data, configuration and so on... at least that is what holds for me. Then I have to disagree because testing of bots is needed, e.g. in order to fullfill the bot flag request a given number (e.g. 250) of test edits have to be done. And there will in future clearly be other situations - as soon wikidata will be used frequently... Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 20:55, 23 March 2013 (UTC)
I mean ... it does not need to be something bot specific, what about general maintenance (for human users)? I would even more support such a property, that can be used if it is e.g. not clear yet what property to use, one has to be renamed, other name conflicts or anything else... --DrTrigon (talk) 20:59, 23 March 2013 (UTC)
Why not simply a sandbox property per datatype ? I do not see what harm can be done with that, as long as it is clear that it is a sandbox. --Zolo (talk) 21:29, 23 March 2013 (UTC)
Sounds good! (+1) Thanks for the idea! Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 22:41, 23 March 2013 (UTC)
Do you plan using that sandbox property only on sandbox/test items, or also on production items? --Faux (talk) 12:12, 24 March 2013 (UTC)
I do not see anything wrong in using it other items. It will not look very good, and if we can avoid using it too massively, that is better, but raw Wikidata items do not look very good anyhow. The important thing is that it does not unintendedly get transcluded to Wikipedias and other clients. And as long as they do not query sandbox statements, I see no reason for that to happen. --Zolo (talk) 12:22, 24 March 2013 (UTC)
So... are we done here, or for what are we waiting? ;) If you agree I would step forwards and create following 3 properties:
  1. Label: Sandbox-CommonsMediaFile / Description: Sandbox property for value of type "Commons Media File" / Data type: Commons Media File
  2. Label: Sandbox-Item / Description: Sandbox property for value of type "Item" / Data type: Item
  3. Label: Sandbox-String / Description: Sandbox property for value of type "String" / Data type: String
any comments or thoughts on this? Thanks and Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 10:52, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
Ok here we go:
  1. Sandbox-CommonsMediaFile (P368)
  2. Sandbox-Item (P369)
  3. Sandbox-String (P370)
so these can be considered done but I think it makes sence to propose the future ones too and set them to the pending page:
  • Label: Sandbox-Quantity / Description: Sandbox property for value of type "Quantity" / Data type: Quantity
  • (and all other data types to be introduced in future...)
Thanks for all your help! Greetings --DrTrigon (talk) 01:09, 30 March 2013 (UTC)

Physical constant (Value)

Template:Property proposal

  • Needs a better name and a precision cutoff in the case of irrational numbers (may depend on implementation). MER-C (talk) 13:04, 9 February 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support. I suggest physical constant --Paperoastro (talk) 13:34, 9 February 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support but I think we need a better name, because “value“ is already the name of the not-label-part of any property.--Svebert (talk) 20:48, 15 March 2013 (UTC)
"Quantity"? - Soulkeeper (talk) 14:25, 10 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment I think quantity is a good property on its own, but not for this one. I would propose something more along the lines of 'constant value'. If we can establish a better name than 'value' for it though, I can support this proposal. Joshbaumgartner (talk) 06:51, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support - but needs a different name. Why not "physical constant"? --Tobias1984 (talk) 07:25, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Strong support What about (en) constant/(de) Konstante/(fr) constante.
Template:Support needs to be renamed "Value of Physical constant" but we will also need "Units of physical constant" to specify what SI units the value is in (as a qualifier?) (unless there will be a data type with value and units). Filceolaire (talk) 18:52, 16 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support Renamed as per comments.--Micru (talk) 03:10, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

gyromagnatic ratio / gyromagnetisches Verhältnis/

Template:Property proposal

Template:Support clearly defined statistical value. Joshbaumgartner (talk) 06:51, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Decay width / zerfallsbreite

Template:Property proposal

Template:Support clearly defined statistical value. Joshbaumgartner (talk) 06:51, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

spectral line / Spektrallinie

Template:Property proposal

Discharge / Abfluss / Débit

Template:Property proposal

Support for m3/s. - Soulkeeper (talk) 14:28, 10 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support we will have to wait until numbers are available to see how to work out the units. Joshbaumgartner (talk) 06:51, 13 May 2013 (UTC)
comment should this be a general property Flow or Flow rate, with units->m3/s as a qualifier? Filceolaire (talk) 16:10, 17 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment in Wikipedia SI units are not used for many entries but it would be preferable if possible to gain data easily consistent with SI.–دوستدار ایران بزرگ (talk) 14:35, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
I think it is absolutely imperative that all data is stored in SI-units within the database to conserve data coherency. Conversion into non-SI units is easy enough to do. --Tobias1984 (talk) 14:45, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Template:TranslateThis

Template:Property proposal

Discussion
Template:Υπέρ Very useful. One more template that use it is the en:template:Infobox football biography .
Template:Comment Remember about units. That English template supports both meters and inches. --AVRS (talk) 14:55, 4 May 2013 (UTC)
We can have 2 different items: Height of person (m) and Height of person (in). Xaris333 (talk) 19:22, 5 May 2013 (UTC)
What about a "unit" qualifier and a constraint that the property should have it? Disclaimer: I don't know how usable it would be in Wikipedia templates. --AVRS (talk) 21:06, 5 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support No need to store two numbers, because one can be calculated from the other. Vinkje83 (talk) 10:02, 7 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment this is a useful property, but it clearly applies well beyond persons. I think the label should be changed from 'height of person' to simply 'height'; and its domain should be any item that has volume. Also, the allowed values should be any number greater than 0. Emw (talk) 03:04, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment I agree that this should just be rolled into a generic 'height' property. As the number datatype functionality is rolled out, we will see how we have to handle units. Joshbaumgartner (talk) 10:00, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Support - currently used by infoboxes on sporters, but also on certain objects I assume (towers, mountains, etc). Edoderoo (talk) 11:19, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
Template:Comment IMHO this should be of datatype "quantity". --Ricordisamoa 12:16, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
Does this really need a distinct property? The newly created Template:P property is rather strangely limited to just buildings, but I can't think of any reason why the height of a building is different from the height of an object which isn't a building or the height of a person. - Nikki (talk) 14:41, 10 September 2015 (UTC)
Range of possible values? --- Jura 15:13, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
Sorted to Person for discussion now that units are available. Josh Baumgartner (talk) 06:29, 29 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:O use Template:P. Josh Baumgartner (talk) 06:29, 29 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:O Per Josh Baumgartner. Casper Tinan (talk) 08:00, 29 September 2015 (UTC)
Template:Support a persons is not an object. --- Jura 08:10, 29 September 2015 (UTC)
Removed the hidden part. What's wrong with using Template:P? That's how the schema.org people seem to do it too. Multichill (talk) 19:30, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
Questions to ask might be: what is the purpose of the schema you mention? How frequently is it actually being used? How many people are using it? What is it being used for? If it's merely for meta discussion of schemes, it might not of any practical use. --- Jura 11:29, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
Template:O instead of answering my question, you as a new one. Use Template:P. Multichill (talk) 21:41, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
I'm not here to answer your questions, I'm just trying to figure out what you are trying to compare it with. --- Jura 22:12, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
Template:O per Josh Baumgartner - in German it's body height, height or size, so it would be co-resident Plagiat (talk) 11:50, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
  • The label shouldn't be an argument. You might just need to pick better translations. --- Jura 12:00, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
Template:O - agree that Template:P seems fine for this. It's not clear why we need one property for buildings and one for people (do we then also need one for statues, one for mountains, one for horses...) Andrew Gray (talk) 21:57, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
Template:Ping: range of possible values is different. --- Jura 22:12, 4 October 2015 (UTC)
Surely we could handle this with a constraint report? eg/ [if P31:Q5 and Pxxx > 3m then report an error]? Andrew Gray (talk) 18:06, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
Unfortunately not. Special:ConstraintReport requires distinct properties. --- Jura 18:34, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
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