View source for Testwiki:Project chat/Archive/2019/07

{{Talkarchive}}

== request merger ==

Sorry to ask, but I need to do this infrequently: could someone merge {{Q|56356221}} into {{Q|13221551}}? -- [[User:AnonMoos|AnonMoos]] ([[User talk:AnonMoos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:41, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

: Done. [[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:59, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:46, 4 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Items merge ==

Please merge Q3766879 and Q3107110. Thanks! --[[Special:Contributions/151.95.23.253|151.95.23.253]] 21:22, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
* to be more readable: {{Q|3766879}} and {{Q|3107110}}. - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:35, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
* {{Merged}} --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:47, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:47, 4 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Please add [[:ko:기독교 정교회]] to {{Q|3333484}} ==

Please add [[:ko:기독교 정교회]] to {{Q|3333484}}{{unsigned|2001:2d8:e52d:9af6::ba08:1f00|15:55, 5 July 2019}}

: Done by [[User:UnifyKorea|UnifyKorea]]. --[[User:Ksc~ruwiki|Ksc~ruwiki]] ([[User talk:Ksc~ruwiki|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:18, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=--[[User:Ksc~ruwiki|Ksc~ruwiki]] ([[User talk:Ksc~ruwiki|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:18, 5 July 2019 (UTC)}}
== duplicates from BD Gest' import ==

It looks as though a recent MnM import for {{P|5491}}, circa 28 May, may have created a number of duplicate items.

The database has separate IDs for pseudonyms, eg [https://www.bedetheque.com/auteur-50932-BD-Loew-Flaxman.html], identified as such in the fiche and linked to other entries for each author.  New items seem to have been created via MnM for pseudonyms that MnM could not name-match to Wikidata authors.  

I've found quite a few of these on [[Wikidata:Database_reports/identical_birth_and_death_dates/1|the report page for people with matching dates of birth and death]]; but this will only catch authors who are (i) dead, and (ii) have full (day-specific) dates of birth and death.

Duplicates may also have been created where the name in the database was not an exact match for name(s) we have here; but these may be harder to catch.

I have a bit too much to do at the moment to go in in depth and clean this up, so if somebody could step in and sort it out I would be grateful.  [[User:Jheald|Jheald]] ([[User talk:Jheald|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:34, 23 June 2019 (UTC)

:Came across a somewhat similar problem with {{P|5357}} as the encyclopedia too has separate entries for pseudonyms and pen names (though they are often little more than "pen name used by author X"). Which led me to wonder in which cases it might make sense to create separate items for such pseudonyms and pen names. I guess for pen names used by just one person it's not necessarily neeeded, but we'd need to have a way to model which pseudonym the ID refers to. But there are also pen names shared by several authors or owned by a publisher, where I think it might be better to create separate items. --[[User:Kam Solusar|Kam Solusar]] ([[User talk:Kam Solusar|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:30, 23 June 2019 (UTC)
:: A {{P|P5168}} qualifier can be added to the identifier statement. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:58, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
:::{{re|Ghouston}} Thanks.  I'd been adding {{P|1810}} to the multiples I was finding.  I can see that P5168 is useful as a qualifier for eg {{P|138}}, but I somewhat prefer P1810 for identifiers because for many identifiers people add it anyway for all items. [[User:Jheald|Jheald]] ([[User talk:Jheald|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:29, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
:::{{re|Kam Solusar}} Agreed that for eg house pseudonyms shared by multiple authors, or eg {{Q|Q190529}}, in such circumstances it may well make sense to have a particular item.  But not sure how one would link eg both the house pseudonym item and the actual author item in a {{P|50}} statement.  The usual {{P|1932}} used to indicate the pseudonym that an author used for a book lets one specify a string, but not an item. [[User:Jheald|Jheald]] ([[User talk:Jheald|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:38, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
::::{{re|Jheald}} We also have the same problem with ghostwriters. There are a few discussions involving the topic of ghostwriters in the past ([[Archive/2017/11#Ghostwriting academic and academic papers written by ghostwriters|1]], [[Wikidata:Project_chat/Archive/2018/12#Credited to Vs. real author|2]], [[Wikidata:Project_chat/Archive/2019/03#Rank for fictitious authors listed alongside actual authors of a paper|3]]) but there doesn't seem to be a good way to model that situation yet. --[[User:Kam Solusar|Kam Solusar]] ([[User talk:Kam Solusar|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:52, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
:::::{{re|Kam Solusar}} Presumably, use {{P|50}} = <code><item></code>, with qualifiers {{P|3831}} = {{Q|Q623386}} and {{P|1480}} = "uncredited", listing the authors that are credited on the title page in the order that they appear first, before any additional uncredited (but sourced) authors.  [[User:Jheald|Jheald]] ([[User talk:Jheald|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:31, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
::::::{{re|Jheald}} That would work in most cases. But I think we might run into similar problems as with the pen names, as we don't have a good way to directly link the ghostwriter and the credited person. In the most common case where we have one ghostwriter and one credited person, we can infer the connection. But there are probably other cases involving multiple persons where it might not be that easy. Seeing as people creating something in someone else's name also exist in other arts like movies ({{Q|734916}}), music, etc.,  maybe we need a new property to properly model these kinds of relationships. --[[User:Kam Solusar|Kam Solusar]] ([[User talk:Kam Solusar|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:01, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikimedia Space ==

Forwarding here since no one else has done it yet: Wikimedia Space is a new <q>platform for movement news and conversations</q>. See the [https://space.wmflabs.org/2019/06/25/introducing-wikimedia-space-a-platform-for-movement-news-and-conversations/ announcement] for more information. --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:56, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

: Personally, one way I can see this being useful for Wikidata is as a place for discussion or announcement of changes to the Wikidata data model that are especially relevant to other wikis. For example, I imagine that the recent-ish narrowing of [[Property:P143]]’s scope from “imported from” to “imported from Wikimedia project” could have simplified a lot of other wikis’ Lua modules (to determine whether a reference is a Wikimedia reference, you no longer have to look at the value of the P143, its presence is enough), but I’m not aware of a good place where this change could have been communicated to them (flooding all the {{Q|Q16503}} or {{Q|Q4582194}} pages via MassMessage might have been excessive). That’s not to say there wasn’t a solution for this before, but perhaps the Wikimedia Space can be part of an improved version? --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:56, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

*So, will there WMDE staff moderating it too? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 10:32, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

== How to handle a page move which led to a new article ==

{{Q|13644820}} was originally a list article, but someone on English Wikipedia moved the old article to create a new one. Three other wikis followed suit; two did not.

Can someone familiar with the process explain how we can split this? 

Thanks. [[User:Magog the Ogre|Magog the Ogre]] ([[User talk:Magog the Ogre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:47, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

:Presuming  you're satisfied that the three 'articles' are now Articles rather than lists with a more detailed header, then the solution is to create a new item for Marvel Games, delete Marvel Games sitelinks from the list item and add them to the new article item. The subtelty is that those language wiki pages wikidata classifies as a list do not necessarily have to have a title starting 'List of ...'. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:20, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
:: {{Ping|Magog the Ogre}} You didn't say what your problem is. I find the articles close enough if there is no other that better represent the game publisher. Leaving as is should be fine? It is however a problem that the WD item start to get conflicting properties attached to it.
:: In my personal opinion every "list of ..." should not be [[Wikidata:Notability|notable for wikidata]]. Is this "list itself" notable other than as a Wp article? IMHO turning the item into the actual publisher and make each game a separate item makes sense. Extracting the list from WD when needed should be better than maintaining an actual list. --[[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:46, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
:::Jagulin, possibly you overlook that sitelinks on wikidata items are the mechanism by which interwiki links are provided to wiki articles. For this reason, there is not really any question as to whether any list or article on a wiki is 'notable for wikidata'. They all are, so that interwiki links can be provided. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:03, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
::::OK, I created a new item. Why is the interfacing not allowing me to enter the title in other languages? [[User:Magog the Ogre|Magog the Ogre]] ([[User talk:Magog the Ogre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:39, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
:::::You probably need to do something with Babel - https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Help:Navigating_Wikidata/User_Options#Babel_extension --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:49, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
::::: {{Ping|Magog the Ogre}} Adding new item {{Q|Q64918019}} here for reference. You may want to have {{P|P1889}} statement to make sure they are not merged easily. There is [[Help:Split an item]] that may have been what you asked for, as a way to clone an object and move labels. Babel is good when you have several languages you want in the overview. If you occasionally want another language, there is a link below the label box to get all, saying "All entered languages" in English. Unfortunately it doesn't show language that is completely empty. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:53, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

::: {{Ping|Tagishsimon}} I did not overlook interwiki. When assigning the enWp "company with list of products" article into a separate item from "list of products, only briefly hinting the company" you will not get interwiki links between them. If there is no other article for the company, I see no error in leaving the list as the interwiki link. Seeing the [[Wikidata:Interwiki_conflicts|complaints coming in]] I believe there is soon a request to merge the items just for this reason. If there is no "real world" notability for the list itself, each Wp should better adapt to the more notable concept. I know anything that have a Wp link is [[Wikidata:Notability|notable for wikidata]] according to #1, but when solving conflicts I think we should promote going for #2 instead. No consensus perhaps, but something to consider. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:53, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

== Interwiki conflicts ==

Where is the Interwiki conflicts workflow documented? How many are usually working with the backlog? Is there an inter-language community group to explain language differences and suggest how to make those differences known on other Wikipedia language variants?

[[Wikidata:Notability]] mentions two main goals, but I feel WD documentation may need to shift to not get stuck on the inter-language-goal. There are three main criteria, the first gets most attention but the others show that the Wikipedia article structure isn't the rule for WD. [[Wikidata:Interwiki_conflicts]] gives three example types of conflict. As far as I see, only the first type (duplicate items) is a possible WD problem. The other problem would be when WD isn't granular enough to have each needed item. Most complaints to "interwiki conflicts" doesn't seem to say anything about which wikis that are in conflict, just pointing out two WD items that I suppose they think should be merged. Most cases (still in the backlog, I guess the easy merges are filtered quickly) to me seems to be a matter of how the local Wp should relate to WD structure, rather than WD to adapt. Did I misunderstand the goals?

An important part of validity of data and the notability criteria are source references. I see very little discussion and requesting of sources when one decides to link an article to an item. When merging, nothing other than personal decision seems to be required, no consensus or referenced sources? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:10, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
: {{Ping|Liuxinyu970226}} Can you assist with some of these questions? Thanks! [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:57, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

== Inverse constraint question P1029 ==

P1029 (Crew member) seems to be used to designate participants in spaceflight missions. It appears to have an inverse constraint of P5096 (member of the crew of).

However standard practice on data on astronaut/cosmonaut pages seems to be to use P450 (astronaut mission) to list their flights. Perhaps to avoid the constraint warnings or need for data duplication, this should be looked at.
[[User:CanadianCodhead|CanadianCodhead]] ([[User talk:CanadianCodhead|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:08, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
== We need a convention how a Wikidata external property context is explained for an end user ==

We are testing displaying Wikidata Properties of type External in a template on sv:Wikipedia 

see [https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anv%C3%A4ndare:Salgo60/sandl%C3%A5da/Wikidatalight test page Wikidatalight]

To make it more user friendly we try to find the Wikipedia page that explains the "external property context"
* version 3 use {{P|1629}} with fallback to english article
* version 3B use {{P|2378}}

Example of Wikidata Properties of type External
* {{P|1902}}
** has {{P|1629}} {{Q|19884154}} with no article explaining what Spotify artist ID is. I guess an article about [[:en:Spotify]] is good enough
** {{P|2378}} is missing
* {{P|2397}}
** {{P|2378}} has {{Q|866}} with article [[:en:YouTube]]
– [[User:Salgo60|Salgo60]] ([[User talk:Salgo60|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:10, 29 June 2019 (UTC)

*In general, it should be the {{P|1629}}. 
:For external identifiers, maybe it's COALESCE(?P1629value, ?P2378value) .. 
:Obviously, if you prefer items that have a Wikipedia article in a specific language, you might need to come up with a longer chain. By default, you could also link the property talk page, which does provide some information. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 17:26, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
*First check whether there's a {{P|1629}} with sitelinks to svwiki or enwiki, if there's none then go with {{P|2378}}. If there's still no linked article, link to the Wikidata property discussion. If enough people understand the system they will provide missing {{P|2378}} for items like {{P|1629}}.
: I see in that list that you use an always the same icon. When available it might be nice to use the icon that's specific in the Wikidata property/{{P|1629}}/{{P|2378}}. That might encourage people in general to add more icons. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 09:56, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

== weather properties ==

Hi, which property may I use to expres weather concepts like {{q|Q11466}} or {{q|Q1148989}} related with places, like natural àreas, deserts or just cities?. The {{p|P2076}} is mandatory as qualifiers in chemical or biological reactions. The recently created {{P|P6591}} is, by definition, only vàlid as a "maximus". IMHO, a lost opportunity to have a more flexible property, just naming it "temperature" or "remarkable temerature" + {{P|P1013}} with {{q|Q10578722}} / {{q|Q202785}} /{{q|Q10585806}} etc. Any suggestion will be wellcomed. Thanks, [[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:17, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
: I don't see why {{P|P2076}} should not be useful for places or different from a chemical temperature. It does however say "Use only as a qualifier to indicate at what temperature something took place" and I don't know what the {{P|P1629}} means. {{Q|Q560}} does use temp, in a clear context. {{Q|Q97}} has two temperatures, but as you see they don't really make any sense since there are no further clarifications. When, where and how? As subject, {{Q|Q909741}} sounds promising, but I don't see it much used and there is a difference between measured and calculated temperatures. 
: {{P|P6591}} was [[Wikidata:Property_proposal/temperature_record|discussed first]], though I agree that "extreme" or "remarkable temperature" would be a more general idea. I would suggest that it at least had "when where how" as a recommended qualifier. The ability to set constraints is a reason to not use {{P|P2076}} directly, I suppose. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:17, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
::Thanks, {{re|Jagulin}} I understand that temperature may be A) the "cause" or the "condition" that anything happens, or B) a result of something to document. For instance, ''"the forest fire started because the temperature rose to 45°C with a humidity of only 20%. The intensity of the fire produced temperatures up to 600ºC that destroyed several farms"''. It is, cause/condition and resultant temp. So, I agree with two different properties. The {{p|P2076}} is to expres the necessary conditions or cause to get an event, and is correct as a qualifier. The other (P6591 ?) should be able to record what temperature got (or we use to have...in a place); it must be use as a property to be able to have qualifiers ( "when where how"). The [[Wikidata:Property_proposal/temperature_record|P6591 discussion]] was near "irregular". Only two days and 1 support to get approved. When I created properties, was not so easy.....
::What do you propose ?. Try to modify P6591 ?. Try to create a "B) temperature" and let P6591 as a "property for trivial game" ?. Thanks, again. [[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:06, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::: {{ping|Amadalvarez}} Let me clarify that I'm not experienced with WD structure decisions, I was just responding from a general perspective. Sorry for not finding an obvious suggestion for you.
::: Causality is sometimes difficult to judge. As far as I see, it's not built into {{P|P2076}} at all (see instead {{P|P828}}). It however says that it should be "qualifier" only, an added information to another statement. If you have a temperature for the {{q|Q1148989}}, you should use the qualifier to register that. If the temperature itself is "the statement" it should not be in the qualifier but set as a "property". Maybe {{P|P2052}} can be changed to allow also use as property, I don't know why it was restricted.
::: {{ping|Manu1400|ديفيد عادل وهبة خليل 2|Jura1}} You were involved in the {{P|P6591}} creation process. I see that it is "subproperty" of {{P|P2076}}, which may be against the intention of that? Can you share your view of making it more general, using a mandatory {{P|P1013}} to mark the type of extreme? Instead of adding the "minimum ..." counterpart it would allow a more flexible use of the property. Is it against WD data design guidelines, making it more complicated? Did you use it somewhere to show how it's meant to be used? In {{Q|Q1397}} it has no specific location and no clarification how it was measured. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:17, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Thanks {{ping|Jagulin}} to invite P6591 participants. Look my answer to Jura; probably talking about the specific case make easier to understand it and find a reasonable solution. [[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:56, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
*If you want to add something "remarkable" about the weather and don't quite know what, there is {{P|4150}}. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 11:53, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:: That is for measurement series, I believe. In general I think WD idea is not to merely reference external data, but rather annotate it in graph structure. Otherwise creating a table for every location is a good idea if there is no external database to reference directly. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:09, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::It's neither external nor necessarily for series. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 15:20, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:* Thank, {{re|Jura1}}. Tabular-data is not what I'm looking for. I do not have sources of mass data nor plan to upload historical series. 
:*In the cawiki "[[:ca:template:indret|infobox for natural spots]]", used for parks, lakes, deserts, seas, etc., we have a few "historical" manual parameters related with temp. I try to find the way to get them from WD, and I need a "quantity property" that can be use -with qualifiers- to expres "when, where and how", as {{u'|Jagulin}} well described. Nowadays are: <code>year average temperature</code>, <code>atmospheric temperature range</code>, <code>water temperature</code> (for {{q|Q177380}}). I just want to eliminate the manual information moving it to WD and help editors to enter information in WD instead via manual parameters. 
:*If we had a flexible formula, we probable will used for any other temperature data. I red [[Property talk:P6591]] and I believe it may become a more useful property if we manage it as many other dimension properties, as:
::*{{P|P1082}}+{{P|585}}+{{P|459}} (ex.:[[Q62#P1082]])
::*{{P|4511}}+{{P|1013}} (ex.:[[Q97#P4511]])
::*{{P|2044}}+{{P|518}} (ex.:[[Q12514#P2044]])
:Do you think we can reorient the P6591 and harmonize its ontology with this others?. Thanks, [[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:56, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
*In general, a property should be usable without reading all qualifiers. I find the use of P2044 somewhat problematic. 
:<s>P6591</s> is meant to store things like average and min/max temperature for every month in a year for a given location. What it actually stores is defined on Commons. The idea is that it would be too much data for Wikibase to handle directly in Wikidata. You don't need to store as much at once as it was done for NY. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 17:03, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Sorry, yes, it should read {{P|4150}} not P6591. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:32, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{ping|Jura1}} I think the numbers got mixed up in your reply. Did you mean {{P|1013}} as problematic and {{P|4150}} for the temperature series?
:: "a property should be usable without reading all qualifiers" may be a good guiding idea. Can you point to any documentation of it for further understanding of reason and exceptions? The "qualifier" system is certainly adding value but you say that it's only meant for "useless" details?
:: Seeing that {{P|1013}} is widely used, could you give some examples of what makes it problematic? The problem I can see is that it is difficult to document, thus less obvious for anyone to apply this "property". On the other hand I think having lots of properties with very specific is also making it difficult to use them properly. And {{P|4150}} is also not very obvious how to use the first time.
:: Even having {{P|1013}} with "maximum" as in [[Q80294#P2107]], seems to me like a fair use. The property is specific and the qualifier clarifies it. Is it problematic?
:: {{ping|Amadalvarez}} Would it be possible for you to try {{P|4150}} in an example and learn more of the benefits and problems of it? Maybe it works well, otherwise it helps you to find arguments for a set of new, specific properties as is said to be the norm. Also see [[Wikidata:Property proposal/average yearly temperature|discussions]] (perhaps to find other users interested in the topic). 
:: Thank you all for an interesting chat. I will now leave it all to you. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:05, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::{{ping|Jagulin}}I did not propose the use of P4150. In fact, There is [https://w.wiki/5Xg only 3 items] with this property. So, it doesn't seem too much popular. In the [[Wikidata:Property proposal/average yearly temperature|discussion you linked]] (thanks), they talked about have a full series of climate and, finally, they created P4150. This references to external tracking events, probably may be solved with data stored on Commons. I don't know, but it was their decission and, today [[Special:ListProperties/tabular-data|only 3 properties]] have been created that add 16 items among them.
:::Apart from that, I just want discrete values of something so usual as temperature in a place. Likely we have {{P|P1082}} without having all the census month by month segmented by sex, profession, origin, incomes level, etc. etc. as it appears in official agencies. Thanks for your contributions. [[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:56, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{ping|Jura1}} I find it interesting the doubts expressed by Jagulin; surely your answer would help us a lot. Additionally I affirm that the use of qualifiers to determine "when, where and how" for each one of the values, are not problematic. Qualifiers such as {{P|459}}, {{P|1013}} or {{P|518}} allow us to handle the multi-values of the properties. Obviously, the name of the property should not be too generic, except for the wildcard properties like P2670 or P793 that have saved us from creating hundreds of ultra-specific properties.
::Speaking specifically on the P6591: his name is, right now, excessively specific. It is legitimate?, yes, but it would require creating as many properties as variants that someone could imagine (maximum, minimum, average, season of the year, etc.). Many of these combinations, or are not very useful or have few real values, therefore, I think they should not be admitted. I guess you'll agree on this point. Your last answer declares "P6591 is meant to store things like average and min / max temperature". I am with you in the concept and the scope. I wish to interpret that we will modify its name and its definition. Thanks. If you don't mind, I can incorporate the key points of this conversation in the Talk: P6591 to describe the change and ask for opinions in the new scope. I look forward to your reply, [[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:09, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I mixed the property ids. It should read {{P|4150}}. A more general property than {{P|6591}} was discussed in [[Wikidata:Property_proposal/average_yearly_temperature]] and thought to be problematic. So no, re-purposing {{P|6591}} to get there isn't a good idea. Do you see any problems with the data as entered? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:32, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
*BTW, reminds me of [[phab:T147049]]. Maybe an update by the devs could help you. I think the general idea is that tabular data should be accessible on query server. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:32, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

::::Thanks, {{re|Jura1}} if you say that P6591 is questionable, I forgot my suggestions. I build infoboxes, so I think in terms of recovery full information about something, doesn't matter if it is in on item, in one monovalue property or in a multivalue property with several qualifiers to understand what each value means and represents. To me, tabular data is difficult to recover, because I get info via cawiki LUA module:wikidata and I do a few SPARQL queries. I think (may be I'm wrong), tabular data are no directly recoverable as the data value of properties. In addition, I don't need to work with series, by now. If, finally, do not delete the P6591, please consider to carry on with this discussion, thanks.[[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:57, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

== Editing and discussions ==

I've been contributing to WD "by hand" for a few days now. Maybe more advanced users have a tool-assisted set up, but I'd like to share some impressions from a "new user" perspective. 
* There is a "quick insert tool box" below the editor in edit mode. It's mostly made up of symbols. I've been missing <nowiki>{{Ping|}}</nowiki> or <nowiki>{{re|}}</nowiki> for discussions. Even more important should be <nowiki>{{Q|}}</nowiki>  and <nowiki>{{P|}}</nowiki> - or some kind of subst to handle either case. How to go about suggesting additions to the set? Or is there a plugin to be used?
* Discussion pages for items rarely draw enough attention to have discussions started. Seems to be the case for help pages as well. Is the rule to have all discussion in the chat or are there certain things to be discussed on the item talk page? Maybe the talk page should be dedicated to tool output and all discussion redirected to chat? Having a search pull out all mention of the item so one knows if there has been consensus made already?

Editing WD is one thing, but learning the procedures and seeking assistance or consensus involves discussions. Making this more efficient can help improve WD overall. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:35, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:The edit tools below the editor are set at [[Template:Edit tools]], but they require an admin to mark the version for translation before it goes live. --[[User:Yair rand|Yair rand]] ([[User talk:Yair rand|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:28, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{Done}} --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:25, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Thanks! I was just going to ask if it was possible to test the change in a sandbox, but I've now tested it live. Works great! There is a space before <nowiki></charinsert></nowiki> that I don't think is relevant, but it doesn't seem to have any effect so no problem. 
::: Was there opposition for including Ping, or was I just not fast enough? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:41, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

== River became a mathematical object last night ==

By the magic of some mysterious edits, it seems that {{Q|Q4022}} became a subclass of « history » last night, and is currently a subclass of mathematical objects. I just hope this was good faith edits. <span style="border: 1px #C9C9C9;"><span style="background-color:#E8E8E8;padding:3px;">author&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:#FFFFFF;">&nbsp;[[User:TomT0m|TomT0m]] / </span>talk [[User talk:TomT0m|page]]</span> 19:41, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
: This morning it's mysteriously gone. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:26, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:: You awoke my interest... I see no trace of this in the item history and you talk about mysteries. Was it vandalism that have been hidden in history or would you think it was some kind of bug in the underlying database? Or write it off as a misunderstanding in the first place, if nobody else noticed? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:48, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Probably refers to the addition of {{Q|Q12799272}} to {{Q|Q355304}}, where the former is a mathematical object. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:47, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata Graph Builder - where can I find a description of the parameters? ==

I sometimes use [https://angryloki.github.io/wikidata-graph-builder/ Wikidata Graph Builder] tool, but I have '''not been able to find any description''' of the parameters in general and ''Iterations'' and ''Limit'' in particular. I understand that they can be used to limit the result, but what are the ''exact'' function of these two parameters? Can anyone please enlighten me? --[[User:Larske|Larske]] ([[User talk:Larske|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:44, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

== Bad constraint error ==

On {{q|Q14823309}} there is a bogus constraint error, because the image file name includes the string "map". Is this a worthwhile trade-off, or should the constraint be removed? <span class="vcard"><span class="fn">[[User:Pigsonthewing|Andy Mabbett]]</span> (<span class="nickname">Pigsonthewing</span>); [[User talk:Pigsonthewing|Talk to Andy]]; [[Special:Contributions/Pigsonthewing|Andy's edits]]</span> 14:48, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
: The regex includes a word boundary before "map". If it also included a word boundary after "map", there would be fewer false positives. But it is somewhat strange to constraint based on a file name which can be in any language. --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:58, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::It's a very hopeful constraint; I've seen a complaint that it gets annoyed with any .*poster.* which is not affixed to a film item, because theatre posters don't exist. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:54, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

== Politico y aristócrata chileno José Nicolás de la Cerda <=>  político y aristócrata chileno José Nicolás de la Cerda de Santiago Concha ==

[[Q5944300|José Nicolás de la Cerda de Santiago Concha]] and [[Q5944298|José Nicolás de la Cerda]] are looking awfully like duplicates to me, but a merge is blocked by two different Spanish wiki articles. Also, the birth dates are (slightly) off. If anyone from Spanish wiki could have a look that would be great. [[User:Moebeus|Moebeus]] ([[User talk:Moebeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:58, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
*It seems: same parents, same public offices, same POB/POD. I'd use [[User:Matěj_Suchánek/markasduplicate.js]] and let eswiki figure it out. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:04, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Posting a note at [[Wikidata:Café]] is a good way to find a Spanish speaker to help out. —[[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:21, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
::I have merged the two articles, waiting for a sysop to proceed with history merge. As of the birth dates, I couldn't find any source to indicate which one is the correct. [[User:Esteban16|Esteban16]] ([[User talk:Esteban16|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:04, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Done now. [[User:Esteban16|Esteban16]] ([[User talk:Esteban16|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:39, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:29, 8 July 2019 (UTC)}}
== [[w:English As She Is Spoke|English As She Is Spoke]] ==

I was editing the entry for [[Q48314|Battle of Waterloo (Q48314)]] and was surprised to see an "English" and "British English" entry. I have trawled the archive to this page and came up with these discussions:
*[[Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2014/10#What to do when British English is used in title or description?]]
*[[Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2012/11#Idea to reduce blank labels for English varients (and other language varients)]]
*[[Wikidata:Project_chat/Archive/2012/12#English_variants]]
*[[Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2016/05#English]]

The ignorance of some of the contributors to the previous conversations are surprising, how for example can someone not be aware that there is a dialect of English called [[w:Indian English]]? I find the discussions surprising and some of the comments bigoted, particularly as these were issues addressed more than 10 years before the first archive entry above and was settled inclusively and harmoniously.

Either the two outliers English-GB and English-CA need to be scrapped, or all of the different types of English need to be included. This includes the English used in the USA at the UN and within the EU. (The English used by the UN and EU are different but based on variants of British English).

As has been pointed out in the previous conversations English on Wikipedia is dialect neutral until a dialect word is introduced at which point that dialect spelling or word becomes the default version of the language used for that subject.

It is not as if the data within articles often provides this information:
*[[w:Apollo 11]]: [[w:Template:Use American English]]
*[[w:London]]: [[w:Template:Use British English]]
*[[w:Mumbai]]: [[w:Template:Use Indian English]]
*[[w:Tasman Sea]] [[w:Template:Use Australian English]]
*[[w:United Nations]] [[w:Template:Use British English Oxford spelling]]
Or in the case of some where the version of English is obvious to native speakers, other templates that can be indicative for machine reading:
*[[w:Auckland]] [[w:Template:New Zealand topics]]

There is a list of the use English dialect templates at [[w:template:Use X English]]. If there seem to be too many consider using [[w:Use Commonwealth English]] and incorporate into that all the other dialects apart from American and Canadian English.

This is supposed to be a database project, adding or removing attributes ought to be easy, why has this issue not been addressed?

-- [[User:PBS|PBS]] ([[User talk:PBS|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:33, 19 June 2019 (UTC)
: We probably should add more types of English labels; there are 12 variants of Chinese available here. Though written (and spoken) Chinese probably varies considerably more than English does. To see the list of available languages for labels, try creating a new item and look at the language dropdown. The process of adding languages to the list however is a bit complex right now. Items do exist for {{Q|7976}} and other varieties though. [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:22, 19 June 2019 (UTC)

:There was a ''very'' sparsely attended RFC on this way back in 2013 - [[Wikidata:Requests for comment/Labels and descriptions in language variants]]. My personal feeling is that we should just get rid of English variants. It can very occasionally defuse an argument in some items, but in practice it's just more maintenance overhead 99.99% of the time. [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:18, 19 June 2019 (UTC)

:Thanks for writing this! I agree that more variants should be supported. I'll be happy to support requests for that. --[[User:Marsupium|Marsupium]] ([[User talk:Marsupium|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:44, 21 June 2019 (UTC)

I guess this has been said before, but: I'm ''glad'' this issue hasn't been "definitively resolved", that it doesn't receive much debate, that an RFC on it was "sparsely attended".  Truly, labels (and descriptions) on Wikidata are secondary, just for convenience.  (Because obviously doing everything based on raw Q numbers would be a nightmare.) But we don't have to get wrapped around the axle trying to find the "right" label or description, or complaining that some entity has the "wrong" label -- and this is as it should be.  (The Wikipedias get wrapped around this particular axle all the time, in part because of their visibility, in part becaue of the requirement that each article have exactly one title.  I'm really glad Wikidata doesn't have that problem.) --[[User:scs|scs]] 11:05, 26 June 2019 (UTC) <small>[My point is that distinguishing between British vs. Canadian vs. American vs. Australian vs. Indian English -- important though the issue can be in some contexts -- is just really small potatoes here.]</small>
:The IETF shares your attitude, and uses a "the shorter spelling wins" rule&mdash;as a joke, no centre in RFCs, centers will do.{{=)}} Of course copying an enwiki SHORTDESC, even it uses en-GB spelling, should be okay. &ndash;[[Special:Contributions/84.46.52.13|84.46.52.13]] 12:31, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== Featured pictures ==

On the subject of images, shouldn't we allow "featured picture" or "Valued image" as a reference type? [[User:Adam Cuerden|Adam Cuerden]] ([[User talk:Adam Cuerden|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:49, 24 June 2019 (UTC)

: {{ping|Adam Cuerden}} so after a bit of investigation, I think the best option here seems to be a {{P|P3831}} qualifier - it's currently used in various places, though [https://query.wikidata.org/#select%20%3Fvalue%20%3FvalueLabel%20%28count%28distinct%20%3Fps%29%20as%20%3Fuses%29%20where%0A%7B%0A%3Fitem%20p%3AP18%20%3Fps%20.%20%3Fps%20pq%3AP3831%20%3Fvalue%20.%0A%20%20SERVICE%20wikibase%3Alabel%20%7B%20bd%3AserviceParam%20wikibase%3Alanguage%20%22%5BAUTO_LANGUAGE%5D%2Cen%22.%20%7D%20%20%0A%7D%20group%20by%20%3Fvalue%20%3FvalueLabel about 500 image statements have one]. It's a bit cryptically named, though....
:So we'd add this qualifier to the image statement, and give it a value similar to {{Q|28801937}} (there is currently no item describing the concept of a "featured picture", but it would be straightforward to create one). Add a reference (to the FP discussion?) and bang, we're done.
:A couple of caveats, though - firstly, this wouldn't be able to differentiate between Commons FPs or Wikipedia FPs (or which Wikipedia, for that matter) since we can't put qualifiers on qualifiers. If you wanted to do that, you'd probably need items for "Dutch WP featured image" and "Commons featured image" and so on.
:Secondly, you'd have to add these qualifiers to each appearance of the image - although that would probably be an easy job for a maintenance bot. 
:In general, I don't see any reason not to do this - it's useful contextual information, and I can easily imagine that someone would be interested in being able to say "if there are several images, use the FP" or similar. Ultimately, it might be that the Commons linked data project (which is oriented towards information about ''that exact file'') would be able to handle it better. But perhaps the two approaches could complement. [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:09, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
::On commons FP can be certified nonsense, just tweak the "scope" until only one file fits. &ndash;[[Special:Contributions/84.46.52.13|84.46.52.13]] 15:38, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata Bridge: edit Wikidata’s data from Wikipedia infoboxes ==

Hello all,

I’m happy to announce that the  '''[[mw:Wikidata Bridge|Wikidata Bridge]]''' project (you may have heard about before under the name “client editing”) started. The goal of this project is to offer a way to Wikipedia editors to edit Wikidata’s data more easily. This will be achieved by an interface, connected to the infoboxes, that users can access directly from their local wiki. 

The project is now at an early stage of development. A lot of [[mw:Wikidata_Bridge/Research|user research]] has been done, and will continue to be done through the different phases of the project. The next steps of [[mw:Wikidata_Bridge/Development|development]] will be achieved by the development team working at Wikimedia Deutschland, starting now until the end of 2019.

Here’s the planned timeline:
* From June to August, we will build the setup and technical groundwork. 
* From September to November 2019, we will develop the first version of the feature and publish a test system so you can try it and give feedback. 
* Later on, we will test the feature on a few projects, in collaboration with the communities. 
** We will first focus on early adopters communities who already implemented a shortcut from their infoboxes to edit Wikidata (for example Russian, Catalan, Basque Wikipedias)
** but we also welcome also communities who [[mw:Wikidata_Bridge/Get_involved|volunteer to be part of the first test round]]. 
** Then we will reach some of the big Wikipedias (French, German, English) in order to see if the project scales and to address their potentially different needs. 
** Even later, we can consider enabling the feature on all the other projects. 

On Wikidata, from the technical side, not much will change. When the feature to edit Wikidata’s data from Wikipedia will be implemented, a tag for edits coming from Wikidata Bridge will be added, so the Wikidata editors can watch and filter these edits more easily.

If you want to get involved, there are several ways to help:
** Help translating [[mw:Wikidata_Bridge|the documentation pages]]
** Follow the [[mw:Wikidata_Bridge/Updates|updates]] and participate in [[mw:Topic:V1x2lxtu8rgi954a|the first feedback loop]]
** If you’re also active on a Wikipedia project, feel free to reach them and help answering their questions about Wikidata
** Discuss the specific Wikidata-related topics or issues on [[Wikidata:Wikidata Bridge]]

If you have any questions, feel free to ask them here or on the [[mw:Talk:Wikidata_Bridge|on the dedicated talk page]]. 

Cheers, [[User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:05, 24 June 2019 (UTC)

:Hi Lea.  Some thoughts and questions.  First up, this is called a bridge, but it seems more like a shield -- trying to shield Wikipedia editors from the fact that it is Wikidata they are editing by not showing the Wikidata item, but instead a pop-up dialogue.
:According to the pitch ([[:mw:Wikidata_Bridge#The need]]), Wikipedia communities currently find issues over {{tq|"lack of control over the data, not enough information about when and where the information is updated, differences in the way Wikipedias and Wikidata structure information"}}.
:It's not clear how the shield will help this.  If information is not stored in the wikitext of wikipedia pages, bad edits on Wikidata (which will continue to be possible whether or not the shield is present) will continue to show as vandalism in infoboxes, without there having been any change to the wikitext, or any change in the page-history or in watchlists (if Wikidata notifications have been turned off).  The shield if anything seems ''less'' apparent where information is held and updated, since its intention is to hide wikidata pages from casual editors.  And there will continue to be differences in the way Wikipedias and Wikidata structure information, since for item-valued properties only a drop-down/autocomplete list of items will be available, rather than the free-text Wikipedia editors expect.  There also remains the issue that most vandal-fighting and batch-editing power tools on Wikipedia are based on wikitext, which wikidata-based fields in infoboxes and templates will continue to sit apart from.
:That's not to say that the shielded edit-interface may not be a good thing in its own terms for casual editors -- more accessible, more immediate, less scary than being thrown into a wikidata page; so the initiative I think is quite welcome.  But when communities say {{tq|I want the information that appears on Wikipedia to be editable on Wikipedia}}, it's not just the accessibility issue by/for casual editors that that sentiment is code for.
:With luck more causual accessibility will mean easier good edits.  But the point made by Vojtěch Dostál on the mw talk page is significant: it will also mean easier bad edits and easier vandalism, including quite subtle vandalism that may be hard to pick up (eg minor falsifications of physical constants, and other statement values that may be deliberately wrong, but not wildly implausibly so).  His idea of requiring editors to be autoconfirmed before they can make shield edits is a good one.  
:But a further issue is that, for high-visibility high-vandal-risk edits like this, referencing and verifiability is particularly important.  But there seems to be no provision for this, in the apparent [[:mw:Wikidata_Bridge/Development#How_is_it_going_to_work?|development roadmap]].  Perhaps understandably.  Creating new references on Wikidata can be quite tricky, particularly if new items for new sources would need to be created.  An alternative might be to create a wikitext reference on the local wiki, and Visual Editor does have some quite developed tooling for that; but then (i) some option would be needed to allow or combine with a reference that already exists on the page; (ii) the reference would not be available on other wikis where the value might suddenly be appearing via Wikidata; (iii) there would be a danger of the value subsequently being changed on Wikidata, but the local reference for the old value still being applied to it.  So local references become difficult.
:There's talk of VE independence but also potential VE integration.  This idea of à-la-carte access to VE-component features is quite interesting.  I'm not sure if there are gadgets to give access to the VE reference-editing component without VE being chosen for the main editor.  But maybe worth remembering that VE uptake on wikis is often low, sometimes very low. (I've seen figures of fr-wiki 23% use of VE, ru-wiki 19%, es-wiki 11%, de-wiki 11%, en-wiki 4%). I don't know how reliable those figures are; but on some wikis there is definite resistance to VE.
:Finally, any thoughts about Commons?  Is there any thought to make SDC data available editable from templates on description pages in this way?  [[User:Jheald|Jheald]] ([[User talk:Jheald|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:56, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
:: {{ping|Jheald}} I hope you won't consider this to be diverting your remark, and if you do please just tell me to take it somewhere else, but as I've said before mainly on Commons: I continue to believe that the best solution to this is serialization of Wikidata into (and deserialization of Wikidata from) something with at least approximately the same syntax as a wikitext template. The wikitext user would have basically the same experience as when using a template that offers name-value pairs; the content corresponding to the template's name-value pairs would actually reside in Wikidata. This is not necessarily exclusive of the current proposal, which may be easier for less techincally oriented users, but should be available for those of us who prefer to work with wikitext. - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:55, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
:::{{re|Jmabel}} I once thought that's what should be investigated, particularly for editing SDC via something close to wikitext edits on existing templates.  But I am not sure it's so easy.  Serialisation, from wikidata/SDC to wikitext, might be relatively easy.  But the reverse is not -- data reconciliation from strings to wikidata items is a real grind, for which I really don't see any shortcuts.  Any idea that one could just make arbitrary wikitext edits in the template, and leave it to the software to convert that into wikidata updates is just not realistic.  I don't see any way round manual disambiguation (or manual confirmation that really no wikidata item exists).  Without such intervention the best one could generally probably automatically get to might be <code>somevalue</code> {{P|1932}} "string".  But that's not really good enough.  Alternatively, one could accept a wikitext update to a local value, but then tag if it didn't match SDC/Wikidata, in some way that could be automatically retrieved at scale.  That might be more promising, but it probably does make sense to try to get casual manual editors to directly choose a wikidata value if possible instead.  [[User:Jheald|Jheald]] ([[User talk:Jheald|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:28, 24 June 2019 (UTC)
:::: It probably can't be done universally, but for a lot of properties it should be easy: 
::::* Image links.
::::* Things that actually ''are'' strings (e.g. captions; URLs).
::::* Things with a reasonably limited domain, e.g. dates, simple numbers.
::::* It's only a little tougher to do amounts of money (because a currency qualifier is needed) and physical areas (unit of measure qualifier)
::::* We could have a syntax available so that any item that already has a Wikipedia article of its own wikilink can be referenced via the name of that article, or Wikidata items could, of course, be referenced directly. Especially for the latter (and perhaps for the former) it would be nice to have a search tool available during editing: not trivial, but not prohibitive.
:::: That right there is easily the majority of cases.
:::: This wouldn't be trivial to do, and obviously, there is a bit of calculation involved in the deserialization, and it would doubtless introduce a step of coming back to the user to deal with anything unparseable or ambiguous (much as Commons already has to warn about various upload problems), but I believe it would be tractable. Certainly tractable enough to merit some investment into looking at the potential. - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:06, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
:::::I think it's only easy for those when you ignore the fact that good statements are sourced. This is in particular true when the big Wikipedia's don't want to read unsourced date values from Wikidata. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 10:09, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
::::::Interestingly, infobox values at Wikipedia have rarely a source indicated ;) <br>Reminds me to repeat: make sure not to overwrite or "correct" sourced Wikidata statements when editing from Wikipedia. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:17, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
:::::::Even if it's true, they will still hugely complain if we want to install a Wikidata Bridge on their Wiki that brings unsourced claims with it. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 13:48, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
::::::::On wvwiki, infoboxes about persons are often unsourced as such. But they are often regarded as secondary to the text. And the text have to have sources. Complaints often comes when the infobox and the text tells different things. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:54, 25 June 2019 (UTC) 
:::::::::For most wikis that is probably true. Supposedly some even discuss diverting dates/info. Still in some wiki, user mention the source only in the edit summary ;)<br>Anyways, if the bridge is set up for editing/adding, it could be less an issue. Besides, many of the larger wikis may feel that they can't do all updates locally. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 14:03, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
:::::::All info in the lede and an infobox has to be covered by RS in the body, otherwise it should (or for a BLP must) be removed. For info from Wikidata "unsourced" is clear (=unusable, remove). The '''R''' in RS is undefined, e.g., reference URLs can be anything. &ndash;[[Special:Contributions/84.46.52.13|84.46.52.13]] 12:54, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::[[c:Module:Creator]], [[c:Module:Institution]] and [[c:Module:Artwork]] do something quite similar to this. They compares the templates' fields to Wikidata's data and if it's missing here composes a link to QuickStatements that allows adding them. That functionality is open to extension. Currently, only Commons will be added as a source. --[[User:Marsupium|Marsupium]] ([[User talk:Marsupium|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:55, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
:You have to be aware about one important difference here. On Wikipedia we tend to update data by simply replacing it. Here we add new data and change the ranks. Its doable, but the developers have to know what they are doing. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:07, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
Hello all, and thanks for your feedback. Let me answer on a few points:
* About Commons and other projects: if everything goes right, the system that we will develop can work on projects using similar templates. Because the need emerged primarily from Wikipedia communities, we'll focus on them for the first versions, but at any moment we can consider experimenting with other projects, if the template builders are willing to.
* As we are aware that references are extremely important for the data quality but also the acceptation of Wikidata's data by Wikipedia communities, we'll make sure that they are present, at least in a simple form, since the first version. Later we can develop more complex checking systems.
* Just to make it clearer: nothing will be enforced on Wikipedias. We will offer to the template builders a possibility to update the infoboxes to make them have the Wikidata Bridge option. We will encourage the communities to go step by step (eg start with only one Wikiproject) and see how it goes.
* About replace vs update data: yes that is one of the tricky pieces, and we hope that we can boil it down to a few standard cases that lead to distinct edit flows on Wikidata (add new value, change rank, ...). We hope we can then let the template creator chose which of those standard cases applies to a particular template parameter. The editor would then just have to say if they are fixing a typo or adding something new as shown in the mockups. We'll test it in the next versions and see if it works out.
Cheers, [[User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:27, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
:: {{ping|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)}} Something is missing in the description of the new tool (or perhaps I didn't find it): the rules of the process used in data selection.
:: How the tool selects statement when several values are available ? When a preferred rank is used among other normal ranks, this is simple, but when several preferred rank values are present or several normal rank values without a preferred one, how the tool will select a value to be updated/changed ?
:: If I understood the principle, the tool will change one value  but not necessary the value displayed in the infobox: if the extraction rule of data from WD is managed by other rules than the rank one (for example, statement selection is based on reference type in WP side by using a lua programmation), then wikipedians will spend time trying to update the value but not the one used by the infobox. How do you plan to overcome that situation ?
:: What happens if someone changes the value of a referenced statement ? Does the reference stay or is deleted ? If a referenced statement is wrong or outdated, then the value shouldn't be changed but a new statement created with rank lowering for the existing statement.
:: Someone see a data in an infobox which is not the usual one because the data selection of the Wikipedia template was defined in a particular way. Contributor will create new statement which perhaps already exists (duplicate) just because he is not able to see all existing statements in WD.
:: For me that kind of tools is not a good idea because he is not linked to what the contributor is reading: there is no link between the data which can be modified by the tool and the data displayed by the template. Rule for data selection is not only based on rank, date or reference type. 
:: Unless a better description of what is done by the tool, I think we are going in the wrong direction by developing that kind of tools which are not able to provide all information about what is displayed in the infobox and which statement will be modified in WD. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:25, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
::: {{ping|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)}} To be a little more constructive, I can only advice you to consider a complex case with several statements for one property, with different values, and several references and several qualifiers for each value:
::: Example, heat capacity of a chemical with different values, different units, different qualifiers (temperature, state), et different reference data
:::{| class="wikitable"
|-
! value !! unit !! qualifier 1 (temperature) !! qualifier 2(state)!! reference data 1 (stated in) !! reference data 2 (page)
|-
|rowspan=2| 2.01 ||rowspan=2| kJ/kg °C ||rowspan=2| 25°C ||rowspan=2| liquid || CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics || 3-21
|-
| Determination of heat capacity of XXX (scientific article) ||
|-
| 2.015 || kJ/kg °C || 20°C || liquid || CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics || 3-21
|-
| 1200 || Btu/lb °C|| 25°C || liquid || New determination of heat capacity of XXX using quantum chemistry (scientific article) ||
|-
| 1.75 || kJ/kg °C || -100°C || solid || The latest values in chemical engineering || 150
|}
::: This table should be displayed by you tool before wikipedian can only try to modify something in WD. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:35, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
*Let's see how it goes. The default should probably be "add the new value with preferred rank". --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:31, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
::::{{ping|Snipre}} Thanks for your feedback. We've been thinking about this, and we're still trying to figure out the technical details, and how to display all of this information in a nice and readable way in the interface. [[User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:15, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

== Disambiguations in aliases ==

Hello. Some people add Wikipedia article names to aliases ([[Special:Diff/969149865|diff]]) to make item searching easier for them. I have tried to find if it is allowed or disallowed in rules ([[Help:Aliases]], [[Help:Label]]), but failed to do so. Please help me to understand consensus on this topic and modify rules accordingly. — [[User:Vort|Vort]] ([[User talk:Vort|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:29, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

:I don't know that there is a consensus, one way or another. The full search will, AFAICS, return the item at the top of the results list if the sitelinked title is searched for - example: https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?search=&search=+John+Smith+%28architect%29&title=Special%3ASearch&go=Go&ns0=1&ns120=1 - but the search box dropdown does not list the article when the sitelinked title - ''' John Smith (architect)''' - is input; and it would if the sitelinked title were included as an alias. So a case can be made that it is a useful thing to do. Again, AFAIK, labels, descriptions and aliases are there for the convenience of users, whereas statements and qualifiers are the rigorous structured data; and so my view, fwiw, is that we should be relaxed about users exercising the option to include what might from many perspectives be thought of as superfluous aliases. In the scheme of things, I don't think any harm is done. (Obvs, because this is a wikipedia project, others may hold different views.) --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:33, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
:: I see that item appears in search. Better example is "Ивановка (Теренкольский район)". But there are no appearance when user adds item as property value (most likely, the same mechanism is used as in search suggestions). So I think better solution is adding of titles as virtual aliases for all usages inside Wikidata engine. — [[User:Vort|Vort]] ([[User talk:Vort|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:36, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
::: Let me clarify the example to save others from doing the investigation to understand the details: 
::: [https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%98%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BA%D0%B0_(%D0%A2%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B9%D0%BE%D0%BD) "Ивановка (Теренкольский район)" article] is page for {{Q|Q16654862}}. Still, the item does not appear when [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?search=&search=%D0%98%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BA%D0%B0+%28%D0%A2%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%8C%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9+%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B9%D0%BE%D0%BD%29&title=Special%3ASearch&go=Go&ns0=1&ns120=1 searching for "Ивановка (Теренкольский район)"].
::: Item does appear in dropdown and search or "Івановка (Теренкольський район)" (which is a label in 'uk') or "Ивановка (Kazakstan)" (which I added as "also known as" for 'sv').
::: Item appear does not appear in dropdown, but probably in search, for "Siedlung in Kasachstan" (a description text for 'de')
::: Dropdown shows the description text too, and matching "alias". Description text included only from the current view language or from English (e.g. Q1374309 in 'ru'). Left out if both blank. If item label is blank for current language, item title taken from English (e.g. Q1374309 in 'ru').
::: Searching seems to match any language, regardless of set language. Q-number is an alias automatically.
::: The advanced search method "pages in this language" doesn't seem to have any use on WD. Trying both 'ru' for Q16654862 and 'de' for "Siedlung in Kasachstan" give zero matches. It thus neither matches items having Wp for a specific language, nor the description in a specific language. --[[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:14, 29 June 2019 (UTC)

: I don't think that adding Russian Wikipedia article names to Russian aliases is a problem — it breaks nothing. However, I consider it useless to add foreign names to obviously inappropriate labels like [[Special:Diff/969490993]] or [[Special:Diff/120755985]]. [[User:Сидик из ПТУ|Сидик из ПТУ]] ([[User talk:Сидик из ПТУ|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:06, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
:: Duplication is always a problem. If one instance is changed, second should be changed too. And almost always no one cares about it and incorrect duplicate stays in data for years. — [[User:Vort|Vort]] ([[User talk:Vort|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:21, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
::: I agree that duplication causes a maintenance problem. Time spent when pasting the "alias" in addition to the time spent by the community to maintain it needs to be considered if there is a guideline about this. A better solution would be a change in the software, to include each language URL in the search and dropdown list generation. Did anyone create such a suggestion?
::: The second problem to consider is how to make item selection in dropdowns efficient. "John Smith" gives lots of matches and there is a lead text. Having even more items matching in the list, if adding several alias, is perhaps not optimal. --[[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:14, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
:::: Titles can be used as aliases if other data sources generates no (or small amount of) suggestions. — [[User:Vort|Vort]] ([[User talk:Vort|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:59, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
::::: {{Ping|Vort}} If you still meant that it should be done automatically by the system, rather than by volunteers spending time on it, I agree. Did you create a tracker for the suggestion, to get developer feedback? Or did you man that it's already working like this? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:03, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: {{Ping|Jagulin}} I have created [[:phab:T227170]]. — [[User:Vort|Vort]] ([[User talk:Vort|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:25, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== F1 races module ==

Hello,

Is possible to create a module, as Cycling race, for F1 race, to not edit the result for all Wikipedias, but include the results and edit once for have the one result for all Wikipedias, and Wikinews.

Thanks, [[User:Aabbccddeeffabcdef|Aabbccddeeffabcdef]] ([[User talk:Aabbccddeeffabcdef|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]), the 15:32, 30 June 2019 (UTC).

Post scriptum : I'm French, so my English is not very good (level 2).
: {{ping|Aabbccddeeffabcdef}} Is it possile ? Yes, but for that you need to ask help in the wikipedia you want to implement that module. Wikidata is not responsible of the data use in Wikipedia and as each WP has different rules and different tools for data implementation from WD, there is no unique solution. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:44, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Avoiding the need to maintain raw data in each language Wp sound like a good idea if you have some users with you. Even if not easily solved, if you have a "Cycling race" module you should try to make contact with anyone in charge of that. They could probably assist in technicalities and clarify how much problem they've seen. Even if each Wp is different, it should be possible and beneficial to make a module generic enough to be used across language and style. "Commons" may be a place to work independently from Wp. Each Wp then picks it up when they see fit. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:05, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Even if I agree with the comment of Jagulin, I can only remark a point: a lua module require the use of general template to extract data from WD and to format them (example: references). The main general templte for that is module:Wikidata. But this module is not the same for each Wikipedia. So you have 2 possibilities: use an existing general module and then you are limited by the module used in your Wikipedia or creat your module integrating all basic features for data extraction from WD. The best is to contact the person who wrote the module Cycling race to see how this module is independent of other modules. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:59, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: Many people have contributed to [[Module:Cycling race]]. It is working indpendent of other modules so it can be copied to and used in any Wikipedia. To do something similar for some other area, you or the persons writing the module will need to be able program in lua, know how lua is used in MediaWiki (the Scribunto extension), and know how to access data from Wikidata. The module will need to access data from many different Wikidata items to compose its tables. That can use a lot of resources, so it is important to do this as efficient as possible to avoid timeouts or other resource limits. Also design the module to have translations and configuration in separate submodules. Module:Cycling race have some problems caused by some less than good design decisions in these areas. I would be able to give some advice on how to do such things. Keep in mind too that it only works if someone input all the needed data to Wikidata. That can also be a lot of work in it self. --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:48, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: Thanks for sharing, [[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]], it was exactly the helpful guidance I expected to see.  I never meant to say it was easy, but if there is a strong community interest it could be done. In the end, it should save effort to not maintain language-independent data on each Wp, and having even a first draft module may be the only way for people to take that step. At least, I hope that's the result seen in Cycling. There is of course a chance that "the normal wikipedian" stops contributing since WD and interwiki is too scary for them. A quick look to the Cycling module discussions it looked generic to other type of seasonal racing, but I understand it's unfortunately more work to be more generic too.
::::: {{ping|Snipre}} Even if there are historic Wp-specific modules, I don't see any reason to make a new model anything less than generic. Do you know if there has been plans to introduce a new "basic module" (abstracting some f the lower level programming work) that would (or could easily) be available on all mediawiki? It would still be a community decision to accept the specific inclusion, use and configuration of each template, but new modules would have a base to start from. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:24, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::{{ping|Jagulin}} To create a module in WP using data from WD you need 3 things: a set of extraction tools, a set of data format tools and the module itself which organizes the data in the wikitext. The main proble is that extraction tools and data formatting tools are different between WP, because each community develops code according to its need. But this influence the way you access the data in your module code so you can't create a generic module because the interfaces between the module and the extraction/formatting tools are different.
:::::: There is no plan to generate generic code for all WPs because WPs want to keep the lead on that code which influences their templates. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:05, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata weekly summary #371 ==

<div class="plainlinks mw-content-ltr" lang="en" dir="ltr">
[[File:Wikidata-logo-en.svg|150px|right]]
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">''Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.''</div>
<div style="-moz-column-count:2; -webkit-column-count:2; column-count:2; -webkit-column-width: 400px; -moz-column-width: 400px; column-width: 400px;">
* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Events|Events]]'''
** Upcoming: [[d:Wikidata:Events/UGent_Wikidata_and_Wikibase_Workshop_2019#Programme|July 3rd: UGent Wikidata and Wikibase Workshop 2019]]
** Upcoming: OSM TW x Wikidata TW Meetup, June 3rd, Taipei, Taiwan - [https://www.facebook.com/events/419053822210609 Facebook event]
** Upcoming: [[w:pt:Wikipédia:Edit-a-thon/Atividades em português/Wikidata Lab XVII|Wikidata Lab XVII]] in São Paulo, Brazil, July 11th
** Upcoming: [https://wiki.inventaire.io/wiki/Inventaire-OpenData-Week-2019 Inventaire & OpenData Week 2019] in Wurzen, Germany, July 18th-25th
** [https://2019.stateofthemap.org/ State of the Map 2019]: early bird tickets are available until July 7th. The program will include [https://2019.stateofthemap.org/program/ a Wikidata workshop]

* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Press coverage|Press, articles, blog posts]]'''
** [https://www.mysociety.org/2019/06/26/placing-everypolitician-on-hold/ Placing EveryPolitician on hold] by MySociety ("it's clear that Wikidata should be the natural global home for this type of data")
** [https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/b637/63015ff6659fb755a4a3ec72bb0353cf7300.pdf?_ga=2.6261939.140871088.1561579037-708203100.1559741642 Celebrity Profiling] by Matti Wiegmann et al., 
** Published in ArXiv:
*** [https://arxiv.org/pdf/1906.06127.pdf DocRED: A Large-Scale Document-Level Relation Extraction Dataset] by Yuan Yao et al.
*** [https://arxiv.org/pdf/1906.06752.pdf ConTrOn: Continuously Trained Ontology based on Technical Data Sheets and Wikidata] by Kobkaew Opasjumruskit et al.
** [https://www.slideshare.net/jneubert/wikidata-as-opportunity-for-special-collections-the-20th-century-press-archives-use-case Wikidata as opportunity for special collections: the 20th Century Press Archives use case]. Presentation at LIBER 2019 (LOD working group of the Association of European Research Libraries), by [[d:User:Jneubert|Joachim Neubert]]

* '''Other Noteworthy Stuff'''
** The Wikibase community Telegram group has been recreated, [https://t.me/joinchat/HGjGexZ9NE7BwpXzMsoDLA here's the invitation link]

* '''Did you know?'''
<!-- NEW PROPERTIES DO NOT REMOVE -->
** Newest [[d:Special:ListProperties|properties]]:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Property:P6883|LilyPond notation]], [[:d:Property:P6884|target muscle]], [[:d:Property:P6885|historical region]], [[:d:Property:P6886|writing language]], [[:d:Property:P6887|match interval]], [[:d:Property:P6889|microarchitecture]], [[:d:Property:P6897|literacy rate]], [[:d:Property:P6902|era name]], [[:d:Property:P6938|seconded by]], [[:d:Property:P6939|moved by]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Property:P6888|MELPA package ID]], [[:d:Property:P6890|Nchdb asset ID]], [[:d:Property:P6891|National Film Board of Canada director identifier]], [[:d:Property:P6892|Fundamental.org Baptist Church ID]], [[:d:Property:P6893|Offizielle Deutsche Charts artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6894|Beatport artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6895|Bangladesh administrative division code (2017-)]], [[:d:Property:P6896|Djshop artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6898|NeoGeoSoft ID]], [[:d:Property:P6899|New York City Neighborhood Tabulation area ID]], [[:d:Property:P6900|NicoNicoPedia]], [[:d:Property:P6901|NooSFere edition ID]], [[:d:Property:P6903|ArtBrokerage artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6904|ATRF ID]], [[:d:Property:P6905|Bebo profile ID]], [[:d:Property:P6906|National Library of Aruba ID]], [[:d:Property:P6907|BVLarramendi ID]], [[:d:Property:P6908|Cameo ID]], [[:d:Property:P6909|Charts in France artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6910|CIN ID]], [[:d:Property:P6911|Dutch Charts artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6912|Equipboard artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6913|Facebook Gaming game ID]], [[:d:Property:P6914|Gaana.com artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6915|Gambay ID]], [[:d:Property:P6916|Heritage Gazetteer of Cyprus]], [[:d:Property:P6917|Historical Archives of the European Union ID]], [[:d:Property:P6918|hitparade.ch artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6919|Indian gallantry awardee ID]], [[:d:Property:P6920|Juno Download artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6921|MangaSeek person ID]], [[:d:Property:P6922|Metro topic ID]], [[:d:Property:P6923|Moov artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6924|Murfie artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6925|Musicalics composer ID]], [[:d:Property:P6926|Nederlandse Top 40 artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6927|NME artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6928|PCE Daisakusen ID]], [[:d:Property:P6929|CUT code]], [[:d:Property:P6930|Pro Football Hall of Fame ID]], [[:d:Property:P6931|Repology project name]], [[:d:Property:P6932|Rogerebert.com film ID]], [[:d:Property:P6933|SA Flora ID]], [[:d:Property:P6934|Syriac Biographical Dictionary ID]], [[:d:Property:P6935|The DJ List artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6936|Who's Who of American Comic Books ID]], [[:d:Property:P6937|SNBP ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPERTIES -->
<!-- NEW PROPOSALS DO NOT REMOVE -->
** New [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Property proposal|property proposals]] to review:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/double major|double major]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Poster|Poster]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Throwing handedness|Throwing handedness]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Batting handedness|Batting handedness]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Institut-ID in der Unternehmensdatenbank der BaFin|Institut-ID in der Unternehmensdatenbank der BaFin]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Wolfram Language unit code|Wolfram Language unit code]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/National Transportation Safety Board report|National Transportation Safety Board report]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/enemy of|enemy of]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/PHI Latin Texts author ID|PHI Latin Texts author ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/default description for instances|default description for instances]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/ACNP journal ID|ACNP journal ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Personnel de l'administration préfectorale ID|Personnel de l'administration préfectorale ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Bursa Malaysia stock code|Bursa Malaysia stock code]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/etrain.info station ID|etrain.info station ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Rupa Publications author ID|Rupa Publications author ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Pro Kabaddi League player ID|Pro Kabaddi League player ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/OYO Hotel ID|OYO Hotel ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Anime Characters Database|Anime Characters Database]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/IMFDB work ID|IMFDB work ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Australian Faunal Directory publication ID|Australian Faunal Directory publication ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Ident.Nr.|Ident.Nr.]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Sverigetopplistan artist ID|Sverigetopplistan artist ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Musiikkituottajat artist ID|Musiikkituottajat artist ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Radio Courtoisie show ID|Radio Courtoisie show ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Biyografya ID|Biyografya ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPOSALS -->
** Query examples: 
*** [https://w.wiki/5VP Nouns without grammatical gender in a chosen language] ([https://twitter.com/fagerving/status/1144863672336039936 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/5VR Current UK Members of Parliament ranked by number of Wikimedia sitelinks] ([https://twitter.com/generalising/status/1144722074386280453 source])
** [https://w.wiki/5VS Architectural drawings depicting cathedrals in France] ([https://twitter.com/daieuxdailleurs/status/1144604075004256256 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/5VT Music bands named after Tolkien's universe, by genre] ([https://twitter.com/sukkoria/status/1142149043398893569 source])
** Newest database reports: [[d:Wikidata:WikiProject Education/education by country or region|education by country]]

* '''Development'''
** More work on preparing the technical setup for [[phab:project/profile/4074|Wikidata Bridge]] development
** Implement Feature Flag for Wikidata Bridge ([[phab:T225935]])
** Discuss the best way to connect template parameter to corresponding Wikidata property ([[phab:T224832]])
** Improve the documentation for Wikibase sites setup ([[phab:T218282]])
** Prepare the last steps for reading from new term store implementation ([[phab:T225603]]) according to the migration plan ([[phab:T221765]])
** Fixed a bug and reduced significantly the amount of addUsagesForPage jobs in our jobs queue ([[phab:T205045]])
** Removed feature flag for the bugfix for wbeditentity setting aliases to empty array ([[phab:T223305]])
** Decreased EntityUsageTable addUsage batch size to 100 ([[phab:T225500]])
** Configured query service lag for Wikidata maxlag ([[phab:T222193]])
** Helped fixing an issue with moving files on Commons ([[phab:T226672]])
[[phab:maniphest/query/4RotIcw5oINo/#R|You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here]]. If you want to help, you can also have a look at [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/project/board/71/query/zfiRgTnZF7zu/?filter=zfiRgTnZF7zu&order=priority the tasks needing a volunteer].

* '''Monthly Tasks'''
** Add labels, in your own language(s), for the new properties listed above.
** Comment on property proposals: [[d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Overview|all open proposals]]
** [[d:Wikidata:Contribute/Suggested and open tasks|Suggested and open tasks]]!
** Contribute to a [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Showcase items|Showcase item]].
** Help [[d:Special:LanguageStats|translate]] or proofread the interface and documentation pages, in your own language!
** [[d:User:Pasleim/projectmerge|Help merge identical items]] across Wikimedia projects.
** Help [[d:Wikidata:Status updates/Next|write the next summary!]]

</div>
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:Quick {{P|6935}} plausibility check on {{Q|2709}} with the expected result '''spam'''.{{=(}} &ndash;[[Special:Contributions/84.46.52.13|84.46.52.13]] 13:38, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== P6546 requires constraint on data ==

There should be a constraint on this preventing it from being a negative number, which is not possible. Whether by data entry or import error, it seems possible to be entered as one, such as here [[Q1852981]]
[[User:CanadianCodhead|CanadianCodhead]] ([[User talk:CanadianCodhead|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:57, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:You could try and see if {{Q|Q21502404}} and {{P|1793}} works on {{P|P6546}}. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:29, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::Or you could use {{Q|Q21510860}} ([[Special:MyLanguage/Help:Property constraints portal/Range|documentation]]). --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:34, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
I used a {{Q|Q21502404}} to set a regex pattern {{P|6547}} values must conform to. Two things now: 1) can someone double-check my regex? I've used "-?\d+" to catch any positive or negative integer; 2) I'm seeing an error now on pages where this property is used, "Properties with constraint 'format constraint' need to have values of type 'String' or 'Monolingual text.'" Does anyone know how to change the value type to string? The data type for {{P|6547}} is currently "Quantity" and I can't figure out how to change it.
On a related note, I used a {{Q|Q21510860}} to specify that the value for all the other properties I've employed for hockey statistics -- {{P|6509}}, {{P|6545}}, {{P|6544}}, {{P|P6546}}, and {{P|P6543}} -- can only have a minimum of zero, and thus shouldn't get mixed up with +/- values. [[User:LesserJerome|LesserJerome]] ([[User talk:LesserJerome|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:27, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== entries for social media user names ==

It seems like the social media user names for Greta Thunberg and Luisa Neubauer in their wikidata entries are changed again and again - but only the capitalization of some letters is changed. As far as I know the capitalization of letters in user names is irrelevant. Only the aricle history gets longer and longer. Would it be possible to have a filter that does not allow edits that only change the capitalization of social media user names? --[[User:C.Suthorn|C.Suthorn]] ([[User talk:C.Suthorn|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:27, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:Sounds like a textbook job for protection. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:33, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:*Sounds, but where are these edits? {{Q|Q56434717}} ? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 05:15, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== Creating an item for an author of multiple items ==

I was gonna create an item for Li Dongrong 李东荣, a Chinese central banker, then I found five papers: [[special:search/"李东荣"]]. Is there a neat way (a script or program?) to create the item and migrate {{P|2093}}, or create the item from the P2093?--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:34, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:You can try [https://tools.wmflabs.org/author-disambiguator/?name=%E6%9D%8E%E4%B8%9C%E8%8D%A3] --[[User:Stevenliuyi|Stevenliuyi]] ([[User talk:Stevenliuyi|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:11, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== Change in the name pattern of new Wikidata RDF dumps ==

Hello all,

Starting on July 15th, the name of the RDF dumps will be changed to '''remove the "beta"'''. For example, the file that would have been named <code>wikidata-20190717-all-BETA.ttl.bz2</code> with the former name format will be named <code>wikidata-20190717-all.ttl.bz2</code>.

This will only impact the '''new generated dumps''', not the previous ones.

If you have questions or issues, feel free to ask [[phab:T226153|on the Phabricator ticket]]. Cheers, [[User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:30, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== No JSON dumps for the weeks of June 24th and July 1st ==

Hello all,

Due to technical issues, the JSON dumps for this week and last week couldn't be properly generated.
* 20190624 because of a commit that was fixing another bug ([[phab:T226601]])
* 20190701 due to an issue with qualifier hashes ([[phab:T227207]])
We apologize for this inconvenience. The problem is about to be solved, so we expect the situation to be back to normal next week. However, we will not generate the previous failed dumps.

Thanks for your understanding, [[User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:37, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== instance of(P31) or subclass of(P279) pseudoscience(Q483677)? ==

Querying everything that has been labeled instance of(P31) pseudoscience(Q483677) there is 1 result: [https://w.wiki/5c5 Bach flower remedies]

[https://w.wiki/5c7 Querying subclass of(P279) pseudoscience(Q483677) there are more results]. Regardless of how many hits I get with any of these, should I do instance of or subclass of for this item? [[Q1068571|blood type personality theory]].

Also having read the [[Help:Basic_membership_properties]] I didn't completely get yet the difference between instance of and subclass of an item. [[User:Ελλίντερεστ|Ελλίντερεστ]] ([[User talk:Ελλίντερεστ|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:32, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{Q|788110}} would be a class. One particular glass of such a solution sitting on your table would be an instance. Whether it's really a subclass of pseudoscience I'm not sure: I think that's saying it's a field of pseudoscience, in the way that {{Q|11351}} is a field of {{Q|2329}}, and has been made a subclass. {{Q|12547983}} isn't a subclass of chemistry, or of science in general. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:55, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
: It could be a subclass of {{Q|50092815}}. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:58, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
: In most cases {{P|279}} would be more appropriate here. When adding claims as something being a pseudoscience I would recommend that you add sources for that classification. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 21:01, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

== New item: central banker? ==

Should there be an item of the occupation(?) central banker (akin to {{Q|2883465}})? There is {{Q|8353786}}.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:26, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:This data is stored using a combination of {{P|P1304}}, {{P|P2388}}, and {{P|P39}}. --[[User:Yair rand|Yair rand]] ([[User talk:Yair rand|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:52, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

:See {{Q|294460}} and {{Q|605440}}. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:02, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

:As Yair points out, "Central banker" is not really an occupation ({{Q|188094}} would be more typical) and this is usually handled via {{P|P39}}. That property doesn't work too well when defining {{P|4224}} (you can't structure it as you can for, say, {{Q|8709447}}). Was that the actual issue you were trying to get at, {{ping|Roy17}}? I think skipping the "human" level for it can work: {{statement||P4224|Q1162163|P642|Q66344}}. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:11, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
::I know they are usually regarded as economists, but IMHO central banker could be a profession, being a special type of government economists as well as a special type of bankers. They are economists that have real power, such as influencing monetary supply. They are bankers who dont work for profits of a corporation but the well-being of a country's economy. I was just hoping to see objection to this item.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:49, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
== Date of birth reference ==

We now require a reference for date of birth, but not, for instance, date of death ... was their a discussion for that? I can see requiring it when we have contradicting dates, as sometimes happens, especially for early historical people. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:56, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
:It's just a suggestion, see: ''{{Q+|Q62026391}}''. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:46, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

: Coming from Wikipedia traditions I'd like to stress verifiability. [[Help:Sources]] allows unreferenced sources as an ''exception'' only. References are not to prevent criticism, but to ''allow'' it.
: Spreading knowledge is of course always useful. {{Ping|Tidoni}} Can you share background to the change in {{P|P569}}? Recently copied to {{P|P570}} too. Why are only some properties marked like this? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:00, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
::The lack of a references last year led to a purge by some people of "ethnicity" and "religion" in entries. They were applying English Wikipedia rules to Wikidata. Again, I think it only needs a reference when we have two conflicting dates, each date should be referenced so reader can judge which one is canonical. A quick search shows we have >5,000 with multiple birth dates in the field. There already are several bots that scrape other databases for matching birth and death dates and add in the reference here at Wikidata. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:03, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
::: No, I don't think they were applying Wikipedia rules, but the Wikidata policy on [[Wikidata:Living people|Living people]] as they may and should. --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:58, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: If this is about living people, then why was it just expanded for the death date? --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:05, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: [[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]], obviously having both verifiable birth date and death date is useful to judge if a person is living, but don't mix "reason for deletion" with "reason to have source". Thank you for highlighting that date of death was missing the symmetric enforcement. WD is, as most community driven projects, evolving in an iterative manner. I think it's very good that WD is at a point where promoting quality is possible. To me it's not at all dependent on "living person" policy, but person category is a large and important part of WD, so a good place to build quality and consensus. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:25, 2 July 2019 (UTC) 
::::which was copied from BLP, QED. the venue may change but the deletionism is the same. you will not increase referenced statements by deletion. [[User:Slowking4|Slowking4]] ([[User talk:Slowking4|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:00, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

::: {{Ping|Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )}} I was not promoting purge, but saying that [[Help:Sources]] and [[Wikidata:Introduction]] are clear: WD is supposed to be "A secondary database. Wikidata records not just statements, but also their sources". This is WD consensus, not enWp. Out of curiosity: Could you point at any Wikimedia project that have the policy you describe? 
:::* A source alone would require a fairly large amount of work to asses. For an automatic process it might be very difficult to judge the statement validity. There are however properties you can set on a contended statement (e.g. {{Q|Q18912752}}). A perfect knowledge system is perhaps a utopia, but we should not actively make WD guesswork. 
:::* What guideline says: ''only needs a reference when we have two conflicting dates''? When that second date is entered it would be harder to find the source for the first date since we can't know where you found it. 
:::* You say bots ''add in the reference'' and I can only see that as a support for the need of references. Whenever there is no reference (added by bot or directly) the statement is IMHO unsourced and assumed to be speculative. Also if bots are good enough to actively add sources to correct persons, they could also add the date themselves. No need for you to do only half of their job. And "date of birth" is only a special case. The general case is that there are no bots that qualify all statements in WD. The contributor should do that.
::: I hope you now agree to the reasons and WD consensus for documented sources. -- [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:27, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

::*Most claims should have a reference, especially P570. There just some that must have a reference already when first added.  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:34, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::"Most claims should have a reference", then why this field and why now? --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:03, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
* Wikidata has [[Wikidata:Living people|Living people]]. In contrast to Help:Sources, it's a policy. It's worth reading the policy as it specifies what classifying a property as {{Q|44601380}} does and the process for challenging it's application to a property. As long as it's on {{P|569}} I can understand having the constraint there. If you don't think it should be there, voice your opinion on the talk page. 
: I see no good reason to have the constraint for {{P|570}} as I don't see what makes {{P|570}} specially worth protecting. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 11:29, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

== Took the place 2,5 years after the elections ==

[[Q64959563#P39]]. See the statements 1 and 2. In the first one he (the item) was elected at the day of the elections. In the second one, he wasn't elected the day of the elections. He was runner up. After 2,5 years the person who won resigned (he became a minister) and the item took his place in the parliament. Reading the statement, there is a gap between the <s>elections</s> new parliament start day (1996) and the start day of him as a parliament member (1999). Am not sure if someone can understand why. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:17, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
*You might be better served with a normal statement structure, one where the "start date" indicates the start date and the "end date" indicates the actual end date. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 21:26, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::But, this structure is already served. The "start date" indicates the start date and the "end date" indicates the actual end date. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:47, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::As the guy is known to be immortal and stick to his seat?  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 21:52, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Sorry, I can understand the comment. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:23, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::Instead of adding the start and end dates to the term, you add it to the position statement(s) of the person. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 22:39, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::Example? [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:47, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::I think all but one date. If the guy holds the position from 1991 to 1996 and from 1999 to present, there are just two actual start dates and one actual end date. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 22:57, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::But this has nothing to do with my first question. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:07, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::If you wouldn't use fictional end dates, I don't think you would ask yourself the question. Election date and actual start date is rarely identical. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 23:09, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::: You misunderstood or I wasn't clear, sorry. I don't use the election day as a start day. I use as start day the day they new parliament member starts. For example, election day was 22 May 2016 and the start day as parliament member was 2 June 2016... The "problem" is that the new parliament start at 1996 and he became parliament member at 1999. I am asking is that a problem the way I added the statement. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:38, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::::: Did this person take the office ''because'' they were second in this years-earlier election? Or was that basically coincidence (or even a motivating factor in, but not legally the cause of them taking office), and this is like any time someone is appointed to a normally elective office? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:19, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::::: The party won 1 seat in the parliament to that district. The person came second. So he didn't elected. After 2,5 years, the person who came first became a minister. So he quit from the parliament. According to the law, the seat is going to the person who came second in the elections. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:47, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::::::We have a similair system in Sweden. I know from svwp, that such persons are not considered "elected" at all. Instead thay are seen as "Ersättare", . They have a seat in the parliament for shorter or longer period, but they often seem to lack the legitamacy an "elected" parliamantarian has. A user from svwp would then probably not add {{P|2715}} at all. But I do not know if that would be right here. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:19, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::::::: The gap should not cause any problem. I would agree that it's an option to leave out elected in this case, yet having it as is seems perfectly fine, but not familiar with they specific system. If the source shows the person elected to be successor, that's all good. The way it was described (as well in Sweden) I would not dispute legitimacy, the person was still appointed by vote. 
:::::::::::::: Possibly off topic: No related property found. {{Q|Q10488457}} and {{Q|Q10684100}} have hardly any links but would be variants of "ersättare". {{Q|Q3504856}} (french) and {{Q|Q16159375}} seems to be intendedly country specific, though I don't see exactly why. I was surprised not to find any "successor/replacement" item. Relevant to make sure if it is a strict successor or also temporary stand-in when needed: {{Q|Q29863201}}. {{Q|Q3275569}} might indicate a successor-type of role, but most likely not. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:54, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::::::::: [[Q12009014]] is a substitute for a member of a parliament as described in nowiki. --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:01, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::::::::::Now merged with "Ersättare" from svwiki [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:20, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::::::::::: Brought the off topic part up in [[:no:Wikipedia:Torget#merge_Suppleant_into_Vararepresentant|noWp]] already. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:56, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

== Thoughts about Wikidata ==

(Sorry for my English). I often realizes that Wikidata is a place were every user can do anything he/she wants. For similar subjects, they add different properties to say the same things. Everyone uses different structure and models. We don't have a common politic, manuals or examples... There is a mess... But we have thousands of users that contributes every day, we have bot and useful tools. But still we have a lot of problems... (And that problems make problems to Wikipedia also with the use of data of Wikidata to Wikipedia templates). That is Wikidata we want? In my opinion there are two ways:

1) Continue the same way...

2) Try to create common politic, manuals or examples. To discuss and find finals models. I know, there will be disagreements. But if the community agree to a model about a subject, then the users who have disagreements they have to accept the model... And of course we will need time to correct the items according to the model, but at least we will have a model that we can base on it to make corrections, to complete new items, to give examples to new users... And with the help of bot and tools, one day everything will be OK. I hope so...

Just some thoughts. I am not so expert in Wikidata and I don't use English language with perfect way, so I can't help as much I want, but I want to try... Or maybe I am wrong and there is no problem at all... Your opinion? (We need practical suggestions, not only theoretical). [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:48, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

:We do have common politic, manuals or examples, such as [[Wikidata:WikiProject ShEx]] or [[Wikidata:Showcase items]]; or [[Wikidata:WikiProject Books#Work item properties]] and [[Wikidata:WikiProject every politician/Political data model]], to give just two examples. We also have users who find it easy to criticise established practices, but who are slower to come up either with reasoned arguments to support their criticism, or with practical improvements; and users unaware both of extant models and of work done to promulgate such models, and who would wish us to reinvent what we already have. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:04, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
* There are many cases where we don't have established standards. The way to get established standards is to write them on the relevant Wikiproject and seek consensus there. Afterwards when you have consistent documentation of a standard on the Wikiproject it's possible to talk to the people who violate the standard. Sometimes this will mean that the people will reopen discussion about standards but the process of talking to people about the standard is the way you get people to adhere to a common way to model a domain. This means that there need to be people who care about enforcing standards for a given domain. For cases of more global standards it requires people writing RfCs. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 11:32, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

: This keeps coming up.  See the previous discussions "[[Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2019/06#schema again|schema again]]" and "[[Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2019/06#Glossary of topics on how to structure data|Glossary of topics on how to structure data]]".  I'm sure Shape Expressions are the way of the future, but I suspect it'll be some time before they're fleshed out & in widespread use.  I've been doing some work to try to come up with simple tables describing the common claims and qualifiers to be used to describe common entities (people, cities, rivers, etc.), but my work got interrupted by a computer crash so I don't have anything to show for it yet. —[[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:30, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wanted - someone to adopt a discontinued bot ==

The en.wiki [[:en:Wikipedia:WikiProject Women in Red]] is looking for someone who'd be prepared to run a bot, the owner of which has recently retired. The bot is described at  [[:d:Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Bot/Emijrpbot 6]], which points to [https://github.com/emijrp/wikidata/blob/master/curate.newpages.en.py code here]. The function of the bot is to add new wikidata items for new en.wiki biographies and/or to add human and/or gender statements to existing wikidata items, based on articles found on [[:en:Special:UnconnectedPages]]. WiR bases all of its [[:en:Wikipedia:WikiProject Women in Red/Metrics|metrics]] (& [http://whgi.wmflabs.org/gender-by-language.html these]) on wikidata records for en.wiki articles, and since end April the project's stats have become increasingly hard to compile. We'd be more than grateful if someone would consider picking up this thankless task; thx. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:44, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:<small>(Really, I should not be taking more such responsabilities but here I go)</small> If that would be welcome then I ''may'' be up for that − unless you find someone else of course :) [[User:Jean-Frédéric|Jean-Fred]] ([[User talk:Jean-Frédéric|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:24, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
: If Jean-Frédéric can't do it, then I might be able to persuade [[User:Pi bot|Pi bot]] to help. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:33, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

::Thx both; I have to leave it to you to decide. J-F - you know it makes sense; what could go wrong ;) --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:43, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
*Personally, I do some of them once in a while, but, as I'm working with PetScan, this isn't possible any more. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 15:50, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{ping|Tagishsimon}} It's nice code! I've merged it into one file at [https://bitbucket.org/mikepeel/wikicode/src/master/wir_newpages.py] and set it running, see [[Special:Contributions/Pi_bot]]. Unless there are objections, then I just need to know how often you want it running. If {{ping|Jean-Frédéric}} wants to take this on, though, then I have no objections. :-) Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:04, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Could it add full dates instead of just years? e.g. at [[Q65032839]], [[Q65032842]], both linked to articles with actual dates. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 18:14, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: {{ping|Jura1}} It currently uses the categories to get the birth/death dates, not the text. It should be possible to change that, though, I'll investigate. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:27, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: {{ping|Jura1}} [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q65033590&diff=974171752&oldid=974171738 done], as long as the enwiki article uses [[:en:Template:birth date and age]]. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:21, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::Excellent! Thanks. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 19:27, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
== constraints-mod ==

{{P|P4501}} has {{P|18}} as a constraint. It is probably rarer that we have (downloaded) pictures of a celestial body than that we don't have. Could it be downgraded to a recomended property instead? [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:05, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
: {{Ping|Arbnos}} You [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property:P4501&diff=665734988&oldid=665483854 added this constraint]. Any comments? {{Q|Q21503247}} description says "should". <s>Is {{Q|Q21502408}} enforcing it more strongly?</s>
: I don't know astronomy, and have hardly any wisdom of WD structure design, but I also noticed this as a bit tough. There must be lots of sources for albedo where there is no free image to use. Is the image meant to be a graph, such as in {{Q|Q101038}}? Maybe even "allow" is enough?
: {{P|P397}} is also required. Maybe meant to be the star related to the item, but AFAIK the albedo is not strictly bound to having a "parent". And the {{Q|Q405}} [https://www.universetoday.com/19981/moon-albedo/ has albedo], and parent Earth.
: Were the constraint meant to be on "albedo qualifiers" rather than on "item properties"? And should they be mandatory in that case? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:03, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{Ping|Jagulin}} Hello! The image I added when the property had limited use and it seemed that the absence would be an exception, so it can be removed.--[[User:Arbnos|Arbnos]] ([[User talk:Arbnos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:20, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::: {{Ping|Arbnos}}I take that as support for removing the image constraint entirely and I agree. I believe you also added {{P|P397}} constraint and the existing exception. I suggest remote those too. What do you say about it? What is the meaning of the constraint? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:48, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: {{Ping|Jagulin}}Yes, you can delete the image. As for {{P|P397}}: the description of the property, like all asteroids, for example, should be the parent of warm Sun, even a "star" to be synonymous worth it.--[[User:Arbnos|Arbnos]] ([[User talk:Arbnos|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:57, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::We have objects about thousands of minor planet and comets. Since (with one single exception) all of them have Sun as {{P|P397}}, it maybe looks a little redundant to add this statement to them all. But as it is doable, so why not? A bot/script could add it everywhere for every comet or minor planet without causing any problems at all. Yes, there are many comets who do not circle around the Sun today. But at some point they have at least been doing that. Not a single one of them (yet) have seemed to have a foreign background. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:35, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: {{Ping|Arbnos}} I removed the image constraint, as agreed. About my other suggestion:
::::::* ''"{{P+|P397}}"'' says nothing about "parent of warm Sun" (nor "child" which I guess you meant). I already mentioned {{Q|Q405}} as a counter-example, but there are plenty.
::::::*''"{{P+|P4501}}"'' says nothing about being dependent of a Sun or a parent. It is an instance of ''"{{Q+|Q21451142}}"'' but that doesn't say "child" to me.'
::::::* Structurally it doesn't IMHO make sense to have "parent astronomical body" as requirement of [[Property:P4501#P2302]]. The {{Q|Q634}} needs a parent even if nobody entered albedo value. ''"{{P+|P2325}}"'' has the requirement, but in this case it makes sense due to the "orbital". 
::::::* On the other hand, it's not a problem and I said I don't know astronomy... If consensus is for the requirement to stay, I won't remove it.
:::::: {{Ping|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra}} I may have misunderstood the context of your recent comment (sorry for mixing another topic into your original question). I totally agree that {{P|P397}} should be set when known. Interestingly, you seem to answer a question I asked in another place (last bullet of [[User_talk:Vislupus#Asteroid_data|this]]). If you can bot those, it would be nice! Or can it be inherited (e.g. from {{Q|Q2179}}) and remove the effort entirely?
::::::* I do however question if you say "the Sun" meaning {{Q|Q525}}. Naturally we know more about our current solar system, but I'm sure there are planets identified for other stars as well and as mentioned above "parent" is not always a sun. "minor planet and comets" is perhaps difficult to find at a distances, but are they really conceptually defined only to our Sun? You can bot now, but later it may be untrue. {{Q|Q2179}} is well defined, but I would suppose there are "other asterid belts" both in our system and for other stars. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:36, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::{{replyto|Jagulin}} We have found exoplanets around other stars, but they are neither minor planets or comets. (Minor planets is the sum of asteroids in the inner part of the solar systems and the transneptunian objects and everything there between.) And we have found belts of asteroids around other stars, but not identified single objects. We have maybe detected swarms of comets in other solar systems, but not single comets. So there are comets and minor planets in other solarsystems, but we should have not items about them. There are from time to time comets who are encircling Jupiter and Saturn and not Sol, but they have in the past been encircling Sol, so adding that to the items is never wrong. The only known exception to this is 1I/ʻOumuamua. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:52, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::: {{Ping|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra}} Thanks for the added insight!
:::::::: * We agree that you're not talking about Albedo it seems. I think it would make sense for someone to add the "parent" constraint to the item classes that should have it, e.g. planet, asteroid...
:::::::: * You suggest to inject "parent" value into specific kinds of objects. That's out of my league, so as long as you know what you do and have support, I don't mind. :) As a general rule I'd not inject data into WD if I had no source for it. I prefer leaving "gaps" and let the "reader" fill them in by any assumption they're willing to do, rather than add statements that the reader will have to question. 
:::::::: * I don't know the definition of "parent" really, but I would expect the data to be "current" (is that within 1000 years?), stable and that the basis is gravitational. That was only my guess however. You seem to indicate that comets are bound to the Sun, but occasionally spin around a planet before they head out to the Sun trajectory again. If there are some sources that say the "parent" is Saturn and some say "Sol" then they are both valid statements and you may need to Rank or timestamp those facts.
:::::::: * {{Q|Q42313338}} was interesting. Rather than relax the need of {{P|P397}} for that item (such as in {{P|P4501}}), maybe {{P|P397}} could be set to "no value" or "it's complicated" and have the exception stated in {{P|P397}} only? I think that would make the structure more rigid. 
:::::::: * To get out of this trouble is also the reason why I suggested {{P|P4501}} not to have constraints for "parent". [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:50, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::* {{Q|3076}} was for a period a "pseudomoon" to Jupiter before it collided with the planet. The dynamics of orbits is a very interesting subject. Most small objects that are trapped by the gravity well of large planets, tends to run away after some years. They may stay for decades, but sooner or later the kinetic energy they have let them run away. There are exceptions. Both moons or Mars are probably caught out of the asteroid belt. Many of Jupiters moons probably have the same origin. The exact definition of parent, I do not know if it is scientfically defined. My guess is that it is mainly a WD-template thing. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:25, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::: After more thoughts, I'm not found of the "originating" use of "parent". I did however open for discussion in  [[Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Astronomy#Definition_of_parent_and_child%3F]] in hopes of more expert opinions. I suggest we take the discussion there from now, since your original Albedo issue was solved. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:21, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

== Same person? ==

{{Q|16943844}} and {{Q|64980647}}? --[[User:Magnus Manske|Magnus Manske]] ([[User talk:Magnus Manske|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:45, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
*I'd think so, though it's unclear where the P569=1860 comes from. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 08:15, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::I've asked Mpaa about 1860 [https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/User_talk:Mpaa#Arthur_Devine_DoB here]. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:12, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I can't recall but 1849 seems correct, according to this [[s:Page:The_Catholic_encyclopedia_and_its_makers.djvu/73]]. I must have mistakenly taken the 1860 from the author below in such page.--[[User:Mpaa|Mpaa]] ([[User talk:Mpaa|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:56, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

:Without looking into the issue myself, I would point out a situation that I am familiar with - [[Q7376409]] and [[Q7376408]]. Both named Ruby Wright. Both blond. Both singers. Born 25 years apart. Died 5 years apart. The internet has the pair so mixed... But they are different people. It's one thing for common names like "John Smith", but I have even found "oddball" names that were not the same people despite similar details. [[User:Quakewoody|Quakewoody]] ([[User talk:Quakewoody|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:10, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::I think they are the same. References indicate same works for both of them.--[[User:Mpaa|Mpaa]] ([[User talk:Mpaa|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:18, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:: ''"one thing for common names"'' you say. I'd expect the "odd" names to be a bigger problem because people (as in "even otherwise legitimate publications") may easily assume the name to be unique. Once it's in a legitimate source it will spread. For "generic name" I'd expect a bit more care, but you're probably right that mixups are even more frequent, since those names are also frequent. Since WD is based on other sources, not here to decide what's right or wrong, I don't know how to get around the problem. Marking "deprecated" if found, but there is no way to stop it. It would help a lot if we at least can avoid merging items based on the mixup. On the other hand, how to make sure (when to create an item) that the already existing one with a similar name is actually the same, so maybe that's a reason for duplicates too? [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:20, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

*{{ping|Magnus Manske}} [[User:Billinghurst|Billinghurst]] did some more research, now at [[s:Author talk:Arthur Devine]]. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 04:17, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

== Merge? ==

{{Q|Q6515721}} and {{Q|Q61955092}} --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:51, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:No! Add {{P|1889}} instead. The former was the capital of the municipality with the same name. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:07, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:: There is no settlement called Spind in Norway. According to enwiki the capital of Spind municipality was Rødland (no Wikidata item). Besides {{Q|Q6515721}} have an area of 43 km² which is much too big to be a settlement in {{Q|Q490462}}, so I suppose both are the former municipality and should be merged. --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:33, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:::You are right. I was tricked by Spinds church. I thought I saw a village around it, but that is something else. And next to that "something else" is Rødland. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:35, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
::::I originally split the item, because while Spind municipality existed until 1965, Spind definitely still exists as "something" even after the municipalities merged. [https://snl.no/Spind Store norske leksikon] and [https://stadnamn.kartverket.no/fakta/938774 Kartverket] both call it a {{Q|Q814691}}, so I suppose we could do the same at {{Q|Q6515721}}. [[User:Einar Myre|Einar Myre]] ([[User talk:Einar Myre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:39, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: I changed the wrong and confusing {{P|P31}} {{Q|Q486972}} to {{P|P31}} {{Q|Q814691}} for {{Q|Q6515721}} and updated descriptions for no, da, en and deleted probably wrong descriptions for ar, de, nl.
::::::Probably a Geonames-ghost. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 13:08, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

== Update: deployment and migration plans for wb_terms redesign ==

Hello all,

This is an update regarding the progress and dates of migration of wb_terms table replacement solution in Wikidata production environment.

We have successfully put Wikidata production in the stage where property terms are stored in and written to both the old store (wb_terms table) and the new replacement store. Retrieving property terms is still being done using the old store.

'''The previously announced dates are no longer effective.''' No changes to tools are needed yet. Tools can continue to read from the old store (wb_terms table) for the moment. There will be a later announcement regarding the date when tools have to switch to reading property terms from the new store.

The next step will be to go to the stage of retrieving property terms from the new store, while we keep storing them in both stores. That step is blocked by a problem we discovered while testing that switch on beta cluster, and we are working on solving it at the moment ([[phab:T226008|Task on Phabricator]]).

As for item terms, and in the light of the new information about switching master node to a better host ([[phab:T227062|see Failover s8 (wikidatawiki) on Phabricator]]) that can actually host the migration of them till the end, we have as well decided to push out item terms migration on hold until after that failover is done and is stable.

The migration of all item terms will take weeks to finish, but it isn’t clear yet how long exactly. We will run it in several stages and there will be separate announcements regarding those stages to announce and inform about how to deal with it, in case it affects your work.

You can find more information regarding those dates and how to prepare for them in [[phab:T221765|this task]], and we have dedicated [[phab:project/view/4014|a board]] to receive and help with any questions from tool builders that need to update their tools accordingly.

In order to keep all discussions in one place, we kindly ask you to react or ask your questions [[phab:T221764|on Phabricator]].

Thanks

--[[User:Alaa Sarhan (WMDE)|Alaa Sarhan (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Alaa Sarhan (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:39, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

== [[User:AutomaticWelcomerBot|AutomaticWelcomerBot]] ==

{{Discussion top|{{Notdone}} Withdrawn by author.--[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 09:24, 11 July 2019 (UTC)}}

{{Request for permissions/links|AutomaticWelcomerBot}}<br />
'''Operator:''' {{User|JJBullet}}

<!--A SHORT bot function overview (max 1–2 lines); place the in-depth explanation below-->
'''Task/s:''' Welcomes users.

<!--Link to your online repository (github, bitbucket, fossil, etc.). Optional but highly encouraged.-->
'''Code:''' Not Created Yet

<!-- List full and complete function details here. -->
'''Function details:'''
* Welcomes new users with a custom, kind, heartwarming & homely welcome template. 
* Checks the [[Special:Log/newusers|User creation log]] for new users that have been created.
* Check if the new user have made any unnecessary edits & welcomes them with a different template explaining about some rules & guidelines for creating an item.
* Always updates the edit summary with suffix "- (Bot)"
* <s>Checks if the users username is inappropriate and if so warns them with a friendly template.</S>
-- [[User:JJBullet|JJBullet]] ([[User talk:JJBullet|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:20, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

: [[:en:Wikipedia:Perennial_proposals#Use_a_bot_to_welcome_new_users]] has some pertinent arguments for and against, and a pointer to an implementation (with certain restrictions). [[User:Bovlb|Bovlb]] ([[User talk:Bovlb|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:52, 26 June 2019 (UTC)
: Please see [[Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Bot/AutomaticWelcomerBot]]
: In my opinion in our highly automated environment we shouldn't use another bot to welcome potential contributers. I think a warmly human welcome (by a human user) will help us more. --[[User:Succu|Succu]] ([[User talk:Succu|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:59, 26 June 2019 (UTC)
::Please, no! The Wikimedia family has hundreds of projects and more or less ''all'' of them have a at least one system to welcome users. Sometimes it is a bot, sometimes it is an overfriendly ordinary user. Other times it is some function in the software. And I/we do not need that for ''every project'' we accidently visit or edit in. Red user_talks is not a big problem. Let them be! [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:48, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
:<s>Hell no.</s> --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 06:09, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
::I admit that was a bit rude, but that was my initial reaction. Those bots are rather annoying - you edit and then you get a notification you have to dismiss right away. And what if the username is actually appropriate? Now we are chasing them away. Also, are we going to be welcoming the spammers? Or if the username is now attacking someone, now we have a log entry to get rid of too. This is a solution for a problem we don't have. --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 06:13, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
:::{{Ping|Rschen7754}}I totally agree with what you are saying, it can get a bit annoying when spammers & vandals get a "heart-felt welcome" which they don't deserve, but at the same time how can we be sure that they <b>are</b> vandals before proof, so what i am saying it is nice to welcome people even if they do make mistakes.<b><span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:red"><b>~JJBullet~</b></span>]] [[User talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:DarkViolet"><b>{Talk}</b></span>]]</span></b> 10:28, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
:Now we get attention on the subject: on several wiki's you get extra "messages" when you did your 100th / 1000th / etc edit. Anoterh ''notification you have to dismiss right away''. I'm not too bothered after all, and for a bot-welcome I would suggest: better a bot then no welcome at all. But maybe we should define some rules when the ''overly friendly user'' gets too late with its ''welcome'', and the bot can kick in. For example after <x> days and <y> edits. [[User:Edoderoo|Edoderoo]] ([[User talk:Edoderoo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:03, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
::I agree with what you are saying Edoderoo that might be a lot easier for the task if the welcome is after <x> days and <y> edits, what do the rest think?<b><span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:red"><b>~JJBullet~</b></span>]] [[User talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:DarkViolet"><b>{Talk}</b></span>]]</span></b> 10:06, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
::: ''<x> days and <y> edits'' would still mean that users who don't know that they are editing Wikidata get messages (for example Wikipedia page moves). I think that's undesireable, and if we would want to send them messages they shouldn't get the same one as people who know that they are editing Wikidata. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 10:57, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
::::Ok so do you think i should just close this application, and forget about the bot?<b><span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:red"><b>~JJBullet~</b></span>]] [[User talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:DarkViolet"><b>{Talk}</b></span>]]</span></b> 11:00, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
:::::No, but it's likely necessary to write more code. You will have to go through the contribution history and count edits that only have the PHP7 tag and no other tags. I don't know the exact tag that page-moving users but it might also be possible to write a friendly message to those people only doing page-moves on Wikipedia that informs them about how this results in edits on Wikidata. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 11:12, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
::::::Soon all on every project will have PHP7 and then the tag will disappear. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:22, 27 June 2019 (UTC) 

: I'm one who finds automated welcomes annoying.  And, to my mind, the solution is not to tweak them to make them less annoying -- the solution is to not do them at all.
: The question should be, Is there a problem that needs solving here?  And that problem would presumably be, Do we need more editors here, and are there lots of would-be editors who are turned off because no one (not even an impersonal bot) welcomes them?  And (this is, again, just my opinion) I would think that, whether or not we actually need more editors, we certainly need dedicated, painstaking editors, for whom the work is largely its own reward.  If someone doesn't find editing Wikidata fulfulling enough without some special welcome, I doubt they'll find it fulfilling enough to do well at all. —[[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:35, 27 June 2019 (UTC)
::'''+1''', it makes more sense to welcome IPs manually if there's a reason for it: Thanks for good edits with a hint for future improvements (edit summary help, or similar), or reverted good faith edits (welcome + UW-1). A welcome bot cannot handle replies with questions from new users. &ndash;[[Special:Contributions/84.46.52.13|84.46.52.13]] 13:16, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

Now what I could see being useful would be a bot that creates a list of users - in userspace - that may have inappropriate names or edits, for administrators to review. --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 18:18, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

:i think you are importing english drama to wikidata. why? commons has a bot welcome without much ill effect. but maybe we should refrain from welcoming admins, we can give them a backlog list to review in lieu of welcome. [[User:Slowking4|Slowking4]] ([[User talk:Slowking4|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:14, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

::{{re|Rschen7754}} i  agree with what you are saying.... shall i re-open one for this kind of bot?<b><span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:red"><b>~JJBullet~</b></span>]] [[User talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:DarkViolet"><b>{Talk}</b></span>]]</span></b> 08:07, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
:::If you have an idea of how to find inappopriate edits in userspace, feel free to try that. But I am not sure how you could identify inappropriate usernames? [[Q2096511|This name]] means [[Q5873|this]] in my language. Would you report it and who would do the block? [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:46, 1 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Yes i would report it and in my opinion an Admin or crat / Wikidata staff would do the block?<b><span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:red"><b>~JJBullet~</b></span>]] [[User talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:DarkViolet"><b>{Talk}</b></span>]]</span></b> 08:22, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

::::: {{disagree}} (to "welcoming" everybody) I do [https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discussioni_utente:Taylor_49 NOT want to be welcome] to wikis that I visit accidentally. [[User:Taylor 49|Taylor 49]] ([[User talk:Taylor 49|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:27, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{disagree}} to welcoming everybody. The bot would welcome more users than it should and the welcome template does encourage users to talk to the user who posted the welcome message. Bots can not answer such messages.--[[User:Snaevar|Snaevar]] ([[User talk:Snaevar|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:42, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{not done}} as all the comments i have seen are oppose, can an admin or sysop please close this--[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:#04b4ae;font-family:Freestyle Script"><big><big>JJ</big></big></span>]] [[User_talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:#04b4ae;font-family:Freestyle Script"><big><big>Bullet</big></big></span>]] 07:55, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Discussion bottom}}
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:05, 11 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== UsernameReviewerBot ==

<noinclude>[[Category:Requests for permissions/Bot|UsernameReviewerBot]]</noinclude>
=== [[User:UsernameReviewerBot|UsernameReviewerBot]] ===
{{Request for permissions/links|UsernameReviewerBot}}<br />
'''Operator:''' {{User|JJBullet}}

<!--A SHORT bot function overview (max 1–2 lines); place the in-depth explanation below-->
'''Task/s:''' Creates a list of users - in userspace - that may have inappropriate names or edits, and sends them to administrators for review.

<!--Link to your online repository (github, bitbucket, fossil, etc.). Optional but highly encouraged.-->
'''Code:''' N/A

<!-- List full and complete function details here. -->
'''Function details:''' Creates a list of usernames (In userspace) that may be inappropriate or that may have made inappropriate edits / be offensive to another user, sends them to admins / crats for review. 
--<b><span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:red"><b>~JJBullet~</b></span>]] [[User talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:DarkViolet"><b>{Talk}</b></span>]]</span></b> 09:10, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

:why are you importing english wikipedia drama? is there any evidence of inappropriate user names? what is your criteria for inappropriate? what is your criteria for inappropriate edits? is this scope creep? [[User:Slowking4|Slowking4]] ([[User talk:Slowking4|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:28, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
::Do you need to be so rude? i am simply carrying on with my [[WD:Requests_for_permissions/Bot/AutomaticWelcomerBot|other request]]<b><span style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:JJBullet|<span style="color:red"><b>~JJBullet~</b></span>]] [[User talk:JJBullet|<span style="color:DarkViolet"><b>{Talk}</b></span>]]</span></b> 10:31, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:::would you care to answer the questions? you do not have a consensus, see also [[Wikidata:Requests for comment/Adopt a username policy]] - [[User:Slowking4|Slowking4]] ([[User talk:Slowking4|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:32, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

* You don't need to have bot permissions to read the list of user names. I would propose that you do the first 5 cases manually and then we see whether that's something worth automating. Apart from that, while it's nice to have a link in the project chat, the actual request should still be at requests for permission. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 11:08, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
*:The bot may have gain of the <code>apihighlimits</code> rights. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:11, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

{{Discussion bottom}}

== Uncertain date ==

{{Q|Q44979759}} have 1 July 2011 as birth date. However, is there various website that have 30 June, other 1 July. On the Knyazeva YouTube channel was uploaded today 4 July a video which celebrate her birthday... So, when Anastasiya Knyazeva was born? 30 June, 1 July or 4 July? --[[Special:Contributions/151.95.23.253|151.95.23.253]] 17:55, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
*No idea. From a Wikidata perspective, you can add all dates, each with the reference that supports it. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 18:01, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
* Day of video upload on YouTube is not the same the birthday. According post on [https://www.instagram.com/p/BzXNOR1BynG/ her Instagram] she clebrated birthday on 1 July. The same is in [https://www.elle.ru/celebrities/novosty/nazvano-imya-samoi-krasivoi-devochki-v-mire-id6729381/ Russian magazine's article]. --[[User:Ksc~ruwiki|Ksc~ruwiki]] ([[User talk:Ksc~ruwiki|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:32, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

== dewiki:Frauenzentrum Westberlin and enwiki:West Berlin Women's Center ==

:''Moved from [[WD:RfD]]''
These two objects both describe the same entity, but I can't merge them. Could someone please help me? -- [[Special:Contributions/86.180.185.196|86.180.185.196]] 17:35, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{done}} --[[User:GPSLeo|GPSLeo]] ([[User talk:GPSLeo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:31, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:02, 11 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Comments ==

I notice that some people can add comments to edits, how can I do that? I would like to let people know why I may be reversing an edit, they should see the rationale so they do not add it again. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:19, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: In history, when you hit "undo" or "restore", you can write the explanation. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:02, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:<small>This section was archived on a request by: --[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 09:22, 11 July 2019 (UTC)</small>

== Format fix property proposal? ==

Can someone fix [[Wikidata:Property proposal/begin and end of covered period ; covered period]] so the discussion section appears?  There's something funky with the ping templates but I can't figure out what it is. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:07, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:Fixed. Not sure what exactly it was... --[[User:Yair rand|Yair rand]] ([[User talk:Yair rand|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:48, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:59, 11 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Merge ==

Shouldn't [[Q803626]] and [[Q23932292]] be merged? Sorry if this is not the correct place to suggest a merge. --[[Special:Contributions/129.240.128.243|129.240.128.243]] 08:14, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{Done}} --[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 08:50, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:<s>Also it would be best to suggest a merge at the [[Wikidata:Requests_for_deletions|RFD]] [[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 08:49, 11 July 2019 (UTC)</s> <small>sorry, my mistake--[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 09:04, 11 July 2019 (UTC)</small>
:: No, that's where ''deletions'' are requested, not merges. A merge can be conducted by anybody. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:59, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I was literally about to strike that out but you got there before me, thanks :) --[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 09:01, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:16, 11 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== John Pierce (Q65054514) ==

That person, [[:en:John Pierce (tenor)]] - too many John Pierce - is the same as [[:de:John Pierce (Sänger)]]. Sorry, I failed to make the connection when creating. --[[User:Gerda Arendt|Gerda Arendt]] ([[User talk:Gerda Arendt|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:19, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:This is just my thoughts, but why would we need to deal with stuff from outside wikis? correct my if im wrong?--[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 09:20, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
*See [[Help:Merge]]. Items are [[Q15821573]] and [[Q65054514]]. ----- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:49, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

{{done}}--[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 09:55, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:<small>This section was archived on a request by: --[[User:JJBullet|<font color="#0000EE">'''JJBullet'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:JJBullet|✉]]❫ 09:55, 11 July 2019 (UTC)</small>
== Edit filter to prevent edits that are obviously wrong? ==

Why don't we activate an editing filter that prevents edits like the following, that are obviously wrong, to be entered into Wikidata in the first place?

[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q3466333&diff=969248513&oldid=950906300]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q2170038&diff=890346270&oldid=875738526]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q949184&diff=965794020&oldid=955692265]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q142216&diff=927241884&oldid=923911664]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q849224&diff=968835303&oldid=964623332]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q62100202&diff=887805425&oldid=887805261]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q62100202&diff=887805425&oldid=887805261]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q3180453&diff=915715471&oldid=912762324]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q12183149&diff=604787298&oldid=556175287]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q2381616&diff=900675259&oldid=817996469]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q16650885&diff=964653737&oldid=889064929]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q60211431&diff=822664619&oldid=822664417]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q16266654&diff=578776264&oldid=578775591]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q5709090&diff=377291548&oldid=342745392]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q29010854&diff=933172779&oldid=933172268]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q19832963&diff=860633871&oldid=801105193]
[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q5984686&diff=865668409&oldid=852709661]

These are just examples on when a {{Q|Q16521}} or a {{Q|Q11424}} has been used for {{P|P27}}, probably by mistake as the name is similar to the name of the correct object. One of the edits in the list above is ''almost three years'' old, and has not yet been corrected! 
--[[User:Larske|Larske]] ([[User talk:Larske|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:39, 28 June 2019 (UTC)
: Edit filters have very limited checking features and their maintenance is restricted to sysops. On the other hand, the system for constraints was developed for Wikidata and is still evolving, unlike edit filters developed mainly for Wikipedias. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:17, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

::Sorry if I used the wrong terminology. It doesn't have to be an "edit filter" if that has a particular meaning in the Wikimedia context. 
::I rephrase my concern: Why don't we prevent, or automatically (by a bot) revert, edits that obviously violates the most obvious contraints like a {{P|P27}} must not be a {{Q|Q16521}}? It is very bad that such edits that ''can be detected at once remain uncorrected after months or years''. --[[User:Larske|Larske]] ([[User talk:Larske|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:04, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

::: It's good that you've found these anomalies.
::: The first thing to ask is whether there's a proper, governing constraint.  Clearly, the target of {{P|27}} should be a {{Q|7275}} -- and, in fact, there ''is'' such a constraint at [[Property:P27|P27]].
::: <s>The second thing to ask, then, is: Why is the constraint not working, in that (for example) the P27 claim at {{Q|3466333}} is not flagged as violating it?</s> <small>[Never mind, the constraint seems to be working fine.  I suspect the reason it seemed not to be working for me was due to an unrelated issue in my environment.]</small>
::: The third thing to ask is, <s>if the constraint were working,</s> why have some of the items you mentioned been in violation of their constraints for so long?  Are there "you can help" / "things you can work on" lists for constraint violations?  Do volunteers need to be prodded to whittle down those lists?
::: And then, finally, to your specific suggestion: should there be a mechanism to simply prevent edits which supply new or modified claims which violate certain (or all) constraints?
::: Me, I don't know the answer to any of these questions except the first, but perhaps someone else here does. —[[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:56, 28 June 2019 (UTC) <small>updated 11:31, 30 June 2019 (UTC)</small>

::::Two answers: 1) there are reports for most/all constraints, listed in the talk page of the property; for example, here's a report for [[Wikidata:Database reports/Constraint violations/P39|P39]]. 2) We should not prevent edits that break constraints. In general, constraints are simple and the world is complex; the consequence of preventing the addition of truthful information because it is outside the compass of a constraint, is greater than the consequences of addition of data that breaks the constraint. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:04, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

:::::Well, reports are fine if they are acted upon. But in reality faulty statements can be left uncorrected for years as you can see among the few examples I listed. I understand, that not all existing constraints may be appropriate to use for stopping edits, so they can not be stopped "in general". But what is your opinion about when people enter a {{Q|Q16521}} or a {{Q|Q11424}} as the value for the {{P|P27}} property just because they have identical or similar labels. I found it very strange that such entries are not prevented. 
:::::Maybe we need ''another type of constraint'' that do not list what is acceptable (because there may always be exceptions in "complex world" as you say), but what is '''not''' allowed (i.e. not as in never, with no exceptions), based on experience of common mistakes like the ones I listed. Or, if not stopped, at least "delayed" with a "CAPTCHA" that humans, but not bots, can successfully pass if they ''actively confirms that there is not a mistake that they want to enter an {{Q|Q16521}} (or subclass thereof) as the value for the {{P|P27}} property''. Do you think that would be possible? 
:::::Or maybe such constraints already exist but are not used. We have {{P|P27}}/{{P|P2302}}/{{Q|Q21510865}} with six listed {{P|P2308}} and {{P|P2309}} equals {{Q|Q21503252}}, but I guess what I am thinking about is a number of {{P|P2308}} with {{P|P2309}} equals "is '''definitely not''' {{Q|Q21503252}}". The {{P|P2308}} listed here can of course not be all classes except those listed above, but ''just those where experience has shown that mistakes are common''. I think {{Q|Q16521}} and {{Q|Q11424}} would be two of my candidates for such a list for the {{P|P27}} property. Suggestions for such "commonly mistaken" {{P|P2308}} can of course be found in the constraint violations reports that we have today. Do you see what I mean?
:::::I also have a questions on the reports you refer to. You refer to the report for P39 when my examples were all about P27. If I look at [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Database_reports/Constraint_violations/P27#Value_type_Q7275,_Q57662985,_Q6266,_Q161243,_Q148837,_Q2775969 the Constraints violation report for P27], I can not find all objects in my example list. The report says the violation count is 10914 and not all violations are listed. At the bottom of the first list it says: "Too many results. 5913 records skipped.". And if I try to run the "SPARQL" mentioned on the talk pages it results in timeout, and the "SPARQL (new)" question only lists 299 items. {{ping|Tagishsimon}} What am I doing wrong here? --[[User:Larske|Larske]] ([[User talk:Larske|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:00, 30 June 2019 (UTC)
:Bad idea. Wikidata allready has implementations in the Wikibase extension which enforce constraints. Even if that is unfinished or has some bugs in it, then the extension should be fixed. Abuse filter is not the fix for that. Also, I protest to the use of the term "Edit filter" for the Abuse filter. That is just enwiki jargon, based on different policies than this project has.--[[User:Snaevar|Snaevar]] ([[User talk:Snaevar|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:42, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

== Q482980 proposed to rename in Japanese language ==

[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:%E4%BA%95%E6%88%B8%E7%AB%AF&oldid=968607528 As announced on wikidata:project chat in Japanese language], there is a proposal/request-for-edit in progress on [[Talk:Q482980]] by a Japanese editor: rename [[Q482980]] from (A) "作家" {{languageicon|ja}} to (B) "著作者" {{languageicon|ja}}, or <u>the copyrighted author of things</u>. The proposer lacks editing rights, and the proposal is in two folds to "swap" page labels between two wikidata pages as:
* [[Q482980]]  needs to be relabeled as (B) "著作者" {{languageicon|ja}} and should be wikilinked on jawp to (B) [[:w:ja:著作者]] as well. Currently wikilinked to (A) or on jawp [[:w:ja:作家]], and enwp link [[:w:en:Author]] should remain as is. The proposer is drafting and planning to rewrite jawp page [[:w:ja:著作者]] extensively from the viewpoint of law field.
* [[Q11620855]], currently linked to (B) on jawp ([[w:ja:著作者]]), needs to be re-labeled as (A) "作家" {{languageicon|ja}}. FYI, (A) includes [[Property:P952|ISCO occupation code]], as a creator of things. Please join and drop your thoughts. 　--[[User:Omotecho|Omotecho]] ([[User talk:Omotecho|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:36, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

*You might want to use [[Wikidata:井戸端]] instead. 
:If the page is protected, you could use {{tl|editprotected}} or ping the protecting admin. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:11, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

== problems with query API ==

Dear Wikidatas, 

in my Python-code I use the module "SPARQLwrapper" referring to https://query.wikidata.org/sparql for retrieving a bunch of features on authors of research articles. It worked for many weeks. However since about two weeks I get Error messages, mostly "HTTP Error 403: Forbidden" and some times some Error 402 (?) due to too many requests. Then yesterday afternoon (Berlin time) it worked again for half an hour.    

Whats going on? How can I fix my code? Or do I just have to wait till you fix something behind the scene? I tried to join the Wednesday tech-chat but I couldn't manage to join the channel on freenode.

Looking for you reply! Thank you very much in advance!
Cheers! Eva from Cologne <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding unsigned comment added by [[Special:Contributions/93.131.71.53|93.131.71.53]] ([[User talk:93.131.71.53|talk]]) 07:42, 4 July 2019‎</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP -->

: I had this problem when I hadn't specified a user agent in SPARQLWrapper. When I [https://github.com/Vesihiisi/Hauki/commit/4a72c167d561837c330d35bf443a3ec7790b1f62 added it to my tool], I stopped getting 403 errors. --[[User:Vesihiisi|Vesihiisi]] ([[User talk:Vesihiisi|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:52, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

: Are you following the [[meta:User-Agent policy|User-Agent policy]]? We’ve recently started to enforce this more strictly, I believe; specifically, [https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikidata/2019-June/013161.html the default python-requests user agent is currently blocked]. (Even if the problem turns out to be something else, sending an informative User-Agent header is good practice anyways.) --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:56, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

<noinclude>[[Category:Requests for permissions/Bot|UsernameReviewerBot]]</noinclude>
: ha! that worked! thank you a lot! Eva

== Can we create a wikipedia page for a new company? ==

I wanted to know, whether we can create a Wikipedia page for a new company. I had tried that a few months ago, but the page was deleted, and my IP also got blocked. And I specifically don't know why?
:Since I do not know what the company is and I do not know which version of Wikipedia you were editing and which IP you were using, it is impossible to tell here. But most likely the problem was that the subject of the article don't fulfill the standards we would like to see at Wikipedia. [[:en:Wikipedia:Notability]] for example tell: "Wikipedia articles cover notable topics—those that have gained sufficiently significant attention by the world at large and over a period of time, and are not outside the scope of Wikipedia. We consider evidence from reliable and independent sources to gauge this attention." New companies normally do not fullfill such demands. And articles created by persons close to the subject, often look more like marketing of the subject than an encyclopedic article. That can also be a reason why it was deleted. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 07:12, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

::[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:List_of_bad_article_ideas List_of_bad_article_ideas] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Why_was_the_page_I_created_deleted%3F Why_was_the_page_I_created_deleted%3F] It occurs frequently that self-promotional articles are created of naivety or ignorance and deleted short time later. But you should not have got banned for that. Probably you tried to re-post your article several times or edited many pages to link to your page. As about why, there is a design flaw in wikipedia: when an article is deleted then it vanishes from both the recent changes and your contributions. But the act is visible in the deletion log. The sysop performing the deletion is supposed to give reasons for that. But your case is easy to guess: inappropriate self-promotion. The answer to the core question is NO. Do NOT try to create a wikipedia page for your company, do NOT retry with other public wiki or other IP. Even if your company becomes notable then you should NOT start an article or substantially enhance such if it already exists. [[User:Taylor 49|Taylor 49]] ([[User talk:Taylor 49|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:08, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

== Bot that changes <nowiki>[[Q12345]]</nowiki> to <nowiki>{{Q|12345}}</nowiki> ==

I frequently see it that people who are used to the style of links within Wikipedia use links like <nowiki>[[Q12345]]</nowiki> inside discussion on this project. Likely, because they don't know about our templates. I'm of the opinion that the template is always better then the interwiki-link. I feel it would be great to have a bot that automatically changes <nowiki>[[Q12345]]</nowiki> to <nowiki>{{Q|12345}}</nowiki>. How do other people feel about the issue? [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 09:03, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
*Not really, personally I use [[Q123]] when the label isn't helpful. What I do find annoying are QIDs without any links at all. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:06, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::Even if the label isn't helpful, what use does it have to be shown the number? [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 09:24, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Normally, there should be some text around it explaining the item. In any case, I don't think a bot (or a user) should edit other users signed comments. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:35, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Even if there's text around it explaining it I don't see how the <nowiki>{{Q|12345}}</nowiki> form is worse. I generally do believe that edits that fix spelling mistakes or formatting issues are okay. I spent a lot of time on StackExchange where that happens very frequently and the advantage of the Wiki system is that editing is possible. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 10:15, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::A wiki talk page isn't exactly a wiki article. Given the problems we have had around here with people doing it .. let's not. There is actually no way to be sure what users see when you add <nowiki>{{Q|12345}}</nowiki>. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 10:27, 2 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: I agree that mass-editing discussions should be avoided and StackExchange culture and answering is different from here. If nothing else, the history would be a mess. It could possibly be a feature of the editor (remember {{Q|Q1042885}}?) so inexperienced users would be asked to (auto)change before saving. Another possibility is to have a WD plugin or local browser plugin to show any matching ID (template or not) the way you perfer it: Something alike "Descriptions: Show the description of..." in [[Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets|gadgets]]. Anyone knows if it is available? The downside of local fixup is that there may be confusion in the discussion when you see different things. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:59, 3 July 2019 (UTC) 
:I kinda wish the template could pull in the number only where the relevant description is missing, as I agree in most instances the numbers are not that useful. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:11, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{Ping|Circeus}} To me, seeing the number is quite important. The same description may be used both for Q and P and it's very relevant to separate those in a glance. When talking about possible duplicates, it's also needed to keep track of items with similar names but different numbers. I "always" use Q-template (e.g. {{Q|Q12345}}), but maybe that's annoying to someone. There us also Q'-template ({{Q'|Q12345}}) and Q+-template ({{Q+|Q12345}}) and maybe more (one showing only number but having details when hovering?) so the idea is that the writer decides which they think is most relevant at each case. [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:59, 3 July 2019 (UTC) 

*I used to use <nowiki>{{Q|12345}}</nowiki> first time in discussion in order to help other editors to know the meaning, but not for the further appearances. Thanks by the proposal. [[User:Amadalvarez|Amadalvarez]] ([[User talk:Amadalvarez|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:29, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

: Using regular links and not {{tl|Q}} is also a good idea when the discussion is about the identity or labels of the items themselves – using their current labels for them can make the discussion very confusing to read in the future (“should [[Property:P143|imported from]] be changed to be Wikimedia project-specific?” vs. “should {{P|P143}} be changed to be Wikimedia project-specific?”). See the topic right above this one ([[#Same person?]]) for another example – using {{tl|Q}} for items with the same label isn’t very helpful. --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:54, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:: My first reaction is that this sounds like a problem with the template. Ideally, the template would show both the label that was applicable when the template was first used and the current label. In any case I'm not advocating that the form <code><nowiki>[[Property:P143|imported from]]</nowiki></code> should be edited by the bot. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 21:09, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

* Perhaps this could be done with JavaScript, so one can choose to use it or not? Might be expensive though, don't know. Best would be if {{Q|Q11305696}} displayed the label in the user language with fallback. Unfortunately, it's half-broken for Wikidata. --[[User:Marsupium|Marsupium]] ([[User talk:Marsupium|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:12, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

=== So again: How to link to a section if that is using <nowiki>{{Q|XXX}}</nowiki>? ===
If there can't have a user-friendly solution of this question, then I would consider nominating [[:zh:Template:Q]] for deletion. --[[User:Liuxinyu970226|Liuxinyu970226]] ([[User talk:Liuxinyu970226|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:50, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
* This makes no sense at all. (1) You begin the header here with "again," but this appears to be your first comment on this thread. (2) You refer to a template on the Chinese-language Wikipedia, but this discussion has been about a template on Wikidata. (3) The fact that a template might not be entirely suitable for use in a section header is not a reason to delete the template. (4) You should still always be able to get a suitable link to a section header by left-clicking in the table of contents to go to that section, then copy-pasting from the URL bar. - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:53, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{ping|Jmabel}} I was asked at [[Template talk:Q]] for several times, and until your comment, no answers. --[[User:Liuxinyu970226|Liuxinyu970226]] ([[User talk:Liuxinyu970226|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:03, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
::# The account you are editing under has no posts at [[Template talk:Q]]. Were you editing on a different account?
::# What about my points 2, 3, & 4? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:15, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:::What the... there is no trace whatsoever of '''any such discussion by anyone at all''' either at [[[Template talk:Q]] or at [[:zh:Template talk:Q]]... [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:22, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

== Adjectives ==

Is it legal to have adjectives as items? There is an item about "small" [[Q24245823]] but none about "big". Also we have two items about "case sensitivity" [[Q55121384]] and [[Q257869]] and one item about "case sensitive" [[Q55121148]]. Are adjective items desirable? [[User:Taylor 49|Taylor 49]] ([[User talk:Taylor 49|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:55, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
* If, as for {{Q|24245823}}, Wikiquote has a page for an adjective, aren't we pretty much obligated to have an item? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:58, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
*Yeah, we pull items from a lot of different wikis that can cause apparent duplicates with lexeme. I've applied {{P|6254}} to {{Q|Q24245823}}. the other two seem to be strictly because of stackoverflow tags that happen to be written in the adjectival form. I would straight up merge those with the matching qualities' items. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:35, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

== Help with [[Q65052377]] ==

What needs to be changed for the reference to Haida people to work? Not sure if I am using the wrong property, or if something needs to be changed at the Haida people item. Also, what is the appropriate way to connect Northwest Coast art to this item? Right now it's "genre" which doesn't seem quite right. Thanks! [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:03, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Calliopejen1}} Haida is defined as an "ethnic group" (as are most US indigenous peoples in WD). {{Q|Q41710}} is (ultimately) a subclass of {{Q|Q16334295}}. The property {{P|P2596}} wants a value that is a {{Q|Q2472587}} or a {{Q|Q8432}}.  There are two ways to fix this. Quick and easy, make Haida <instance of> both {{Q|Q41710}} and {{Q|Q2472587}} "plurality of persons considered as a whole, from a government perspective", which I think is correct.  We could also get consensus to add  {{Q|Q41710}} as a valid value for {{P|P2596}}. I'd vote for doing both.
:I'd also make {{Q|Q7840353}} an instance of {{Q|Q2472587}}, since a recognized tribe certainly has a political aspect, and eventually add <instance of> "people" to all other indigenous peoples in the US that are not formally recognized tribes. 
:Typically, "art of [place]" isn't a genre, but a subclass of art. However, {{Q|Q2864736}} is an art genre, with subclass {{Q|Q420716}}. So {{Q|Q7059995}} could be a subclass of either "art" (in which case this mask in an instance of it or part of it), or it could be a genre, subclass of "tribal art", equivalent to Getty AAT's [http://vocab.getty.edu/page/aat/300017594 Northwest Coast Native American styles].  I think either one is valid as long as we're consistent. We have very little coverage of Native American Indian art in Wikidata, so we can set an initial standard with what we do here. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:39, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
::(And we could of course have two items for "Northwest Coast art", one a subclass of art and one the genre linked to it), which I think is good ontology. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:44, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:::{{ping|PKM}} I am so new at Wikidata that my ability to weigh in here is limited. I will say that the ethnicity issue is a common problem I've encountered not just for Native American/Alaska Native art but also for any art or craft that is associated with an ethnic group (e.g. {{Q|Q3343234}}, {{Q|Q65088082}}). Re: Northwest Coast art, {{Q|Q7059995}} is associated with a geographic region, but it is a style of artwork -- I wouldn't call it "art of [place]". It probably could be a subclass of tribal art, though some non-Natives are creating artworks in this style as well (see e.g. [https://www.sealaskaheritage.org/node/748], [https://www.juneauempire.com/news/exploring-the-gray-area-between-cultural-appreciation-and-appropriation-in-juneau/]). [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:17, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
::::{{ping|Calliopejen1}} Thanks for those links.  We do have {{Q|Q7936583}} I missed it before. It's a <subclass of> visual arts, and has no subclasses of its own. 
::::While we ''tend'' to use Getty AAT as a reference vocabulary for decorative arts, where we lack anything better, we don't follow it uncritically.  We have more or less deferred the entire question of "styles, periods, and cultures" ([http://www.getty.edu/vow/AATHierarchy?find=northwest+coast&logic=AND&note=&page=1&subjectid=300015646 hierarchy here]). FWIW, Getty does not attempt to group "tribal art" across geographic regions. 
::::We have the concept {{Q|Q1792644}}, <different from> {{Q|Q483394}}. {{Q|Q1792644}} is used very loosely for a lot of different concepts, but it would certainly be appropriate for {{Q|Q7059995}}.  We don't have a specific property that goes with this concept, but we might propose such a property - we have {{P|P136}}, {{P|P135}}, and {{P|149}}, all of which are adjacent to "style" but not exactly the same.  For now, we can make {{Q|Q7059995}} <instance of> "style" and reference the Getty AAT item. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:49, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Another property you may find useful is {{P|P2341}} for crafts and so on (not individual objects). - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:01, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Certainstars}} Do you have any thoughts on this? - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:44, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

== "Collaborating on the sum of all knowledge across languages" ==

Hi! I really try not to spam the chat too much with pointers to my work on the Abstract Wikipedia, but this one is probably also interesting for Wikidata contributors. It is the [https://wikipedia20.pubpub.org/pub/vyf7ksah draft for a chapter] submitted to [https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia@20 Koerner and Reagle's Wikipedia@20 book], and talks about knowledge diversity under the light of centralisation through projects such as Wikidata. Public commenting phase is open until July 19, and very welcome: [https://wikipedia20.pubpub.org/pub/vyf7ksah "Collaborating on the sum of all knowledge across languages"]. --[[User:Denny|Denny]] ([[User talk:Denny|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:49, 6 July 2019 (UTC)

: Thank you very much for share it, {{u-|Denny}}! I have pending to review it and give some comments if I have something useful to contribute. Regards, [[User:Ivanhercaz|Ivanhercaz]] ([[User talk:Ivanhercaz|Talk]]) 00:09, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Thank you! --[[User:Denny|Denny]] ([[User talk:Denny|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:10, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

== Stated-as as a qualifier on dates ==

[[special:diff/975860943]] was done because Chinese dates could be ambiguous. In this case, it can be assumed to be a Gregorian calendar date, but there's still a small chance it's a {{w|Chinese calendar}} date since the date is written in Chinese characters instead of Arabic numerals. But stated-as is not allowed on dates. Could you please help present this info in a correct way, or allow stated-as as a qualifier?--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:02, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
:A similar issue occur with dates of the {{Q|181974}} (the year starts in September, so if it's only down to a year...) [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:45, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
* Use {{P|P1683}}. --[[User:Marsupium|Marsupium]] ([[User talk:Marsupium|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:20, 10 July 2019 (UTC) PS: {{ping|Roy17}} --[[User:Marsupium|Marsupium]] ([[User talk:Marsupium|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:21, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{re|Marsupium}} thx!--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:45, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:45, 12 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== EntitySchema Sandbox? ==

Who can tell me that where to test this namespace? --[[Special:Contributions/125.38.13.0|125.38.13.0]] 07:37, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: [[EntitySchema:E123]] is the sandbox entity schema page. --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:29, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
{{section resolved|[[User:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:34, 12 July 2019 (UTC)}}
== From a parliamentary group to independent or to other parliamentary group ==

[[Q54152815#P39]] She was elected as a candidate of a political party. After she elected, she was part of this party's parliamentary group. But then she left the party and the group and she became independent. If someone reads the statement may think that she was independent all the parliamentary term. (Maybe someone realize what happen by reading [[Q54152815#P102]]?) [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:24, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:You could state {{P|39}} twice, with end time 2018-02-02 for {{Q|20773826}} in the 1st statement, and start time 2018-02-02 for {{Q|327591}} in the 2nd statement with another reference adopted from {{P|102}}. &ndash;[[Special:Contributions/84.46.52.13|84.46.52.13]] 15:16, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

[[Q52773609#P39]] He was elected as a candidate of a political party. After he elected, he was part of this party's parliamentary group. But then he left the party and the group and he became independent. One year later he joined the parliamentary group of other party. If someone reads the statement may think that he was in the second party all the parliamentary term. (Maybe someone realize what happen by reading [[Q52773609#P102]]?) [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:35, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

:See, for instance {{Q|267648}} - 4 statements for his P39 for his 57th Parliament membership, as he moved from one political grouping to the next. This, I suggest, is the model to be followed. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:25, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

::(By which I mean, the model to be followed on wikidata. As an IRL political strategy, possibly less so.) --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:26, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Seems like these statement get more and more out of hand. We need to get this closer to a model with actual start and end dates for positions. We can't just mirror everyones database artifacts. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 18:33, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Well, good luck with that. Presuming you want the electoral group, having multiple position statements seems unavoidable. This sort of organisation has not been found to cause issues with e.g. UK politician reports; and the handling of UK MPs & reports theron is in advance of any country on wikidata. "Seems ... out of hand" is an interesting but unempirical objection. Can you point to an actual downside - for instance, a report that's no possible because of the data structure? --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:55, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

{{ping|Jura1}} I aggree. And the cases are not so many, we can easily find a model. Where can we open a discussion about it? [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:48, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

:"Easily". I've ordered popcorn. On you go, Xaris333: easily find a better solution which represents the changing electoral group membership of an individual as part of their holding of a position. Alternately, per Jura, specify what exactly you think the practical problem with such an approach is, ideally with examples of the failure modes it causes. Those of us who have gone here before await the insight which evaded us. You could try discussing it at [[Wikidata talk:WikiProject every politician]]. I know Jura a) doesn't like the every bit of every politician; doesn't like subclasses of MP for British MPs; and now does not like multiple P39s reflecting membership of different electoral groups. So all this will probably cause them lots of pain; but there you go. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:03, 3 July 2019 (UTC)

::That's so disappointed... [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:53, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Easily. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:04, 3 July 2019 (UTC)
::::{{ping|Tagishsimon}} These are just baseless claims. Please refrain from such accusations. Apparently some users don't like to hear that they are adding unsourced claims and that others ask them for references .. <br>Maybe it's time to learn how sourcing of claims works and not depreciate statements that don't appear suitable to you [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q16943844&diff=973393506&oldid=973393416].  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 14:40, 4 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::Here where I live, electoral groups are not so important as they maybe are in other nations. Technically you can be elected for a political party, without any membership in that party. On national level, you can technically leave a electoral group and become {{Q|327591}}, but you cannot technically not join another group, even if you cooperate with them. And you can definitely not form a new group midterm. Another way to group MP's are according to their constituencies. On national level, they often meet in such groups. They cooperate in regional matters and it is not unusual that an MP challenge the whip on matters that are consideered important on regional level. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 06:44, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

== Balustrading To Area Of Municipal Buildings Municipal Buildings (Q17551052) ==

Where did this title come from? Nowhere I know, especially when the linked Historic England page says totally different. I'm going to remove it from the Commons category. [[User:Rodhullandemu|Rodhullandemu]] ([[User talk:Rodhullandemu|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:48, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata items for Women in Red's events and redlists ==

Women in Red is having a conversation regarding whether there would be value in creating Wikidata items for Women in Red's events, most of which are virtual but some are in-person. There are 120+ events to date; each has a "meetup" page on en-wp as a subpage to Women in Red. (Example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Women_in_Red/Meetup/127) There are additional events (virtual & in-person) in the 23 other language communities of Women in Red. 

Women in Red is also discussing whether there would be value in creating Wikidata items for our 400+ "redlists". These are subpages of Women in Red which include redlinked notable women. (Example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Women_in_Red/Missing_articles_by_occupation/Educators) Some of these redlists are "crowd-sourced", others are Listeria-generated, others are based on biographical dictionaries, and so forth. Besides the en-wp redlists, there are those which have been created by the 23 other language versions of Women in Red.

If we were to go forward with creating these Wikidata items, we would include "on focus list of Wikimedia project" (P5008) : "Wikipedia:WikiProject Women in Red" (Q23875215) on the Wikidata items. I don't know if other groups/communities doing this. What are your thoughts about us doing it? --[[User:Rosiestep|Rosiestep]] ([[User talk:Rosiestep|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:25, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
:I think that is what the property is created for. The examples at {{P|5008}} are exactly the same as you want to use it. --[[User:GPSLeo|GPSLeo]] ([[User talk:GPSLeo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:41, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Rosiestep}} We have 43 items that are ''<instance of>'' {{Q|Q16022392}} going back to 2015, so that seems to establish a precedent that events meet notability requirements. I don't see that any of them have associated lists, though - how are you thinking of structuring those? - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:29, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{ping|PKM}}, I thought Art+Feminism and/or Black Lunch Table had associated lists, so maybe I should check with them? --[[User:Rosiestep|Rosiestep]] ([[User talk:Rosiestep|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:56, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
:::{{ping|Rosiestep}} That sounds good; I don't see any linked lists on their Wikidata items. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:01, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

== Merging request ==

[[Q65122684]] and [[Q54604086]] are one and the same disambiguation page in different languages. [[User:Francesco 13|Francesco 13]] ([[User talk:Francesco 13|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:23, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
*See [[Help:Merge]] --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:25, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Done}} I did done it [[User:Moebeus|Moebeus]] ([[User talk:Moebeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:39, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Moebeus|Moebeus]] ([[User talk:Moebeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:39, 13 July 2019 (UTC)}}
== Part of goverment ==

[[Q2792539#P39]] -> Cypriot Minister of the Interior. Which qualifier can I use to show that was a minister in {{Q|1719844}}? [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:41, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

:Possibly {{P|5054}}, or {{P|463}}, both of which are listed as valid qualifiers for {{P|39}}? Looking at the count of uses, we see:

:*{{P|463}} - https://w.wiki/5oZ - 794 uses
:*{{P|5054}} - https://w.wiki/5ob - 4280 uses

:fwiw, EveryPolitician seems to make do with a comparison of ministry dates (e.g. for {{Q|30178117}} and position dates to provide e.g. [[Wikidata:WikiProject every politician/United Kingdom/Cabinet/Q30178117]] so there's a sense in which membership qualifiers within a position statement are redundant. Equally, it does seem to me desirable that we have a standard for this, which I don't see in [[Wikidata:WikiProject_every_politician/Political_data_model#Cabinet_memberships]] ... it does seem like a natural qualifier. One to consider, {{ping|Oravrattas}}? --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:48, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

== Question ==

Can we remove the commons category from [[Q63245258]] as the page is not active and also the candidate info as he is not old enough. [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C56:6F08:1CF:0:4945:4CD6:27CB|2600:6C56:6F08:1CF:0:4945:4CD6:27CB]] 09:18, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

:As the cat no longer exists, consider it done. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:47, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
: Is the person actually notable?--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:21, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
::[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] - I didn’t think so but I was overruled during the deletion process. [[User:Datamaster1|Datamaster1]] ([[User talk:Datamaster1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:41, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata weekly summary #372 ==

<div class="plainlinks mw-content-ltr" lang="en" dir="ltr">
[[File:Wikidata-logo-en.svg|150px|right]]
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">''Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.''</div>
<div style="-moz-column-count:2; -webkit-column-count:2; column-count:2; -webkit-column-width: 400px; -moz-column-width: 400px; column-width: 400px;">
* '''Discussions'''
** Open request for adminship: [[d:Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Administrator/ZI Jony|ZI Jony]]

* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Events|Events]]'''
** Upcoming: Wikidata IRC office hour, [https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Wikidata+IRC+office+hour&iso=20190716T16&p1=%3A&ah=1 Tuesday, July 16th, at 16:00 UTC (18:00 Berlin time)], on the #wikimedia-office channel
** Past: [[m:Celtic_Knot_Conference_2019|Celtic Knot Conference 2019]] - minority languages on Wikimedia projects. Slides to be added in the [[c:Category:Celtic Knot Conference 2019 presentations|Commons category]]

* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Press coverage|Press, articles, blog posts]]'''
** [https://addshore.com/2019/07/wikidata-map-july-2019/#more-3857 A new Wikidata map and comparison with previous maps], by Addshore
** [https://commonists.wordpress.com/2019/07/06/the-story-of-integraality-or-my-quest-to-make-it-at-the-wikimedia-hackathon/ The story of building the inteGraality tool at the Wikimedia Hackathon], by JeanFred
** [https://www.ouvrirlascience.fr/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/2019.06.07-Note-orientation-Identifiants_pour_la_science_ouverte.pdf Des identifiants ouverts pour la science ouverte] by the Comité pour la Science ouverte (Open Science Committee), June 2019. Extract: "Since 2012, the Wikidata database has gradually become the global point of convergence for open identifiers." (''Depuis 2012, la base Wikidata est devenue progressivement le point de convergence mondial des identifiants ouverts.'')
** Lydia Pintscher submitted a chapter for the collaborative book [[m:Wikipedia@20|Wikipedia@20]], called [https://wikipedia20.pubpub.org/pub/s2t6abfh Wikidata - Wikipedia’s not so little sister is finding its own way]. Feel free to have a look, review is open until July 19th
** You can also check out Denny Vrandečić's submission about [https://wikipedia20.pubpub.org/pub/vyf7ksah Abstract Wikipedia and Wikidata]

* '''Other Noteworthy Stuff'''
** Because of a server switch, Wikidata will be in read-only mode on July 30th from 05:00 to 05:30 AM UTC ([[phab:T227063]])
** Change in the name pattern of new Wikidata RDF dumps: starting on July 15th, dumps will have a new name format ([[phab:T226153]])
** Reminder for tool builders: [https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikidata/2019-July/013247.html Python tools should use a user-agent to access the Query Service]. If you recently encountered issues with the Query Service, please check that your tool is compliant to [[m:User-Agent policy]].
** New [[d:Wikidata:Wikidata_Lexeme_Forms#User_script|user script]] for lexicographical data to add Forms on Lexemes that don't have any, by suggesting and filling out templates

* '''Did you know?'''
<!-- NEW PROPERTIES DO NOT REMOVE -->
** Newest [[d:Special:ListProperties|properties]]:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Property:P6942|animator]], [[:d:Property:P6948|video system]], [[:d:Property:P6949|announcement date]], [[:d:Property:P6954|access status]], [[:d:Property:P6962|literary motif]], [[:d:Property:P6977|review of]], [[:d:Property:P6978|middle family name]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Property:P6940|FPBR person ID]], [[:d:Property:P6941|PHI Latin Texts author ID]], [[:d:Property:P6943|VG-lista artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6944|Bloodhound ID]], [[:d:Property:P6945|Steam profile ID]], [[:d:Property:P6946|Find & Connect ID]], [[:d:Property:P6947|Goodreads series ID]], [[:d:Property:P6950|Scandipop topic id]], [[:d:Property:P6953|2014 Commonwealth Games ID]], [[:d:Property:P6955|El portal de Música artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6956|Balochistan Education Management Information System code]], [[:d:Property:P6957|Khyber Pakhtunkhwa Education Management Information System code]], [[:d:Property:P6958|Punjab Education Management Information System code]], [[:d:Property:P6959|Sindh Education Management Information System code]], [[:d:Property:P6960|IMVDb artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6963|Institute-id in the BaFin company database]], [[:d:Property:P6964|Musiikkituottajat artist (certyfication) ID]], [[:d:Property:P6965|IFPI Austria artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6966|IFPI Danmark artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6967|SNEP artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6968|hitparade.ch artist (certyfication) ID]], [[:d:Property:P6969|BVMI artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6970|Music Canada artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6971|IFPI Norge artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6972|Napster artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6973|Personnel de l'administration préfectorale ID]], [[:d:Property:P6975|RBF professional boxer ID]], [[:d:Property:P6976|Retrosheet ID]], [[:d:Property:P6979|SLNSW unpublished item ID]], [[:d:Property:P6980|LB.ua dossier ID]], [[:d:Property:P6981|ACNP journal ID]], [[:d:Property:P6982|Australian Faunal Directory publication ID]], [[:d:Property:P6983|Sverigetopplistan artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P6984|Rupa Publications author ID]], [[:d:Property:P6985|OYO Hotel ID]], [[:d:Property:P6987|Hungarian National Namespace place ID]], [[:d:Property:P6988|Hungarian National Namespace person ID]], [[:d:Property:P6989|Hungarian National Namespace organisation ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPERTIES -->
<!-- NEW PROPOSALS DO NOT REMOVE -->
** New [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Property proposal|property proposals]] to review:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/catalogue raisonné|catalogue raisonné]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Wikia Article URL 2|Wikia Article URL 2]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Wikispecies template for this work|Wikispecies template for this work]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/imprimatur|imprimatur]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/periphrasis|periphrasis]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/terms of service|terms of service]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/privacy policy|privacy policy]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Musisque Deoque author ID|Musisque Deoque author ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/SAR Value|SAR Value]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/IAAF competition category|IAAF competition category]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Academic rank|Academic rank]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/MPG ID|MPG ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/newspaper archive|newspaper archive]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/unabbreviated text|unabbreviated text]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/identifiant Q-Codes|identifiant Q-Codes]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/ft.dk politician identifier|ft.dk politician identifier]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Biyografya ID|Biyografya ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Magazine in BitArkivo.org|Magazine in BitArkivo.org]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/PharmGKB ID|PharmGKB ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/World Encyclopedia of Puppetry Arts ID|World Encyclopedia of Puppetry Arts ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/identifiant Missions étrangères de Paris|identifiant Missions étrangères de Paris]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/DigitalNZ ID|DigitalNZ ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Handball123 player ID|Handball123 player ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/ScOT ID|ScOT ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Atlas of Living Australia ID|Atlas of Living Australia ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/номер российской организации|номер российской организации]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/AtlasFor ID|AtlasFor ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Repertorium van ambtsdragers en ambtenaren id|Repertorium van ambtsdragers en ambtenaren id]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Adventure Gamers ID|Adventure Gamers ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Bebo profile numeric ID|Bebo profile numeric ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/MovieLens ID|MovieLens ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/WikiApiary|WikiApiary]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Scribd Book ID|Scribd Book ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Penguin India author ID|Penguin India author ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Spanish Catalogued Heritage|Spanish Catalogued Heritage]]
<!-- END NEW PROPOSALS -->
** Query examples: 
*** [https://quarry.wmflabs.org/query/37426 762 people made edits on lexicographical data], [https://quarry.wmflabs.org/query/35995 571 created at least one Lexeme] ([https://twitter.com/fagerving/status/1147568243537862657 source])
*** [https://query.wikidata.org/#%23defaultView%3AMap%7B%22hide%22%3A%5B%22%3Fgeoshape%22%2C%22%3Frgb%22%2C%22%3FWelshSpeakerPercentage%22%5D%2C%22layer%22%3A%22%3FWelshSpeakerPercentage%22%7D%0ASELECT%20DISTINCT%20%0A%3Farea%20%3FareaLabel%0A%3F2011%0A%3FWelshSpeakerPercentage%0A%3Fgeoshape%20%0A%3Frgb%20%0AWHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%20%0A%20%20%3Farea%20wdt%3AP3896%20%3Fgeoshape%20.%0A%20%20%20%0A%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Farea%20%3F2011%20%3F2011_percent%20WHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%20%20%0A%20%20BIND%28CONCAT%28%222001%3A%20%22%2C%20%3F2011_Population%2C%20%22%20%3B%20%22%2C%20%3F2011_Speakers%2C%20%22%20%22%2C%20%3F2011_Percent%29%20as%20%3F2011%29%0A%0A%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Farea%20%3F2011_Population%20%3F2011_Speakers%20%3F2011_Percent%20%3F2011_percent%20WHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%0A%20%20BIND%28CONCAT%28%22Population%3A%20%22%2C%20STR%28%3F2011_population%29%29%20as%20%3F2011_Population%29%0A%20%20BIND%28CONCAT%28%22Welsh%20speakers%3A%20%22%2C%20STR%28%3F2011_speakers%29%29%20as%20%3F2011_Speakers%29%0A%20%20BIND%28CONCAT%28%22%28%22%2C%20SUBSTR%28STR%28%3F2011_percent%29%2C0%2C5%29%2C%20%22%25%29.%22%29%20as%20%3F2011_Percent%29%0A%20%20%20%0A%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Farea%20%3F2011_speakers%20%3F2011_population%20%3F2011_percent%20WHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%0A%20%20BIND%28100%20%2a%20%3F2011_speakers%20%2F%20%3F2011_population%20AS%20%3F2011_percent%29%0A%0A%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Farea%20%3F2011_speakers%20%3F2011_population%20WHERE%20%7B%20%0A%20%20%20%20%3Farea%20wdt%3AP31%20wd%3AQ15979307%20%3B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20p%3AP2936%20%3F2011_SpeakersStatement%20%3B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20p%3AP1082%20%3F2011_PopulationStatement%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%3F2011_SpeakersStatement%20%3Fpq_qual%20%3Fpq_obj%20.%20%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%3Fqual%20wikibase%3Aqualifier%20%3Fpq_qual%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%3F2011_SpeakersStatement%20pq%3AP585%20%222011-00-00T00%3A00%3A00Z%22%5E%5Exsd%3AdateTime%20%3B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20pq%3AP1098%20%3F2011_speakers%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%3F2011_PopulationStatement%20%3Fpq_qual%20%3Fpq_obj%20.%20%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%3Fqual%20wikibase%3Aqualifier%20%3Fpq_qual%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%3F2011_PopulationStatement%20pq%3AP585%20%222011-00-00T00%3A00%3A00Z%22%5E%5Exsd%3AdateTime%20%3B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20ps%3AP1082%20%3F2011_population%20.%0A%20%20%7D%20%7D%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%20%7D%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%20%7D%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%20%7D%0A%20%20%0A%20BIND%28%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2010%2C%20%220-10%25%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2020%2C%20%2210-20%25%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2030%2C%20%2220-30%25%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2040%2C%20%2230-40%25%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2050%2C%20%2240-50%25%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2060%2C%20%2250-60%25%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2070%2C%20%2260-70%25%22%2C%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%2270%25%2B%22%29%29%29%29%29%29%29%0A%20%20%20%20AS%20%3FWelshSpeakerPercentage%29.%20%0A%20%20%0A%20%20BIND%28%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2010%2C%20%22ffe6e6%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2020%2C%20%22ffb3b3%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2030%2C%20%22ff8080%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2040%2C%20%22ff4d4d%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2050%2C%20%22ff1a1a%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2060%2C%20%22e60000%22%2C%0A%20%20%20%20IF%28%3F2011_percent%20%3C%2070%2C%20%22b30000%22%2C%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%22800000%22%29%29%29%29%29%29%29%0A%20%20%20%20AS%20%3Frgb%29.%0A%20%0A%20%20SERVICE%20wikibase%3Alabel%20%7B%20bd%3AserviceParam%20wikibase%3Alanguage%20%22%5BAUTO_LANGUAGE%5D%2Cen%22.%20%7D%0A%20%20%7D%0AORDER%20BY%20%3FWelshSpeakerPercentage Map with percentage of Welsh speakers in the regions of Wales] ([https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File:Visualising_a_language_with_geoshapes.pdf&page=5 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/5pP Publication dates of works used as usage example for Swedish Lexemes] ([https://twitter.com/fagerving/status/1147466712486481920 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/5pQ Ratios of male/female organizers and speakers at conferences] ([https://twitter.com/fnielsen/status/1147197245676298241 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/5pT World map of sign languages by country] ([https://twitter.com/RocHumet/status/1147163623380389890 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/5pV Number of punk bands from Indonesia by region] ([https://twitter.com/hilmanassdf/status/1147066668067065856 source])
*** [https://query.wikidata.org/#%23defaultView%3AMap%0ASELECT%20DISTINCT%20%3Fsite%20%3FsiteLabel%20%3Fplace%20%3FplaceLabel%20%3FcountryLabel%20%3Fcoords%20%3Fimage%20%3FunescoUrl%20%3Flayer%20WHERE%20%7B%7B%0ASELECT%20DISTINCT%20%3Fsite%20%3Fplace%20%3Fcountry%20%3Fcoords%20%3Fimage%20%3FunescoUrl%20%3Flayer%20WHERE%20%7B%7B%0ASELECT%20%3Fcountry%20WHERE%20%7B%7B%20%3Fcountry%20wdt%3AP463%20wd%3AQ7809%3Bwdt%3AP30%20wd%3AQ46%20.%20%7D%20UNION%20%7B%20%3Fcountry%20wdt%3AP361%20wd%3AQ1191549%20%7D%20UNION%20%7B%20%3Fcountry%20wdt%3AP31%20wd%3AQ15304003%20%7D%7D%7D%0A%7BSELECT%20DISTINCT%20%3Fsite%20%3Fprotection%20%3Fcountry%20%28group_concat%28DISTINCT%20%3FsiteType%29%20AS%20%3FsiteType%29%20WHERE%20%7B%0A%3Fsite%20p%3AP1435%20%3FprotectionStatement%20%3Bwdt%3AP17%20%3Fcountry%20.%0AFILTER%20NOT%20EXISTS%20%7B%20%3Fx%20wdt%3AP527%20%3Fsite%20.%20%3Fx%20wdt%3AP1435%20%3Fprotection%20%7D%0A%3FprotectionStatement%20ps%3AP1435%20%3Fprotection%20.%0AFILTER%20NOT%20EXISTS%20%7B%20%3FprotectionStatement%20pq%3AP582%20%3Fx%20%7D%0AVALUES%20%3Fprotection%20%7B%20wd%3AQ9259%20wd%3AQ17278671%20wd%3AQ52683530%20wd%3AQ16617071%20wd%3AQ52683527%7D%0AOPTIONAL%20%7B%3Fsite%20wdt%3AP2614%20%3Fcriteria%20.%0ABIND%20%28IF%20%28%28%3Fcriteria%20in%20%28wd%3AQ23038972%2C%20wd%3AQ23038976%2C%20wd%3AQ23038977%2C%20wd%3AQ23038978%2C%20wd%3AQ23038979%2C%20wd%3AQ23038980%29%29%2C%20%22Cultural%22%2C%20%22Natural%22%29%20AS%20%3FsiteType%29%0A%7D%7D%0AGROUP%20BY%20%3Fsite%20%3Fprotection%20%3Fcountry%0A%7D%0A%7B%0A%3Fsite%20p%3AP757%20%3FidStatement%20.%0A%3FidStatement%20ps%3AP757%20%3Fid%20.%0AFILTER%20NOT%20EXISTS%20%7B%20%3FidStatement%20pq%3AP582%20%3Fx%20%7D%0Awd%3AP757%20p%3AP1630%20%3FformatterUrlStatement%20.%0A%7D%20UNION%20%7B%0A%3Fsite%20p%3AP4171%20%3FidStatement%20.%0A%3FidStatement%20ps%3AP4171%20%3Fid%20.%0AFILTER%20NOT%20EXISTS%20%7B%20%3FidStatement%20pq%3AP582%20%3Fx%20%7D%0Awd%3AP4171%20p%3AP1630%20%3FformatterUrlStatement%20.%0A%7D%0A%3FformatterUrlStatement%20ps%3AP1630%20%3Fformatterurl%20%3B%0Apq%3AP407%20wd%3AQ1860%20.%0ABIND%28IRI%28REPLACE%28%3Fid%2C%20%27%5E%28.%2B%29%24%27%2C%20%3Fformatterurl%29%29%20AS%20%3FunescoUrl%29.%0A%7B%3Fsite%20wdt%3AP527%2B%20%3Fplace%20.%0A%3Fplace%20wdt%3AP17%20%3Fcountry%20%3B%0AOPTIONAL%20%7B%20%3Fplace%20wdt%3AP625%20%3Fcoords%20%7D%0AOPTIONAL%20%7B%20%3Fplace%20wdt%3AP18%20%3Fimage%20%7D%0A%7D%20UNION%20%7B%0AFILTER%20NOT%20EXISTS%20%7B%20%3Fsite%20wdt%3AP527%20%3Fx%20%7D%0AOPTIONAL%20%7B%20%3Fsite%20wdt%3AP625%20%3Fcoords%20.%20%7D%0AOPTIONAL%20%7B%20%3Fsite%20wdt%3AP18%20%3Fimage%20%7D%0A%7D%0ABIND%20%28IF%20%28%3Fprotection%20%3D%20wd%3AQ17278671%2C%20%22Tentative%20list%22%2C%20%22World%20heritage%22%29%20AS%20%3FsiteProtection%29%0ABIND%20%28IF%20%28%3FsiteType%20%21%3D%20%22%22%2C%20CONCAT%28%3FsiteProtection%2C%20%22%20-%20%22%2C%20IF%20%28%3FsiteType%20%3D%20%22Cultural%20Natural%22%20%7C%7C%20%3FsiteType%20%3D%20%22Natural%20Cultural%22%2C%20%22Mixed%22%2C%20%3FsiteType%29%29%2C%20%3FsiteProtection%29%20AS%20%3Flayer%29%0A%7D%0A%7D%0ASERVICE%20wikibase%3Alabel%20%7B%20bd%3AserviceParam%20wikibase%3Alanguage%20%22%5BAUTO_LANGUAGE%5D%2Cen%22.%20%7D%0A%7D%0AORDER%20BY%20DESC%28%3Flayer%29%20%3FsiteLabel%20%3FplaceLabel Map of World Heritage places in Europe] ([https://twitter.com/slaettaratindur/status/1146861289509199878 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/5pW Map of parishes of New South Wales, Australia, colour-coded by county] ([https://twitter.com/tobyhudson/status/1145927691956183040 source])
** Newest database reports: [[d:Wikidata:Lists/cemetery/Ireland/Glasnevin Cemetery|Glasnevin Cemetery]], [[d:Wikidata:Lists/cemetery/Ireland/Mount Jerome Cemetery|Mount Jerome Cemetery]]

* '''Development'''
** Enabled JSONLD support for entity data ([https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Special:EntityData/Q64.jsonld example])
** Fixed JSON dump issue ([[phabricator:T226601]])
** Readded qualifier hashes in JSON output that accidentally got lost ([[phabricator:T227207]])
** Made sure changes on Entity Schema pages by autoconfirmed users are autopatrolled ([[phabricator:T224495]])
** Looked into issues with partial blocking on Wikidata entities ([[phabricator:T207893]])
** Adding MediaInfo as an entity type that can be used in the "allowed entity types"-constraint ([[phabricator:T224362]])
** Investigating an issue with the tours on Wikidata ([[phabricator:T223999]])
** Initial work for the edit dialog that is needed for editing of Wikidata's data from Wikipedia (Wikidata Bridge)

[[phab:maniphest/query/4RotIcw5oINo/#R|You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here]]. If you want to help, you can also have a look at [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/project/board/71/query/zfiRgTnZF7zu/?filter=zfiRgTnZF7zu&order=priority the tasks needing a volunteer].

* '''Monthly Tasks'''
** Add labels, in your own language(s), for the new properties listed above.
** Comment on property proposals: [[d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Overview|all open proposals]]
** [[d:Wikidata:Contribute/Suggested and open tasks|Suggested and open tasks]]!
** Contribute to a [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Showcase items|Showcase item]].
** Help [[d:Special:LanguageStats|translate]] or proofread the interface and documentation pages, in your own language!
** [[d:User:Pasleim/projectmerge|Help merge identical items]] across Wikimedia projects.
** Help [[d:Wikidata:Status updates/Next|write the next summary!]]

</div>
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== Request from RfD ==

:''Moved from [[WD:RfD]]''

Hi, 
there is an issue with the two pages:
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q29015710
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q30594328
School of Management Fribourg (Q30594328) is the most complete section

It is therefore not possible to link the two translations in EN et DE:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hochschule_f%C3%BCr_Wirtschaft_Freiburg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_of_Management_Fribourg

Language	Label	Description	Also known as
English	
School of Management Fribourg
No description defined
French	
Haute école de gestion Fribourg
No description defined
HEG-FR
German	
Hochschule für Wirtschaft Freiburg
No description defined
HSW-FR
--[[Special:Contributions/160.98.201.156|160.98.201.156]] 10:55, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

== Q35287721 ==

{{Q|Q35287721}} is listed in Geonames as an airport instead of an oil refinery, some refinerys have heliports, but I do not see a corresponding FAA airport code, for example see {{Q|Q3014399}} which has {{Q|Q61675718}}. Do you think it is an error at Geonames? --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:32, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

:Yes and no. The [https://www.aia-aerospace.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/AIA-DIRECTORY-OF-HELIPORTS-1981.pdf AIA Directory of Heliports] (admittedly for 1981) lists a heliport at Paulsboro Refinery, on page 147. Equally, I cannot find a heliport by eye using google satellite view; so perhaps its now defunct? What is odd, for me, at least based on a search in geonames for 'Paulsboro Refinery', is that there is not a record for the refinery coded as 'Oil refinery', a label that does feature in their ontology. That aside, presuming that there is no longer a heliport there might explain the lack of FAA code, presuming that US heliports must have such a code. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:07, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
:If there is, it [https://www.nj.gov/transportation/gis/maps/airportsheliports.pdf wasn't licensed as of 2016]. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:11, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
== Errors caused by ambassadors ==

{{Q|1324589}}'s {{Q|63247361}} statement causes error (and other ambassador Qs too). Could somebody help me putting a fix to the correct place? Thanks in advance! [[User:Bencemac|Bencemac]] ([[User talk:Bencemac|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:53, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:I would expect that to work, since {{Q|63247361}} is a <subclass of> {{Q|Q121998}} and {{Q|Q121998}} is an <instance of> {{Q|Q4164871}}, which should satisfy the constraint. Can any constraint experts weight in? - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:52, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
::Unless I am mistaken, that's not how the constraint actually work. Only subclass can "look up the tree". Instance must be ''marked directly on the linked item'' (i.e. unless {{Q|63247361}} is an instance of the requisite items, it won't satisfy the constraint). The constraint probably fails because (I would assume) at not point does the tree put {{Q|63247361}} ''as a subclass of {{Q|Q4164871}} itself''. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:44, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Then it's a stupid constraint. And the solution is not, Jura, [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q63247361&type=revision&diff=975216482&oldid=931898598 this] since we have perhaps 195^2 of these positions, all of which are a subclass of {{Q|Q121998}} which is a {{Q|Q4164871}}. The solution is to make a constraint which works given the pattern {{Q|63247361}} is a <subclass of> {{Q|Q121998}} and {{Q|Q121998}} is an <instance of> {{Q|Q4164871}}. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:29, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
: The [[Wikidata:WikiProject property constraints|WikiProject property constraints]] might help you with this issue. I am going to ping them.
{{ping project|property constraints}}
: Regards, [[User:Ivanhercaz|Ivanhercaz]] ([[User talk:Ivanhercaz|Talk]]) 00:07, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
*It's actually fixed now. To avoid any doubt, could you add reference to the position statement on [[Q63247361]]? We noticed that some people add fictitious positions. (I don't think this is true here). ----- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 00:53, 7 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{Reply to|Jura1}} I added {{P|856}}, it verifies the item. I hope it is suitable. [[User:Bencemac|Bencemac]] ([[User talk:Bencemac|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:57, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for the help, but I am afraid of that {{Q|62558339}} (and probably others) still has the same problem. Any idea? [[User:Bencemac|Bencemac]] ([[User talk:Bencemac|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:01, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

== Dupes from CBDB imports ==

I found some dupes from [[User:Fantasticfears]]'s imports from CBDB. I believe there are more, but checking one by one manually is daunting. Is there some script or tool that might help?--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:42, 8 July 2019 (UTC)

:[https://w.wiki/5qM This], maybe - items sharing the same CBDB ID. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:49, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
:Awesome! They should be merged. However, most of the ones I found do not have CBDB ID on one of them. I matched them by matching Chinese name and their 籍貫 and era. (It's almost impossible to have two persons having the same name from the same county in the same era.)--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:46, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
::All entries in the query is fixed.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:19, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

== What can I do with a wikidata item that is an instance of a wikimedia category? ==

What useful properties should be added to a wikidata item that is an instance of {{Q|Q4167836}} and what properties should it be the object of?

In particular, [[:en:Category:Uniting Church in Australia presidents]] corresponds to {{q|Q25011267}} and currently has 15 people in it, who each held the role for approximately 3 years. Is there a standard way to associate the person with the category in wikidata? <person> {{P|2868}} {{q|Q25011267}} doesn't feel quite right. Should I somehow create an item "Uniting Church in Australia president" as an instance of {{Q|Q4897819}} and if so, how would that be associated with the category item? I could then give each person {{P|P2868}} with start and finish dates, successor, predecessor as qualifiers.
Thank you. --[[User:ScottDavis|ScottDavis]] ([[User talk:ScottDavis|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:01, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
: Category items shouldn't generally be used in statements. When there are several people in Wikidata who had the same job, creating an item like "Uniting Church in Australia president" is probably the thing to do, like {{Q|57628868}}. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:33, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
: The other option, which is often used, is on items like {{Q|7476}}, where position is {{Q|1255921}} with a qualifier for the organization. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:36, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
::Thank you. I shall attempt to follow the style of the first example as that reflects what I was trying to do but didn't have the confidence in my familiarity with WikiData. --[[User:ScottDavis|ScottDavis]] ([[User talk:ScottDavis|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:15, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
::''Update'' I have created {{q|Q65249159}}, added 15 {{p|P1308}} entries with dates and the matching {{P|P39}} on each of the 15 items. I wish I knew if I could have used tools to create the inverse statements and links instead of having typed everything including qualifiers twice. --[[User:ScottDavis|ScottDavis]] ([[User talk:ScottDavis|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:43, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
::: I'm not sure why they can be listed on both either. I'd tend to put the statements on the individuals, not on {{P|1308}}. Wikidata has a lot of such duplication though. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:40, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

== Qualifying time of criminal convictions ==

Using qualifier {{P|585}} on {{P|1399}} is a little ambiguous to me. I would assume it is the time of conviction and not the time at which the crime was committed? In which case, how would the latter be best modelled? --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:06, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
: Yes, since the property is about the conviction, any qualifier should apply to that. Where there's no specific property for an event, in this case the perpetration of a crime, {{Q|2245405}} can be used. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:07, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: Although, I suppose {{P|1399}} was created to link a person with a crime, so it seems a bit unfortunate that you'd need to add another statement about the crime to record its date (assuming it's not a crime with a separate item, like {{Q|2613392}}, where the date can be added). [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:11, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

== Guide to adding references ==

I figured it might be helpful to add references for information I've already sourced in articles I've written. Is there a guide for me? Figuring out how to add just the URL is easy enough but that feels incredibly incomplete. Best, [[User:Barkeep49|Barkeep49]] ([[User talk:Barkeep49|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:50, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Barkeep49}} [[Help:Sources]] should have what you need. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:19, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::Thanks {{ping|PKM}}. Having read that I have a few follow-up questions. I edit lots of books on EN Wiki so those and authors was where I was starting. Am I correct that a first edition should have a seperate item from the book itself? Is this in all cases or just in cases where we've referenced that edition somewhere? Also I'm still generally confused about best practices with references. Should I be using stated in and reference URL when I'm using a specific webpage as a cite or just reference URL? How in general does Wikidata deal with linkrot? Thanks and best, [[User:Barkeep49|Barkeep49]] ([[User talk:Barkeep49|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:20, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:::{{ping|Barkeep49}} The best practice is to add both a "work" and an "edition" for a published book used as reference (and the reference should always point to the edition).  Examples: {{Q|Q42962936}} (work), {{Q|Q42963002}} (edition), {{Q|Q1588393}} (item with citation).  Note in this case the book is online and sections have their own URLs, so I have included that info.
:::If a web site or database has a Wikidata item, used "stated in".  If not, just use "reference URL". See {{Q|Q51077492}}, reference for "date of death". I'm sure there are other ways to do this.
:::To avoid link rot, you can add {{P|1065}} and {{P|P2960}}, just like you would on Wikipedia.  See {{Q|Q65034936}} property "official name" for an example. There is a bot that will (eventually?) do this for you.  I forget what the status/schedule is. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:44, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

To reuse WP references, I thought [[User:Mvolz (WMF)|Mvolz]] was working on https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Citoid --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:01, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

== Vaishnavi ==

I was disentangling two concepts that used to be in one item ({{Q|Q7908873}} and {{Q|Q65534195}}) and may have made a mess. How do I move all of the multilingual descriptions for female given name from the Devi item to the given name item? I can only easily edit en, fr, and es (I'm guessing that's because of my language boxes on my userpage?). [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:03, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

: {{reply to|Calliopejen1}} one option might be to delete all descriptions on the old item using [[User:Ash Crow/dataDrainer.js]] and then adding fresh ones on the new item using [[Wikidata:Namescript]]. (Afterwards, you’d have to manually restore any descriptions on the old item that shouldn’t have been deleted – I’m assuming that’s only a few if any, otherwise this probably isn’t the best approach.) --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:33, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{reply to|Calliopejen1}}[[User:Ash Crow/dataDrainer.js]] seems to require rollbacker permission, and I'm not sure you've been active in WD long enough to have that ...
:: You might also restore the original item to the state before the split and then modify the newer item to be the "other half" of the split. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:18, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Nope, I don't have rollbacker yet. Yeah, it might be easier just to swap them. I thought it would be easier in this configuration because all the WP links could stay where they were... But I think changing the names around is way worse. [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:57, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Okay, all sorted now! [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:03, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
== Sequence of children/siblings ==

Which property/qualifier to use to present this information?--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:08, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{P|1545}} is used for pretty much the same thing for author order on works where author ordering is relevant see, say {{Q|64082142}} (example selected ''literally'' at random). [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:29, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
::How to present one info in particular though? That is, {{Q|9696}} is the second among his siblings. It's easy on his father's page, assigning 1 to n to them. It's also easy for his siblings on JFK's page, assigning 1 to his older brother and 3 to n to his younger siblings, but how to show he himself is no.2?--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:46, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
:::The data being present on related items is sufficient. --[[User:Yair rand|Yair rand]] ([[User talk:Yair rand|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:58, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
::::I am both my father and my mothers firstborn. My sister is also her fathers firstborn, but her mothers second. My youngest sister is her fathers second and her mothers third. So add that info to the father/mother instead. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 05:54, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::Sounds like data that is hard to reference (1st, 2nd, 3rd). --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 08:48, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::{{re|Yair rand}} could you please help input the following information? (Italics denote uncertain info.)
::::::{{Q|11632273}} had ''5'' sons:
:::::::Tan Baozhen 譚寶箴 (no item yet), b. ?, ''1st son''
:::::::{{Q|708781}}, b. 1880, 3rd son
:::::::{{Q|45694336}}, b. ?, 4th son
:::::::{{Q|45694204}}, b. 1889, 5th son
::::::Another case whereby only the order is known: {{Q|337013}} had 1st son {{Q|145671}}, 2nd son {{Q|953232}} and 3rd son {{Q|1276938}}.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:20, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::: As there is no property for son, I don't see how sons can be numerated. {{P|40}} is for children of all gender. --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:18, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

:Let me summarise the problem.
:Suppose there are three siblings A, B and C, each notable for wikidata. They meet the following criteria:
:#They have no (biological, step-, adoptive or whatsoever) father or mother.
:#Their years of birth are unknown.
:#We know A>B>C.
:Info #3 is surely useful, but how does wikidata store it? Is there a qualifier to say ''older/younger than''?
:(It's not common to find such people meeting both #1 and #2, but it's common enough to find ones that meet #1 because their parents are not notable enough for a wikidata item, unless you choose to create it just for this fact. #2 is also common for historical figures, even though I havent found a case in which their parents were not documented yet.)--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:18, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Can these be used:
::* A {{P|P1038}} B – qualifier {{P|P1039}} {{Q|Q28466210}}
::* A {{P|P1038}} C – qualifier {{P|P1039}} {{Q|Q28466210}}
::* B {{P|P1038}} A – qualifier {{P|P1039}} {{Q|Q28466211}}
::* B {{P|P1038}} C – qualifier {{P|P1039}} {{Q|Q28466210}}
::* C {{P|P1038}} A – qualifier {{P|P1039}} {{Q|Q28466211}}
::* C {{P|P1038}} B – qualifier {{P|P1039}} {{Q|Q28466211}}
:: --[[User:Dipsacus fullonum|Dipsacus fullonum]] ([[User talk:Dipsacus fullonum|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:56, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{Ping|Roy17}} "They have no father or mother" isn't really a thing that can happen. Not only is it true that all humans have mothers and fathers, but siblinghood additionally implies not only that they have parents, but that the siblings share the same parents. Even if we don't know anything about the parents except that they're the parents of multiple particular people, the items can be created to fulfill the structural need, per [[WD:N]]. --[[User:Yair rand|Yair rand]] ([[User talk:Yair rand|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:55, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Exactly, take {{Q|22340337}} as an example. The benefit of this item is that it connects two other items, St. Peter and his mother in law. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 07:04, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
::::[[User:Dipsacus fullonum]]'s answer is the best so far. Thx!--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:45, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
*"They have no [..] father or mother.": clearly this isn't possible for [[Q5]]. In the sample by Dipsacus, "sibling" should be used instead of P1038. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:03, 13 July 2019 (UTC)

== suggestededit-add 1.0 ==

{{phab|T227623}}
What is this functionality? [[special:diff/976058660]] added wrong information. I dont know if the wrong info was ''suggested'' by something and then chosen by the user, or if the user was ''suggested'' to edit the description and s/he came up with the wrong info. If the former is true, this functionality is probably suggesting too much wrong info.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:20, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{Ping|Roy17}} new here? You should leave people a message. It's kind of rude to start a topic here behind someone's back. You didn't even welcome the user! I'll leave a message at [[User talk:Leofreitasa]]. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:45, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{re|Multichill}} I find it ruder to misread others' messages. I made it clear this functionality could be at fault. The fault would be the developer's rather than any particular user's.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:52, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
*I don't recall the post that seems to have announced it either. Odd that the tool expects that one would revert a partially correct edit rather than fix it. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 17:08, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
Thank you all for your comments and questions about [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Apps/Team/Android/AppEditorTasks Suggested Edits]. I have added [[Wikidata:Suggestededit-add_1.0|a FAQ page]] that gives more background on the feature, how it works, and how we have announced it in the past. Please do let me know if you've any more questions. [[User:CGauthier (WMF)|CGauthier (WMF)]] ([[User talk:CGauthier (WMF)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:29, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
*Could we try to improve the readability of Wikidata in mobile first? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 11:59, 13 July 2019 (UTC)

== [[User:Eurohunter]]... ==

... is probably vandal. That account removes descriptions or property titles for many articles. I [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User_talk:Eurohunter#Removing_Serbian_titles_of_properties put] messages on the talk page and reverted some edits. Block it if needed. --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:09, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: Stop. You are restoring incorrect labels and also removed fixes for Indonsesian language at {{P|2003}}. You should be sonsidered as vandal in this case. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:06, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Link ratcher this [[User talk:Obsuser#IMDb]]. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:08, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: One more time. You called me vandal? Look at my edits first. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:16, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{re|Obsuser}} When you are going to restore fixed label for Indonesian at {{P|2003}}? Do you even checked edit before undo? You cancelled it two times without reflection. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:24, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

You removed a dozen of correct designations. You restore what changed meanwhile. I reverted to last stable version. --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:27, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{re|Obsuser}} You removed already fixed Indonesian and restorred incorrect labels which I removed before. You made a mess and you will fix it now or I will restore everything again (everything should be restored anyway but let's wait with it before someone will explain you or you will understand). [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:31, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:: No. You removed correct marks for most of the languages and meanwhile someone changes only few of them. You fix if it is needed. You can restore for a short span of time but someone else will revert because removing hundreds of designations for already properly translated properties for many languages is not acceptable. --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:34, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Can you look what you have done with Indonesian? It's ridiculous because you can't proced like that (cancalling "suspicious" edits for you and everything else absolutelly correct). [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:38, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: {{re|Obsuser}} You see it? If you are not going to fix it now it's just unfair. If you want to cancell something do it carefully. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:49, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
First at all. Wikidata is not yours and if some edits were incorrect for you, you need to prove it and achieve consensus and then you can remove them, not right now you have already removed them and now started discussion. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:48, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

Can someone either point at actual diffs so that there is half a chance of people following this, or take it somewhere less public than Project chat if there is no need for anyone else to understand? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:06, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{re|Jmabel}} I have [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property:P2003&oldid=975684416 removed] incorrect labels and Obsuser not just only restored incorrect labels but he also [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property:P2003&diff=977139515&oldid=977139231 removed] Indonesian label which was fixed meanwhile. I told him probably 10-12 times he removed corrected label and he don't care about it. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:48, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

=== Active admin? ===

Can someone restore my edits at {{P|P2003}}, {{P|P3040}} and {{P|345}}? {{re|Obsuser}} removed my edits and restored incorrect labels (incorrrect labels in few languages + unfounded removal of label in Indonesian for Instagram ID). It's not Obsuser's Wikidata so I'm not agre with that and my edits should be restored as it was till consensus in eventual discussion. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:56, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:You can see [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property:P2003&action=history here] that almost all or all of the designations for languages were removed by Eurohunter. That is not the way to edit Wikidata. "ID" is not neccessary if property is of a primary character, so designations added by other users are correct and applicable so should not be removed per se. --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:42, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{re|Obsuser}} is [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property:P2002&curid=22470554&diff=977133154&oldid=975647882 still] vandalizing labels. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:32, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Clearly the Indonesian labels should be kept. As for the many (possibly better than nothing but not quite on the mark) labels in other languages I have no opinion. - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:04, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: I think it is reasonable to keep something what is added by other users. That designation that I have changed is hilarious and thus corrected into previous and standard form. --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:07, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: {{re|Obsuser}} You are not allowed to make mess bigger. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:58, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: {{ping|Obsuser}} Are you describing the Indonesian text as "hilarious"? If so, can you clarify what is wrong with it, rather than providing this nearly vacuous remark? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:21, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: That applies for you. Not Indonesian but Serbian. It starts with noncapital and is long, incorrect and unusual for such marks (see other examples, "Фејсбук", "Твитер", "Инстаграм", one word). --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:49, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::: Problem is that those removed were correct. --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:50, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::: {{re|Obsuser}} You can't say they were corrrect bcause they had no logic and 4 of them was already fixed (naturaly were incorrect if were fixed by me/others). One more time. You need to notice that you have removed Indonesian and 3 other labels which were fixed by me/other users and '''you are obligated to restore it'''. It's vandalism and it just can't be left without action. About Serbian. Would you like to tell me that Serbian language has no logic? If we continue with your logic we can say you "have Wikidata"? Not "Wikidata account"? It just doesn't makes sense. You are talking about "slang"/colloquialism which '''some''' people use in every day talks but it doesn't mean it's correct, like some people makes many other errors which are ratcher not acceptable in Wikidata. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:18, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
: I am afraid for me [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property:P2003&diff=977141062&oldid=977140836 this edit] by Obsuser does not make sense.--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:31, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:: It again applies for you. We are equal editors. You need consensus before making such radical edits without a valid explanation. Fix them again, that edit makes sense Ymblanter because previous marks were restored and are valid without "ID" suffix or something else. It has logic, mark for Instagram ID is "Инстаграм", not long explanation that that is user ID for profile on Instagram because it is logical that it is for that (only) thing associated with persons having accounts there. --[[User:Obsuser|Obsuser]] ([[User talk:Obsuser|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:36, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
::: I do not see how "Instagram" is a valid alias for "Instagram username".--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:01, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
:::*As there is only one Instagram property, I think it is ;) --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 11:58, 13 July 2019 (UTC)

== Merging two Signage ==

Found these two pages, signage (Q24841283) and signage (Q1211272). I am not experienced enough on Wikidata to merge these but I think it should be done. Could someone help, please. --[[User:W.carter|W.carter]] ([[User talk:W.carter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:21, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{Q|24841283}} and {{Q|1211272}}, I think you are right. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:17, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::I speak some of the languages in both groups so I know they are about the same sorts of items. I was also searching for where the French and Spanish versions had gone (I'm pretty sure there are articles since it is a universal subject) but haven't found them so far. --[[User:W.carter|W.carter]] ([[User talk:W.carter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:36, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
:::There is French [[:fr:Signalisation routière]], but only for road signs, perhaps corresponding to {{Q|17480810}}. I also discovered a possibly duplicate category item {{Q|22910716}}. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:46, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::::The {{Q|22910716}} doesn't look like a duplicate to the two above to me, since it is a category covering a bit more than just signs. --[[User:W.carter|W.carter]] ([[User talk:W.carter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:54, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::::I found the French article, [[:fr:Enseigne (signal)]] thanks to your clue about the road signs. It was misplaced at {{Q|229917}} and I have moved it to the right place. I also found the Spanish [[:es:Letrero]] (through the French 'neon sign') all by itself at {{Q|5973946}}. I've moved it and will propose the empty item page for deletion. --[[User:W.carter|W.carter]] ([[User talk:W.carter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:03, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: I think we should wait for a bot to fix the links to {{Q|5973946}}, and then merge it with {{Q|1211272}} (in case double redirects would cause problems.) [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:32, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: No problem, I'm happy to wait. I've put in a request for a move/merge/deletion from someone who knows how to do this properly. --[[User:W.carter|W.carter]] ([[User talk:W.carter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:39, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
== Another merging problem of items on the same subject ==

{{Q|16002379}} and {{Q|21027639}} should be merged but there are some Wikipedia's that have two articles (some of them are a redirect). How should this be resolved? [[User:Keren - WMIL|Keren - WMIL]] ([[User talk:Keren - WMIL|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:06, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

*If it's really the same: delete all redirects in sitelinks, move remaining ones to one item, move the statements to the same, mark the item with the remaining cawiki sitelink with P31=[[Q17362920]], possibly also suggest to cawiki to merge the two.
:The last two steps can be done with [[User:Matěj_Suchánek/markasduplicate.js]].
:A bot will also merge the items once cawiki merges them.  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 08:14, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

== President of a football team ==

Hello. Which properties should I use to show that:

1) {{Q|65554755}} held the position of {{Q|65557188}}

2) {{Q|65557188}} has as officeholder {{Q|65554755}}

[[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:15, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

:1 - {{Q|65554755}} - {{P|39}} - {{Q|65557188}}. 
:2 - {{Q|65557188}} - {{P|1308}} - {{Q|65554755}} --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:33, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

Yes, I have already tried these two but I get constraint. Ok, I have found the problem. Thanks. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:39, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

== Linking two sets of articles on the same subjects, but where different language wikipedias use differing titles? ==

In 2003, Brian Wells, a pizza delivery man, was killed in a bizarre bank robbery where he was either part of a conspiracy or an unwitting victim, in which he robbed the bank while wearing an explosive device locked around his neck.

There are seven Wikipediae that carry articles on him. In four of the articles, the subject's name is the name of the wikipedia article:

* German Wikipedia: [[w:de:Brian Wells|Brian Wells]]
* Spanish Wikipedia [[w:es:Brian Douglas Wells|Brian Douglas Wells]]
* French Wikipedia: [[w:fr:Brian Douglas Wells|Brian Douglas Wells]]
* Indonesian Wikipedia: [[w:id:Brian Douglas Wells|Brian Douglas Wells]]

On the English Wikipediae (both standard and Simple English), the article is named for the bank robbery ''event'' due to the [[w:en:wikipedia:ONEEVENT|ONEEVENT]] policy; one with a redirect from the subject's name:

* English Wikipedia: [[w:en:Death of Brian Wells|Death of Brian Wells]] (with name-based redirect [[w:en:Brian Douglas Wells|Brian Douglas Wells]])
* Simple English Wikipedia: [[w:simple:Murder of Brian Wells|Murder of Brian Wells]] 

The Japanese Wikipedia's title is based on a description:
* Japanese Wikipedia: [[w:ja:ピザ配達人爆死事件|ピザ配達人爆死事件]], ''Pizza delivery bomber''

Despite these articles all covering the same subject matter and being alternate-language versions of one another apart from the article naming, wikidata links them into two separate groups for purposes of the "Languages" sidebar: one ([[Q56461070]]) with the German, Spanish, French and Indonesian articles; and one ([[Q523883]]) with the English, Simple English, and Japanese articles. What's the best way to gather them together? They're really all on the same topic, and only the article-naming policies pull them into separate groups, not content. [[User:TJRC|TJRC]] ([[User talk:TJRC|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:05, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
: I'd say that on Wikidata, {{Q|56461070}} is a useful item, but {{Q|523883}} is unnecessary since doesn't contain any additional information. I.e., it's only created supposedly for the benefit of Wikipedia, but in fact is only damaging the interwiki links. I think both Wikidata and Wikipedia would be better off if the two Wikidata items were merged. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:27, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
::I think it's fine as is. As per the [[Wikidata:Notability|notability guidelines]] it is notable if "It contains at least one valid sitelink to a page on Wikipedia". Unless wikipedia changes their pages to be about the person then an item for the event seems necessary to me --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:49, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
::It makes sense to me to have an entity for the person ([[Q56461070]]) and an entity for the event ([[Q523883]]).  And then the mapping from the differently-titled Wikipedia articles is natural and, not coincidentally, matches what we have now.  (Clearly it makes sense to interlink the two entities using relevant property claims, too. {{P|1344}} and {{P|710}} don't strike me as ideal for this purpose, but they're pretty close.) —[[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:02, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Sharing item is not the only way to have interwiki between articles. If the wikipolicy allows it, you can use {{Q|21286810}} to get interwiki from more than one item. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 06:06, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
::There should indeed be 2 items, but what is somewhat problematic here is that [[Q523883]] was changed in 2018 from one into the other. {{ping|Bovlb}} --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 11:31, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Thanks for the ping.  In 2018, I found this as an item that seemed to combine two concepts, and I split it into two, creating a new item for the human.  Not quite sure in hindsight why I chose to split it that way rather than the other.  I was probably favouring the English sitelink.  I agree that {{Q|Q21286810}} seems to be the way to go for these cases. [[User:Bovlb|Bovlb]] ([[User talk:Bovlb|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:24, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
::::They're not really two subjects, though, are they? They all cover the same ground, and basically only the way the titles and first-sentences are written suggest that they're on different subjects. But they're not. All seven articles are on the same subject. [[User:TJRC|TJRC]] ([[User talk:TJRC|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:42, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::I guess we could periodically re-read all sitelinked articles, check if they are mistitled or its lead doesn't match the remaining article, should be renamed or moved to different items. But wouldn't that be interfering with the editorial choices of the various wikipedias? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 08:19, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: {{ping|TJRC}} A death and a person are ontologically different things.  I agree that writing an article about one or the other will tend to cover the same ground, and the the precise ontological type of Wikipedia articles is not always clear.  {{ping|Jura1}} I see it as supporting the editorial choices of the Wikipedias.  The [[w:en:wikipedia:ONEEVENT|ONEEVENT]] policy pushes a specific editorial choice on the English Wikipedia.  It looks like {{Q|Q21286810}} allows us to avoid losing sitelinks in this case. [[User:Bovlb|Bovlb]] ([[User talk:Bovlb|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:10, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::: Yes, they are different, but generally the event item wouldn't be required in Wikidata, since there are designated properties on the person's item to hold all the same information, so the event item is redundant. I doubt it would be much appreciated if somebody created an item "Birth of X" for every person X in Wikidata, to redundantly hold their birth date and location. [[User:Ghouston|Ghouston]] ([[User talk:Ghouston|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:17, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
:The reference items for this type of case are {{Q|Q18341392}} and {{Q|Q238128}}. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:24, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
: I added {{Q|Q21286810}} to [[w:en:Death of Brian Wells]] to bring in the additional Wikidata links automatically.  Simple English Wikipedia does not have this template, so I could not add it there.  I see that there were multiple cases in September 2018 where I split an item into a person and a death event.  (I believe was trying to prepare a QuickStatements run, but ultimately decided that the task could not easily be automated.)  I reviewed them and found no other cases that would benefit from additional links.  [[User:Bovlb|Bovlb]] ([[User talk:Bovlb|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:11, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

== [[Q20160665|S/2014 (130) 2]] ==

What to do with discoveries that showed up to be nothing? [http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/astro/astmoons/am-00130.html] 

The P31:{{Q|657829}} statement should be changed to inferior. But do we need to add something instead? [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 14:03, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
* By "inferior" do you mean "deprecated" or something else? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:21, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
**That is maybe the word, yes. It was thought to be a satellite to 130 Elektra, but it turned out to not exist. The statement should stay, but as deprecated. But can we have items with only a deprecated P31? Do we have to complementary add something like P31:"dust on the camera lens/science mistake/s**t happens"? [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 19:05, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
***Holds it, I maybe have found it in {{Q|5961257}}! [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 19:10, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra}} note also {{Q|59237924}}
== Time to review [[Wikidata:Alternate accounts]]? ==

'''This is not yet a formal proposal.'''

Wikidata's [[Wikidata:Alternate accounts|sock puppetery policy]] seems to be the strictest in Wikimedia projects. It requires public declaration of all alternative account used, and thus disallows clean starts, accounts for privacy purposes ([[Wikidata:Requests_for_comment/Privacy_and_Living_People#Allow_alternative_accounts_to_protect_privacy_for_users_who_need_the_privacy_for_entering_certain_sensitive_data_into_Wikidata|previous discussion]]), etc.

However, there're many ways to edit Wikidata without going to the Wikidata website. Moving or deleting local pages automatically updates Wikidata; Wikidata description may be edited by apps; there're various 3rd party tools; and also there's the [[mw:Wikidata Bridge|Wikidata Bridge]] project. In some time there's no indication that it is Wikidata that you are editing. Therefore, many people in people in local projects does not know the purpose of Wikidata at all, let alone being aware of the sock puppetery policy of Wikidata.

If some person decides to have a clean start, then it's allowed in most Wikimedia projects, but not allowed in Wikidata. It's not easy to avoid editing Wikidata while edit other projects normally (especially when most of the data in infoboxes comes from Wikidata). Admininistrators in Wikidata may choose not to block them per IAR or [[WD:UCS|UCS]], but this does not mean the policy don't needs to be amended.

Therefore, this is my idea:

# Users are encourages to, but not required to, declare alternative accounts. However, declaration is required if there's a strong accusation about misuse of multiple accounts. (How to enforce this?)
# Accounts that are not used in a productive way blatantly (including blatant violation of policy) may be blocked without warning.
# In other case, a discussion is required before taking any action.

Alternatively:

# All alternative accounts (e.g. old accounts that is abandoned after a clean start) must be disclosed, either publicly or to a designated mail list that some trusted users will have access.

--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:37, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

* Sound like a good idea to change this! --[[User:Marsupium|Marsupium]] ([[User talk:Marsupium|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:00, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
*{{user|GZWDer}}'s interpretation of the policy is incorrect. Clean-start accounts are not expressly forbidden and would be allowed as long as the previous account is declared; that latter requireent is also the requirement on the English Wikipedia for clean start, and is necessary to maintain accountability. Nothing is wrong with the current policy, other than perhaps clarifying this point. Until we establish an arbitration committee or other community body that can be empowered to deal with private matters, we cannot allow undeclared alternate accounts for accountability reasons.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:27, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
** [[:en:Wikipedia:Clean start|The enwiki policy]] does not require user to notify anyone of their clean start, so it is possible not to reveal the connection. For accountability issues, this is why I propose to set up a seperate (private) mail list, though who can access to the list may be discussed. (P.S. Chinese Wikipedia has neither ArbCom nor local CheckUser currently, but there's an admin mail list for discussing private matter.)--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:55, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
***It would be odd and awkward to setup a private mailing list specifically for this purpose. We don't even have local CheckUsers, otherwise that would be the natural option.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:07, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
**** It may be less odd if it is dubbed Wikidata-admin. (actually in Chinese Wikipedia we use the Unblock-zh mail list for this propose.)--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:16, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
*****I guess we could do that. I'm not too fond of that idea either but it could work, and if there's consensus for that then maybe we can change the policy.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:08, 11 July 2019 (UTC)
******The other issue that we get into is what if they decide to run for administrator in the future? Then we're stuck having to reveal the previous account, or endlessly arguing about whether to reveal the previous account (and if they edited under their real name, then that's another mess entirely). --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 04:23, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
*******The enwiki policy discussed the issue adequately. I think we can just borrow it, replacing ArbCom with the mail list.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:18, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
********I don't think we can. How do we get a consensus to release info? There's 13 of them and 50+ of us. It would devolve into bickering, and such a list would be difficult to actually keep things private (as many large mailing lists leak even if they are "private". Not to mention that WMF has removed two of our own admins before, one of them for real-life harassment). How do we make sure the mailing list doesn't get abused and decisions don't start to get made on it? No thanks. I don't want this nightmare. --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 06:21, 12 July 2019 (UTC) (To add to that: if we want an ArbCom, let's call it an ArbCom and elect them, let's not just make our own semi-private-but-not-really-private-because-61-people-are-on-it mailing list and pretend.). --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 06:27, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
*********If you think the number of subscriber is an issue, the list may be limited to "functionaries", i.e. bureaucrats and/or oversights. In my opinion being an arbiter have no inherent difference to administrator, especially in WMF's point of view. If WMF can remove an admin, they can remove an arbiter too.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:00, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
**********"In my opinion being an arbiter have no inherent difference to administrator, especially in WMF's point of view" - that's the point, enwiki ArbCom is specifically approved to handle nonpublic information, and goes through a lot more scrutiny than an administrator does (when really, to pass our RFA process you have to get 8 supports and not enough opposes to drag you below 75%). --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 18:14, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
***********Bureaucrats needs 15 support votes and oversight needs 25, so they are considered more trusted. By contrast, English Wikipedia ArbCom election ''theoretically'' only require 50% support and no mandatory support vote requirement.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:34, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
************But in practice, there are over [https://vote.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:SecurePoll/list/710 2,000 ballots], only the top X candidates are picked, and SecurePoll percentages are always lower than voting done in public (because your vote remains secret, you are free to oppose without consequence). --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 23:58, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
**If the previous account is declared, then it is not really a clean start though. --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 00:15, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
***It's pretty much "clean" if it is not too prominent on the userpage. It's not that ideal but I do think accountability is very important if we don't have a body trusted with private information.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:39, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

* {{comment}} not sure to understand... What part of this policy « disallows clean starts »? For me, when someone is doing a clean start then the old account is not used anymore, so the new one is not an alternate as we're back at the « Editors are expected to edit primarily from a single account, used by a single person. » scenario. If my interpretation is wrong or is not clear then maybe we could precise or reword this policy to make it clearer. For the other cases listed on the policy, I still think that "must" is better than "encourages to". Cheers, [[User:VIGNERON|VIGNERON]] ([[User talk:VIGNERON|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:00, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

* {{question}} How can we have a policy of our own, if we do not have the tools to verify an abuse? [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 07:36, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
** CheckUser is always useful as there's usually an steward online. I don't think not having a local CheckUser will have any significant difference.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:02, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
***I agree using the Stewards fits us very well here. But they have to follow global policies. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 12:24, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
****{{ping|Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra}} We ''do'' have the tools to verify account abuse, namely CheckUser. There have been no problems with the way stewards have carried out these checks.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:06, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
* I agree that the current Wikidata policy is too strict. Most people who actually abuse multiple accounts don't follow the rules in the first place and it limits well-intentioned use of multiple accounts by people who want to follow the rules. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 13:57, 15 July 2019 (UTC)

== Q256916 ==

{{moved discussion to|Wikidata:Administrators' noticeboard}}
:Arbitrary signature for archiving. &mdash;&nbsp;regards, [[User:-revi|<span style="color:green;font-family:Courier new, serif;font-variant:small-caps">Revi</span>]] 12:00, 15 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata weekly summary #373 ==

<div class="plainlinks mw-content-ltr" lang="en" dir="ltr">
[[File:Wikidata-logo-en.svg|150px|right]]
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">''Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.''</div>
<div style="-moz-column-count:2; -webkit-column-count:2; column-count:2; -webkit-column-width: 400px; -moz-column-width: 400px; column-width: 400px;">
* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Events|Events]]'''
** Upcoming: Wikidata IRC office hour, [https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Wikidata+IRC+office+hour&iso=20190716T16&p1=%3A&ah=1 Tuesday, July 16th, at 16:00 UTC (18:00 Berlin time)], on the #wikimedia-office channel
** Upcoming: [https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikidata/2019-July/013268.html Next LD4-Wikidata Affinity Group Meeting] on July 16th
** Upcoming: [[m:IRC_office_hours#Upcoming_office_hours|Structured Data on Commons IRC office hour for "other statements"]] on 18 July, 17:00-18:00 UTC on the #wikimedia-office channel
** Upcoming: [[d:Wikidata:Menu Challenge/Wikimania 2019|The Wikidata Menu Challenge - Wikimania 2019 edition]] starts July 16 and goes on until August 11.

* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Press coverage|Press, articles, blog posts]]'''
** [https://www.societybyte.swiss/2019/07/04/an-international-knowledge-base-for-all-heritage-institutions-part-1/ An International Knowledge Base for all Heritage Institutions] by Giovanna Fontenelle and Beat Estermann on SocietyByte
** [https://www.societybyte.swiss/2019/07/05/how-to-estimate-completeness-of-classes-in-wikidata/ How to estimate completeness of classes in Wikidata] by Michael Luggen et. al.  on SocietyByte
** [https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL66MRMNlLyR6PF2N-y8lDlYpMVdSir6O4 Videos of the presentations] given during the Wikidata + OSM workshop in London

* '''Other Noteworthy Stuff'''
** Structured Data on Commons: RDF output for MediaInfo is now available ([https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:EntityData/M77405794.rdf example])
** Edits with the tag #suggestededit-add 1.0 come from the suggested edit feature on Wikipedia's Android app: [[d:Wikidata:Suggestededit-add 1.0|see the FAQ for more information]]
** Property number 7000: [[:d:Property:P7000|DigitalNZ ID]] is live. This data aggregator has over 30 million records. The proposal was the first from [[d:User:Ambrosia10|Ambrosia10]], a New Zealand editor.

* '''Did you know?'''
<!-- NEW PROPERTIES DO NOT REMOVE -->
** Newest [[d:Special:ListProperties|properties]]:
*** General datatypes: none
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Property:P6992|IMFDB work ID]], [[:d:Property:P6993|Pro Kabaddi League player ID]], [[:d:Property:P6994|RBF amateur boxer ID]], [[:d:Property:P6995|National Transportation Safety Board report ID]], [[:d:Property:P6996|Epitafier.se ID]], [[:d:Property:P6997|magazine in BitArkivo.org]], [[:d:Property:P6998|iTunes movie collection ID]], [[:d:Property:P6999|Musisque Deoque author ID]], [[:d:Property:P7000|DigitalNZ ID]], [[:d:Property:P7001|PharmGKB ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPERTIES -->
<!-- NEW PROPOSALS DO NOT REMOVE -->
** New [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Property proposal|property proposals]] to review:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Perseus ID|Perseus ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/TuttoCalciatori.Net player ID|TuttoCalciatori.Net player ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/TuttoCalciatori.Net coach ID|TuttoCalciatori.Net coach ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Typing discipline|Typing discipline]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/video game mod|video game mod]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Arachne collection ID|Arachne collection ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/NOTAM|NOTAM]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/begin and end of covered period ; covered period|begin and end of covered period ; covered period]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/periphrasis|periphrasis]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Kerala state school code|Kerala state school code]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/The Latin Library author ID|The Latin Library author ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/type code|type code]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/FEC campaign committee id|FEC campaign committee id]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Documenta Catholica Omnia author ID|Documenta Catholica Omnia author ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Ex æquo with|Ex æquo with]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/EU Publication office ID|EU Publication office ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Supreme Court docket number|Supreme Court docket number]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/National Library of Luxembourg ID|National Library of Luxembourg ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Lebanese National Library ID|Lebanese National Library ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/National Library of Morocco ID|National Library of Morocco ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/National Library of Iceland ID|National Library of Iceland ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Syriaca person ID|Syriaca person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Syriaca work ID|Syriaca work ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Flemish Public Libraries ID|Flemish Public Libraries ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/National Library of Russia ID|National Library of Russia ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/National Library of Chile ID|National Library of Chile ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/ACMI ID|ACMI ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Australian Suppliers Directory ID|Australian Suppliers Directory ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Hazardous Chemical Information System ID|Hazardous Chemical Information System ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/ANZCTR ID|ANZCTR ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/National Pollutant Inventory ID|National Pollutant Inventory ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/AICS Chemical ID|AICS Chemical ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/PBS Manufacturer ID|PBS Manufacturer ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/PBS Drug Code|PBS Drug Code]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/BIC of the Canary Islands ID|BIC of the Canary Islands ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Arachne object ID|Arachne object ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Gotlands museum|Gotlands museum]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Indian Super League player ID|Indian Super League player ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Premier Badminton League player ID|Premier Badminton League player ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Colonial Frontier Massacres ID|Colonial Frontier Massacres ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/TheTVDB episode ID|TheTVDB episode ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Album of the Year artist ID|Album of the Year artist ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Album of the Year album ID|Album of the Year album ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/HOV-ID|HOV-ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Nosdéputés.fr identifiant|Nosdéputés.fr identifiant]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/TikTok username|TikTok username]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/NosSénateurs.fr identifiant|NosSénateurs.fr identifiant]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/eBay username|eBay username]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Jaxsta profile ID|Jaxsta profile ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Jaxsta release ID|Jaxsta release ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Jaxsta recording ID|Jaxsta recording ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Musixmatch writer ID|Musixmatch writer ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPOSALS -->
** Query examples: 
*** [https://w.wiki/66x places in Canada with no English label]
*** [https://w.wiki/678 Languages having the most usage examples in Wikidata's lexicographical data] ([https://twitter.com/fagerving/status/1150006013476646912 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/679 Map of places of residence of accused witches in Scotland, colour-coded by gender] ([https://twitter.com/emcandre/status/1149712860211232768 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/67A Symphonies written by Camille Saint-Saëns] ([https://twitter.com/WikidataFacts/status/1150019980014100481 source])

* '''Development'''
** Create docker image for wdqs version 0.3.2 ([[phab:T226939]])
** Fix an issue with JSON output lacking qualifier hashes ([[phab:T227207]])
** Track number of links to schema pages ([[phab:T218903]])
** Disable Wikidata sitelinks in ProofreadPage namespaces (thanks to Matěj Suchánek) ([[phab:T227201]])
** Fix a cache issue with the language of the "check entities against this schema" link ([[phab:T224594]])
** Add EntitySchema extension to wikibase-docker bundle image ([[phab:T226152]])
** Enable JSON-LD support for Wikidata ([[phab:T220696]])
** Add baserevid to WikibaseLexeme API module ([[phab:T225073]])
** Extracting (and logging) Data Bridge parameters from edit links ([[phab:T226994]])
** Opening a modal with edit this link information ([[phab:T226996]])
** Showing the current Wikidata value in edit modal ([[phab:T226997]])
** Disabling interactive elements while saving on mobile termbox ([[phab:T222886]])

[[phab:maniphest/query/4RotIcw5oINo/#R|You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here]]. If you want to help, you can also have a look at [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/project/board/71/query/zfiRgTnZF7zu/?filter=zfiRgTnZF7zu&order=priority the tasks needing a volunteer].

* '''Monthly Tasks'''
** Add labels, in your own language(s), for the new properties listed above.
** Comment on property proposals: [[d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Overview|all open proposals]]
** [[d:Wikidata:Contribute/Suggested and open tasks|Suggested and open tasks]]!
** Contribute to a [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Showcase items|Showcase item]].
** Help [[d:Special:LanguageStats|translate]] or proofread the interface and documentation pages, in your own language!
** [[d:User:Pasleim/projectmerge|Help merge identical items]] across Wikimedia projects.
** Help [[d:Wikidata:Status updates/Next|write the next summary!]]


</div>
<div style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">'''[[:d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Status updates/2019 07 15|Read the full report]]''' &middot; [[m:Global message delivery/Targets/Wikidata|Unsubscribe]] &middot; [[:d:User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] 15:36, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
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== Merge request ==

See [[Talk:Q24969494]]. If this is not the proper place to discuss this, please inform me where is. [[User:Renard Migrant|Renard Migrant]] ([[User talk:Renard Migrant|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:50, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Renard Migrant}} You want to activate the [[Help:Merge#Merge_gadget|Merge Gadget]]. Then you can merge items as you need. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:35, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

== Property for higher order metaclass ==

We currently have

* A is instance of B (A is order one lower)
* A is subclass of B (A is same order as B)

Is there a property that allows A to be one level higher? I think this would be quite useful. It allows one to define vague things (a higher order metaclass) in terms of more concrete things. 

For example, we can say something like 

"A dish is a class of subclasses of food."

Here "class of subclasses" is the temporary name of such a property. What this is saying is that instances of "dish" are subclasses of "food". So for example, "sauerbraten" is an instance of "dish". From the property above, we deduce that "sauerbraten" is a subclass of "food". 

The current way these items are set up, this example doesn't work. But I think this is an extremely useful property to have. "Dish" is in some senses more abstract (here, it is an order 2 metaclass). On its item page, you'd want to know how it is defined in terms of things that are more concrete, in this case "food" (an order 1 metaclass, and a subclass of "physical object").

--[[User:Johnmichaelwu|Johnmichaelwu]] ([[User talk:Johnmichaelwu|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:08, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
: Interesting idea - maybe you should create a property proposal for this where we can discuss in detail? [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:55, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
: We also have {{P'|metasubclass of}} for stuffs with the same order which are not subclasses of each other, but their instances are (taxon ranks, for example).
: I think there is current practice for this is to use a {{P'|of}} qualifier sometimes, I would not be surprised to find {{C|dish|subclass of|class|of|food}} or {{C|dish|instance of|first order metaclass|of|food}}. But maybe a new property is better indeed. <span style="border: 1px #C9C9C9;"><span style="background-color:#E8E8E8;padding:3px;">author&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:#FFFFFF;">&nbsp;[[User:TomT0m|TomT0m]] / </span>talk [[User talk:TomT0m|page]]</span> 15:48, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: Orders are a tricky business. It's hard to reason about them for people who are new to ontology and modeling decisions are often subjective in nature (often there are decision to be made about which aspects should are most important to the modelling). It's not clear to me why {{p|279}} isn't enough for the relationship between food and dish. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 14:44, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

== Duplicate page ==

[[Q13183538]] and [[Q56379325]] are for same person. Please merge [[Q13183538]] into [[Q56379325]]. [[User:SS49|<span style="color:#008000; font-weight:777;">~SS49~</span>]] [[User talk:SS49|<span style="color:#0000FF; font-weight:777;">{talk}</span>]] 15:38, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{done}} by [[User:VIGNERON|VIGNERON]]--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:07, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:55, 22 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Sheila Atim ==

Hi, I'm pretty new to this, but it looks like Sheila Atim (Q61989847) and Sheila Atim (Q65115171) both refer to the same person. Thanks! [[User:BennyOnTheLoose|BennyOnTheLoose]] ([[User talk:BennyOnTheLoose|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:40, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:Yes; merged. Thanks. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:05, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:55, 22 July 2019 (UTC)}}
== Adding missing labels or descriptions in one or multiple languages ==

Hi everyone, I notice on my watchlist we have a quite a few people working on filling missing labels or descriptions for Wikidata items. It's very good that this missing data is added, but it's a lot of single edits, [http://wikidata.wikiscan.org/?menu=live&filter=all&sort=weight&date=3&list=users this report] is dominated by these edits. Would it be feasible to cluster this so that a lot of missing labels and descriptions get updated at the same time? Might take a bit more time to setup, but the robot could just be scheduled to run every once in a while so that new items get updated too. You would only have to setup it once. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:09, 29 June 2019 (UTC)

:Maybe we could move to more structured way of doing things, e.g. [[Wikidata:Property_proposal/default_description_for_instances]]. 
:Also, maybe a nl label isn't needed for an article with an English title, at least when it merely copies the English label. "an article" here means >20,000,000 million items. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 16:29, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
::Every item on Wikidata should have a Dutch label and a Dutch description. The descriptions shouldn't be one dimensional (copy of the instance) most of the time. For example for artists we combine the country and the occupation to get something like "Nederlands kunstschilder" ("Dutch painter") and for works of art the type of work and the creator to get something like "schilderij van Vincent van Gogh" ("painting by Vincent van Gogh"). Often these kind of descriptions need to be tweaked a bit. Doesn't look like this new property is going to help a lot here. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:07, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
:::In general, I agree. For articles, I don't think the nl-label is efficient or useful. Have a look at [[Q57665075]]. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 17:10, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
:Every item on Wikidata should (ultimately) have a label and description in every language, IMHO. How we get there is a good question. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:44, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
:*Why is that? Why would it be needed for items while it's not needed for other entities? Can you explain why the nl-label needs to duplicate the en-label at [[Q57665075]]?  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 22:48, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
::I share the sentiment that every item and property on Wikidata should ultimately have a label and description in every language (having the same question of how to get there coming to mind often), but I do agree with you, {{ping|Jura1}}, that the duplication of the en label in the nl field is questionable and possibly outright incorrect. I think a better nl label would render the title of the article entirely in Dutch rather than preserving the original English. I wonder how many such nl labels are carried over from bracketed en labels (where the bracketing indicates that the label was translated from another language). [[User:Mahir256|Mahir256]] ([[User talk:Mahir256|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:57, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
:* Perhaps there should be a label for every item in every language, but mass creating misleading or bad labels via bot is not the solution. See for example [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q64578620&type=revision&diff=970793201&oldid=960931411], just one example of an often-repeated problem. In this instance, a Polish translation of an Ancient Greek play is described as "edition of/from Sophocles". Compare that description with the English description "1916 Polish translation by Kazimierz Morawski". The Dutch description does not distinguish the item from any other "edition of/from Sophocles". It also (incorrectly) implies that Sophocles was responsible for the edition, or perhaps that there is only a single work by Sophocles, neither of which is the case. The data item is for a Polish translation made by Morawski, and the language into which the translation was made is of central importance for the identification of the data item, yet it is not mentioned in the Dutch description. As a result, we have a very poor description added ''en masse'' by bot. --[[User:EncycloPetey|EncycloPetey]] ([[User talk:EncycloPetey|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:46, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
::: Mass introduction of mistakes by bots should be avoided, but an occasional mistake can happen. This is still a wiki so you can always improve something.
::: Can we go in small baby steps? Take for example [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q24074537&curid=26065681&diff=974479920&oldid=967609189 this edit] by [[User:Liridon|Liridon]]. We could invest some time to figure out between what languages names can safely be copied like for example [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q63419130&diff=prev&oldid=956947691 this edit] by [[User:Sjoerddebruin|Sjoerd]]. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:29, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:::[[User:Sjoerddebruin|Sjoerd]], i'm not sure what the problem with that edit is? Would you kindly elaborate? --[[User:Trade|Trade]] ([[User talk:Trade|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:26, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
::::What's your opinion on the 20,000,000 items for articles and their labels in Dutch? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 11:40, 6 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::The unused ones should be deleted? The whole concept of having items for citations was nice until some people hijacked the concept and turned Wikidata in an unused scientific article dumping ground. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:25, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::{{ping|Multichill}} The problem with [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q63419130&diff=prev&oldid=956947691 this] edit, is that it is hard for a software to do that. If the origin of the persons name would have been from russian or another non-latin alphabet, you cannot copy the label from one language with latin script to another. You have a similair problem with descriptions. We have added "instance of:asteroid" to thousands of items. And they also have that description in many many languages. But what should I do when I discover that this was not at all an instance of:asteroid? I can easily change the statement, but not the bad descriptions. Since I do not know many langauges, I can only delete them, but even that is hard work. So, please let them be! Concentrate on languages and subjects where people do not read English very well. I doubt you have such problems in Dutch-speaking areas. From experience I know that we do well in Swedish speaking areas. And you are not dumber than us. Au contraire! [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 19:46, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::[[Q817239|Here]] is another example where it probably went bad. His name according to P1559 was Bengt Oxienstierna. Bengt Oxienstierna is most likely the better label, but instead we have copied a text that in practise adds the Patronymicon as a separator. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 08:13, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::And [[Q1955755|here]] an example of bad script-adding of descriptions. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 13:29, 10 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{Ping|Jura1}} there's the solution for articles: I've proposed a month ago [[Wikidata:Project_chat/Archive/2019/06#Multilanguage_label]]. --[[User:Infovarius|Infovarius]] ([[User talk:Infovarius|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:17, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
::It's somewhat different. The English article could still have a (translated) title in Dutch. Your proposal sounds much like one of mine you didn't support earlier ;) [[Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Names#New_datatype:_monostring_item]] --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 18:12, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

== To disambiguate or not to disambiguate ==

If an item is a disambiguation page in some projects and normal article in other projects, how does Wikidata decide whether it's a disambiguation or not? Example: [[Q292934]]. [[User:Bennylin|Bennylin]] ([[User talk:Bennylin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:15, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{ping|Bennylin}} They're different concepts so should be split into different items.  Someone needs to go through all the sitelinks and decided what concept they represent.  Cheers, [[User:Bovlb|Bovlb]] ([[User talk:Bovlb|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:48, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
: Sometimes they are indeed the same concepts, just some have template "disambig" and the others not. Randomly. --[[User:Infovarius|Infovarius]] ([[User talk:Infovarius|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:15, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

== Religion and sources ==

Hello. I have removed {{P|140}} ->{{Q|7066}} from {{Q|57334}}. {{ping|Ghuron}} undo it  "because included in the {{Q|8985993}}". The statement has no source ({{P|143}} -> {{Q|200386}} is not a source). I have tried to find a source that 1) he said that was atheism or 2) importance sources that said that he was atheism, but nothing. So why to have the statement just because he is included in the {{Q|8985993}}. If it helps, {{Q|57334}} was buried after an orthodox christian ceremony [https://politis.com.cy/politis-news/kypros/i-kypros-apochaireta-ton-dimitri-christofia/], but I have found no source that he said that was an orthodox christian or an  importance source that claimed that he was orthodox christian. So, I believe that we can not add anything with {{P|140}}. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:50, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{re|Xaris333}} why we cannot do [https://sr.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=22026481 this]? --[[User:Ghuron|Ghuron]] ([[User talk:Ghuron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:13, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:: I am not contributing in {{Q|200386}}, I don't know the language. :) [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:44, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Neither do I, but google translate is enough to understand that there are no sources there that support atheism of {{Q|57334}}. Please let me know if you see any other my erroneous edits --[[User:Ghuron|Ghuron]] ([[User talk:Ghuron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:57, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:Given that {{P|140}} is privacy sensitive I oppose adding it based category pages of Wikipedia. It should only be added if you can provide a source. Via our privacy policy it's clear that when there's a conflict the burden of proof is with the person who wants the information to be listed. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 19:39, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:Maybe [[WD:BLP#Bot interaction with items for living persons]] should apply here given automatic nature of this job. &mdash;&nbsp;regards, [[User:-revi|<span style="color:green;font-family:Courier new, serif;font-variant:small-caps">Revi</span>]] 10:26, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

== Orcid Number ==

How is the number 4.506.903 at [[Property talk:P496]] generated/retrieved? The orcid website says there are 6.792.120 IDs.  [[User:Steak|Steak]] ([[User talk:Steak|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:50, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

: {{reply to|Steak}} I think [[Module:Property documentation]] gets it from the {{St|P496|P4876|}} statement(s). --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:54, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
::Ahh, right, thanks. [[User:Steak|Steak]] ([[User talk:Steak|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:15, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

== How can one customize permissions in a wikibase instance? ==

I would like to know how to customize permissions on a wikibase instance created from docker. Is it possible? Any hint to some documentation?

What I would like is to have allow some groups of users to edit some items, while allowing other groups of users to only visualize/query the data.

{{unsigned|Jelabra}}
<!-- [[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:32, 17 July 2019 (UTC) --><!--Template:hes-->
== How can I import properties from an ontology in a wikibase instance created with docker? ==

Is it possible to import properties from an external ontology so I could use them in my own wikibase instance?

For example, if I wanted to use the property owl:disjointWith from OWL in my own wikibase instance, how could I do it?

I saw that I could create my own properties, but I would also like to use other properties from external ontologies. 

{{unsigned|Jelabra}}
<!-- [[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:32, 17 July 2019 (UTC) --><!--Template:hes-->
== Unknown value plus stated as ==

How do I input this? I want to have "Lilian H. Zirpolo" as the editor at {{Q|Q65621317}}, similar to how it is done at {{Q|Q56848446}}. But if I only put the qualifier and no value under editor, it doesn't let me save. What am I missing? [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:32, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
:I'm not sure why you couldn't save this.  I added the "stated as" qualifier with no problem. The ''best'' solution is to create an item for Lilian H. Zirpolo - [https://viaf.org/viaf/106554832/#Zirpolo,_Lilian_H. she's in VIAF] - and delete the existing author name string statement and change the editor to the new item.  The [https://tools.wmflabs.org/wikidata-todo/cradle/#/subject/author Cradle tool author form] and Authority Control gadget make this really easy. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:10, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

== Commons P180 and Wikidata:Notability ==

If a user uploads an image to Commons and uses the {{P|180}} field, is it acceptable to create a new item for a person (or thing) that would normally fall outside of [[Wikidata:Notability]]? [[User:U+1F360|U+1F360]] ([[User talk:U+1F360|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:15, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
: No, I would say this is not acceptable.--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:18, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Yes, for me clearly acceptable & generally highly desirable under [[WD:N|criteria 3]]: It fulfills some structural need, for example: it is needed to make statements made in other items more useful. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:24, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
::: This is equivalent to saying that every detail of every photo ever uploaded to Commons is notable. I do not see how this follows from our notability policy.--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:49, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Yes for the reasons stated by [[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]]. Also when paired with {{P|2677}} and/or {{P|31}} this allows for labeling items within the image which can be useful for a number of tasks. [https://twitter.com/salgo60/status/1055439108590485504 Example] &nbsp;[[User:ElanHR|ElanHR]] ([[User talk:ElanHR|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:29, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:I think we should be cautious here,&nbsp;because a commons photo can depict anything and anyone. So allowing automatic notability provides a wide open gate to anything. I generally favour inclusion on wd, but this looks too broad to me. I drafted the [[:commons:Commons:Depicts#Generic_items|relevant paragraph]] on Commons, which encourages users to be as specific as they can be, given the existing set of WD options (rather than listing everything it is a subclass of), but this proposal would go even deeper, with no clear limit. --[[User:99of9|99of9]] ([[User talk:99of9|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:11, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:I think the intention of the structural needs paragraph is to speak about the structural needs of Wikidata and not of Commons. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 07:30, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:I think if the person on a photo is not notable in Wikidata the photo can also get deleted on Commons, because it is out of scope there. If the identity of the person on the photo is not notable it dose not need the person as {{P|180}}, then can {{Q|5}} just be use there. --[[User:GPSLeo|GPSLeo]] ([[User talk:GPSLeo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:59, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:: The trick, as always, is where to draw a line on notability. On the English-language Wikipedia, much to my amazement, members of the 9-member city council of the city of Seattle are ''not'' considered inherently notable, but anyone who ever competed in the Olympics is. 
::How notable does a band have to be before each of its members is individually notable? Is a person known mainly for always being in the lead of an annual parade in some city notable? On Commons, certainly both of those merit being individually called out in describing what the picture depicts, though as thing stand we might not give them a cagegory. - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:36, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:::The notion that we explicitly “draw lines” w.r.t. notability in Wikimedia projects is not ideal in my opinion as there is a much more important condition: we consider an entity to be ''notable'' if there is serious coverage about it somewhere outside of the Wikimedia world; that usually excludes user-generated content sources, sources that are under control of the entity to be described, and some others. Wikipedias do indeed have to be a little more rigorous about notability, as the question about which source is serious enough can be debated. As a practical approach, they do it indeed by somewhat arbitrarily “drawing lines” as an auxiliary measure. Here at Wikidata, the notability policy is designed in a way that external coverage about an entity is accessible realtively easily from each item, i.e. by references, identifiers, or connected Wikipedia articles (which themselves are usually backed by sources). The structural need criterion is an exception, but this term not well defined and it is generally not a good idea to rely on it alone if notability is questionable.<br>The problem with Commons content is that practically all the auxiliary information in that project beyond the files themselves, i.e. the information which is now gradually being transfered to SDC/Wikidata, is ''not'' backed by any sources—contrary to most other Wikimedia projects. One could of course semi-automatically transfer a reasonable amount of information to Wikidata by creating new items based on existing information at Commons, just for the sake of having it described in a structured manner. However, those items would be unsourced, and it is in fact very difficult to work with them if they are not linked against ''external'' sources; from Wikidata perspective, unsourced content is pretty much dead and unverifyable content, as most community members are not able to work with such items. Some Wikidata editors also fear that the possibility to have unsourced content in Wikidata would be exploited for undesired purposes which would be much more difficult to control. —[[User:MisterSynergy|MisterSynergy]] ([[User talk:MisterSynergy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:04, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
I'm a newbie here, so take my opinion with a big grain of salt, but my thinking is that it depends on whether the image uploaded at Commons is a work that is notable here. If a notable (by WD standards) painting depicts someone who is not notable, it may be worth creating an item about that person so that the item about the painting is more useful. If the image uploaded at commons is some random photo, I don't think we want an item about someone random in that photo. [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:25, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:That distinction seems like a reasonable one to consider, because it implies a direct structural need. --[[User:99of9|99of9]] ([[User talk:99of9|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:55, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
::I guess whatever is worth naming in a label on Wikipedia or Commons could be worth having items for here. And they do not label random people neither on Commons or on Wikipedia, only because they accidently can be found in i picture next to something notable enough to have a Commons-category or WP-article. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 07:44, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
There are two ways to look at this: is something notable *because* it was depicted? No, that would be too much. Can you create a new item because you need it to add a P180/depicted? Probably yes, but not always. I would also suggest to only add P180 to pictures on Commons where it would make sense to search for, and it would be useful in a search result. A very small church in the far background of the image will not make sense in a search result for "church". [[User:Edoderoo|Edoderoo]] ([[User talk:Edoderoo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:47, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
* Do we have any examples of what people think are poor entries, that violate Wikidata notability? Is this about people sneaking themselves in, or making entries for their favorite coffee cup? Some examples would be helpful. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:42, 18 July 2019 (UTC)

== Letter-digits or numeral letters ==

How to model letters (usually of old alphabets) which were used as a numerals? The brightest examples are Coptic {{Q|65599830}} and {{Q|65600159}} which are even not used as usual letters. Other example is Cyrillic alphabet which letters were used as numerals some time ago ({{Q|491668}}) or {{Q|108645}} or other {{Q|4063087}}. I want to add {{P|1181}} but it constrained to some quantity. I've added {{Q|82990}} to widen the constraint but I doubt now. Not all digits (ex. positional) have predefined numerical value. What are {{Q|65599830}} and {{Q|65600159}} after all? Some new class? --[[User:Infovarius|Infovarius]] ([[User talk:Infovarius|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:35, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
: Additionally, shouldn't we have all [[wikt:ru:Шаблон:123 mul|these digits]] as items, separate from {{Q|29961325}}? --[[User:Infovarius|Infovarius]] ([[User talk:Infovarius|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:08, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
::What's wrong with eg {{st|Q15074|P1181|"3"}}, perhaps with qualifier {{P|2868}} = {{Q|Q82990}}; or {{st|Q9927|P1181|"50"}} with qualifier {{P|2868}} = {{Q|Q38918}} ?  [[User:Jheald|Jheald]] ([[User talk:Jheald|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:31, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
: It might make sense to have separate items for the numeric meanings of these symbols? At least for the Cyrillic and Greek cases they do have specific numeric values (in the range 1 - 900). I'm not familiar with the Coptic case, do you have a reference on that? [[User:Jheald|Jheald]]'s solution seems fine to me also. [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:38, 18 July 2019 (UTC)

== Familysearch ==

Familysearch now has a landing page for entries on people, for users who are not logged in, using the standard Familysearch ID: https://ancestors.familysearch.org/en/L448-K6N
Should we change the url formatter to this new version? Here is the old version and what you see when not registered, or registered but not logged in: https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/L448-K6N
What do you think? --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:12, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{s}} makes sense to me. [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:15, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{s}} instead of replacing it, perhaps just add the new value with preferred rank (since the old formatter is still valid)? --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:52, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
::When I am logged in to Familysearch and I click on the url to the new style landing page, at the top is a link to login (despite already being logged in). When I click on the login button, it automatically directs me to the old url displaying the full data. So, it may not be necessary to have both. The new link redirects to the old link once logged in. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:11, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

== Inverse Properties ==

I would argue that  {{P|40}} is not {{P|1696}} of {{P|22}} and {{P|25}}. Reason:  By "A {{P|40}} B." you can not conclude that "B {{P|22}} A.". 

Also, {{P|22}} and {{P|25}} are not {{P|1696}} of {{P|40}}, because {{P|1696}} is a symmetric property. [[User:Wiljes|Wiljes]] ([[User talk:Wiljes|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:03, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
* I'd expect a property analogous to {{Q|7566}}. Do we not have one? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:19, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

I think we also have a lot of subproperties which are not really subproperties at all. I think those statements are barely used in practice, so this is probably a big mess overall. <span style="border: 1px #C9C9C9;"><span style="background-color:#E8E8E8;padding:3px;">author&nbsp;</span><span style="background-color:#FFFFFF;">&nbsp;[[User:TomT0m|TomT0m]] / </span>talk [[User talk:TomT0m|page]]</span> 16:35, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
== Improbable birth date added for Augustus ==

In [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q1405&type=revision&diff=980620952&oldid=980544800 this edit] [[User:Sergey kudryavtsev|Sergey kudryavtsev]] added the date 23 September 63 BCE as the birth date of {{Q|1405}}, and marked it as belonging to the Julian calendar (or accepted the default). Although this date can be found in sources, such as https://www.bbc.co.uk/history/historic_figures/augustus.shtml it is highly probable this date is in the [[w:Roman calendar]]. Due to irregular insertion of intercalary months and a lack of records concerning when these months were added, it is usually impossible to accurately convert a Roman calendar date to either of the two calendars that can be used in Wikidata, {{Q|1985727}} or {{Q|1985786}}. I believe the edits should be reverted. [[User:Jc3s5h|Jc3s5h]] ([[User talk:Jc3s5h|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:18, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
:As you described it, it looks to me like the main problem is the use of {{Q|26877143}}? Why (instead of a complete removal) then not simply change it to something like "unspecified calendar, assumed roman" or only "unspecified calendar". [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 07:51, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
::The only calendars that are supported by Wikidata software are {{Q|1985727}} or {{Q|1985786}}. These are the only two calendars that can be specified in Wikidata whenever a date is required. Using {{Q|18195782}} would be appropriate if it is uncertain which of the two allowable calendars is meant by a source. But it is not appropriate when the most likely calendar is one that is not supported by Wikidata.
::If we look at [[w:Augustus]] we see that paragraph 5 footnote a of [http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Suetonius/12Caesars/Augustus*.html Suetonius] is cited as the source. I personally would not want to cite a 2000-year-old source, and I have not had a chance to visit the library to find something better. The translator's footnote says in relevant part "The 23rd of September was Augustus's birthdate in the calendar of the time. It was, however, out of whack with the seasons, as is proved by the frequent statement in ancient authors that his birth sign was Capricorn; some modern writers state that Capricorn was the sign under which he was conceived." Since the "calendar of the time" was the Roman calendar, and since the Roman calendar was known to be out of whack with the astrological/astronomical signs (no distinction between those fields back then) while the Julian calendar was in reasonable agreement, it's highly probable the date is a Roman calendar date. [[User:Jc3s5h|Jc3s5h]] ([[User talk:Jc3s5h|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:10, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
*[[User:Jc3s5h|Jc3s5h]]: Could you use [[Help:Ranking]] when making such advance date editing? Otherwise people are likely to re-add the date and you are likely to feel they missed your point. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:47, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
*:I have considered that. Considering the quality and explicitness of the source I found, I should probably make the statement preferred rank.
*:If I were going to mark a value as depricated, I would like to have
*:#A source that says the wrong value is widespread but wrong, or
*:#A superficially reliable source that clearly gives the wrong value (for example, clearly says August was born 23 September 63 B.C. in the Julian calendar, together with a better source included via the {{P|1310}} property which contradicts the wrong value. (I didn't know about {{P|1310}}, thanks for pointing me in that direction.
*:I am not aware of a source for the Augustus birth date issue that satisfies the criteria I would like.
*:[[User:Jc3s5h|Jc3s5h]] ([[User talk:Jc3s5h|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:32, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
**The idea is to input values found in sources (or an interpretation of the source) and then rank them. By default, everything should get normal rank. If some are clearly wrong or require additional references, I'd deprecate these. Then it's an editorial choice which of the normally ranked ones should get preferred rank. Sometimes, there is a clear choice for that, sometimes not. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 17:05, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
***If a calendar is whacky, how does that matter? The Swedish calendar was whacky, the transit from julian to gregorian calendar was whacky. We still add extra seconds from time to time, so our calendar is still whacky. The constant shifts between normal and daylight saving time is whacky. Even if it does not have the precision of a {{Q|227467}}, the roman calendar was still the general accepted method to measure time. What is strange about that? Very recently, the definition of {{Q|11570}} changed. Last time I checked (at it was some years ago) the definition of {{Q|25250}} was very whacky. If I remember correctly, that was why {{Q|387400}} changed when we joined the EU. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 17:30, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

== Q63985101 ==

At {{Q|Q63985101}} a bot keeps removing that his sport is fishing, any idea how it should be structured to remain? --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:29, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Vanbasten 23}} --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:42, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
:There is an item for fishing as a sport: {{Q|Q283534}} --[[User:Bluemask|Bluemask]] ([[User talk:Bluemask|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:43, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
::That solves it! --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:09, 19 July 2019 (
:::The bot "understands" that "fishing" is not a sport, but if you have to put {{Q|Q283534}} I can configure it to change one thing for another. Thanks and sorry. --[[User:Vanbasten 23|Vanbasten 23]] ([[User talk:Vanbasten 23|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:07, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
::::The bot might understand but I don't! Surely there should only be one recreational fishing item. All sports are recreational activities - we don't have separate items for (for example) professional netball as a sport as opposed to netball as a hobby. Shouldn't these two be merged? (It does make sense to keep the occupation of non-recreational fishing a separate item). [[User:Waggers|Waggers]] ([[User talk:Waggers|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:20, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::FYI, what the bot was removing was the entry for "fishing" generally that comprises both recreational and commercial fishing. See {{Q|Q14373}} The issue of there being two recreational fishing items is a different topic. [[User:Calliopejen1|Calliopejen1]] ([[User talk:Calliopejen1|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:23, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
What is the difference between {{Q|Q283534}} and {{Q|Q5493838}} both have Finnish definitions and I am not using Chrome today so I do not have auto-translate available. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:14, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )}} After investigation, it looks to me like Finnish Wikipedia treats {{Q|Q5493838}} as recreational fishing and {{Q|Q283534}} as sports/competitive fishing, though I might be wrong. {{Q|Q5493838}} says something to the effect of "done mostly to acquire experience". [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:52, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

== Behavioral policy ==

Hello, I want to point out that [[Wikidata:Behavioral policy (draft)|draft of behavioral policy]] is out now, it would be great if people review this and raise their points before this moves forward. [[User:Ladsgroup|Amir]] ([[User talk:Ladsgroup|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:21, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

== {{P|6104}} {{P|P5008}} ==

What is the difference between {{P|6104}} and {{P|P5008}}? Could they be merged? [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:22, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

== [[Q49324903]] and [[Q7641353]] - duplicate? ==

Both these items seem to refer to the same place but have different GeoNames IDs. Are they still considered duplicates? [[User:Ixfd64|Ixfd64]] ([[User talk:Ixfd64|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:17, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
* {{Q|49324903}} and {{Q|7641353}}: Cebuano wiki has separate articles for the beach itself & the park, so those would have to be merged first. - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:24, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
** Thanks. I don't know Cebuano but have added a request to have the pages merged. [[User:Ixfd64|Ixfd64]] ([[User talk:Ixfd64|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:31, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
***"Sunset State Beach" has the {{P|2452}} L.PRK while "Sunset Beach" has T.BCH. The set of L.PRK-codes in Geonames are known to have large problems. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 18:28, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

== Item associated with this person ==

At one time I thought there was a field for an image with a field name something like "item associated with this person". What was the proper name, or did I imagine it? For instance it might contain an image of an article of clothing they wore from a museum. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:42, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
:There's {{P|P6802}}. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:10, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

== List of missing labels ==

According to thread WikiProject Random above I wanted to ask if there are lists of items with missing labels sorted by field (music, video games, films etc.). [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:51, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
:[[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]]: You can use [https://tools.wmflabs.org/wikidata-terminator/#/ Wikidata Terminator] for that. [[User:Esteban16|Esteban16]] ([[User talk:Esteban16|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:57, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{re|Esteban16}} It doesn't works (it stuck at "Getting item candidates") and there is no way to choose field of interest. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:05, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
::::[[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]]: The tool seems to has an issue. You can pick the property and value of your choice in any language and it'll display the results (e.g. {{P|31}} -> {{Q|Q7889}}). [[User:Esteban16|Esteban16]] ([[User talk:Esteban16|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:13, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
:Not sure about a sorted list, but there is [[Special:EntitiesWithoutLabel]]. You can find these kind of lists at [[Wikidata:Database_reports]]. --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:27, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
== WikiProject Random ==

I quite enjoy adding statements and sources to random items - you come across some interesting stuff and it's rewarding to see an item become much more fleshed out.

With that in mind, I decided to make [[Wikidata:WikiProject_Random]] as I think it could be an interesting way to collaborate. Check it out and fire away on the discussion page if you think anything could be improved! --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:12, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|SilentSpike}} How is this different in spirit from the [[Wikidata:Flashmob]]? [[User:Mahir256|Mahir256]] ([[User talk:Mahir256|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:00, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
::I was not aware of that project - probably because the name is not easy to find. Thanks for bringing it to my attention --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:14, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
::After reading the page I would say the difference with this project is:
::# The goal is really trying to flesh things out with sources/statements/constraints rather than just labels and descriptions. Encouraging research on the random topics.
::# It's not anonymous and ideally collaborative discussion would be more encouraged - making use of the talk page.
::# The method is to randomly generate items once per week rather than summoning a group by an individual. This means there's consistently new things to check out each week and it's an unbiased selection process.
::With all of that said, the spirit of the idea is similar. I'd been looking for a project like the flashmob so thanks again! --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:26, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
*Shall we use {{P|P5008}} for this? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 16:14, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
**Is there an advantage to that approach? I would think that property is more to mark a long-term interest in items (which perhaps we should). --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:48, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
***We could query to see how they evolve, at least for L and Qs. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 08:45, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

*Is Flashmob still active? - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:07, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

== Statement display ==

Is there a gadget or user script which allows statements and their qualifiers to be visualized and edited in a table layout? Something like this?

{| class="wikitable"
! rowspan=4 | Property !! style="border-right: 2px solid #888; width: 100px" | Values !! Qualifier 1 !! Qualifier 2 !! Sources !! Edit
|-
| style="border-right: 2px solid #888" | item || item || item; item || 2 <small>[show]</small> || [[File:OOjs UI icon edit-ltr-progressive.svg |frameless |text-top |10px |alt=Edit this at Wikidata |link= |Edit this at Wikidata]]
|-
| style="border-right: 2px solid #888" | item ||  || item || 2 <small>[show]</small> || [[File:OOjs UI icon edit-ltr-progressive.svg |frameless |text-top |10px |alt=Edit this at Wikidata |link= |Edit this at Wikidata]]
|-
| style="border-right: 2px solid #888" | item || 8 items <small>[show]</small> ||  || 2 <small>[show]</small> || [[File:OOjs UI icon edit-ltr-progressive.svg |frameless |text-top |10px |alt=Edit this at Wikidata |link= |Edit this at Wikidata]]
|}

For certain properties this would probably make it a lot easier to add multiple statements without having to make a QuickStatements batch. (It takes a lot of time just to select qualifiers, especially in the British English locale because some properties' labels don't load properly.) I don't know if this sort of thing exists yet, though. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:53, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
:Have you looked at Tabernacle? [https://tools.wmflabs.org/tabernacle/?#/tab/manual/Q57873715/L%3BD%3BP31%3BP279%3BP176 Here's an example with qualifiers and references]. 
:If you use a list of items or a query, you can drag-and-drop statements from one to another.- [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:26, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
:: I haven't; thanks for linking to that. I'll try it out at some point. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:35, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

== Languages on labels list ==

How to edit (translate) names on languages on labels list? Some of them are not translated. ~ [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:54, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:I like using the [https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%92%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%BF%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B8%D1%8F:WE-Framework WE-Framework gadget]. Of course, why editing labels in different languages aren't enabled by default is beyond me. --[[User:Trade|Trade]] ([[User talk:Trade|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:32, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{re|Trade}} I mean something different. For example if you ad "fr" it tell it's "French" instead of name in your language - "Französische"/"francés"/"fransk"/"francuski" etc. (French is already translated but some languages not, it refers mostly to "rare languages"). Btw. WE-Framework looks intersting. Can I install it on ENwiki or at Wikidata? [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:01, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I wish Wikidata would just use the name of items in english when it doesn't have a label in your native language instead of giving you a bunch of numbers. I'm pretty sure WE-Framework works on both ENwiki and Wikidata. I mostly use it as an replacement for QuickStaments since i haven't figured out how to use it. --[[User:Trade|Trade]] ([[User talk:Trade|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:06, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

== Invalid archive links ==

I've just added a format constraint to {{P|1065}}, and it seems that there are a lot of concerning invalid URLs (at least, ones which don't match the regular expression). Examples:
* The old canonical URLs of things that have been moved elsewhere (e.g. https://travis-ci.org/bagder/curl on {{Q|Q286306}}).
* Links that literally do not work anymore (e.g. https://raw.githubusercontent.com/DiseaseOntology/HumanDiseaseOntology/master/releases/2015-11-18/doid.owl on {{Q|Q21510028}}). It should be possible to fix these with a bot, but only if the pages have already been archived.
* Links to Wayback Machine directory pages, with no assurance that the page has actually been archived (e.g. https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.arts-project.org/ on {{Q|Q284312}}). It should be possible to fix these with a bot, but only if the pages have already been archived or can still be archived.
* Links to websites which only archive a very specific sort of content in limited quantities (e.g. http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/6071 for {{Q|Q19098306}}). I probably wouldn't consider these valid values, because those sites are not for archiving arbitrary HTTP links, and arguably aren't archives to begin with. (Most would also be at higher risk of themselves disappearing and not being replaced than, say, the Internet Archive.)
* Links to the beta version of the Internet Archive Wayback Machine (e.g. https://web-beta.archive.org/web/20160929164541/http://www.pref.hokkaido.lg.jp/ss/jsk/opendata/opendata.htm on {{Q|Q1037393}}), which is now closed. It should be fairly easy to fix these.

[[User:GreenC|GreenC]]'s bot usually fixes these sorts of things on certain Wikipedias, but as far as I'm aware there isn't anyone fixing these right now. Hopefully these can be cleaned up before anyone actually tries to use our references. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:54, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

*Looks like the new regex doesn't allow the default archive used by frwiki [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q4115189&oldid=982939925#P1065]. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 16:08, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
*: {{re|Jura1}} This is an error on my part (I forgot that it existed) and I'll fix it in a few minutes. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:31, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

*{{ping|Jc86035}} A good source for archive URL formats is [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:List_of_web_archives_on_Wikipedia here]. As can be seen, the formats are quite diverse, even within a single provider (e.g. NLA Australia and WebCite). This is not a comprehensive list but the archive services I am aware of in use on Enwiki, there are likely some more. Other languages probably have others (the frwiki "wikiwix" is included in this list). A single regex filter would be challenging to construct, a lot of real estate to cover. I can provide regex statements for each individually if interested.  -- [[User:GreenC|GreenC]] ([[User talk:GreenC|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:17, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
*: {{re|GreenC}} The regex I used is on the property page. It only works for seven services right now (Wayback Machine, Internet Archive files, archive.today, Webrecorder, perma.cc, WebCite and megalodon.jp), but most of [https://query.wikidata.org/#SELECT%20%3Fitem%20%3FitemLabel%20%3Fvalue%20%3Fresult%20%28STRLEN%28STR%28%3Fvalue%29%29%20AS%20%3Fstringlength%29%20%20%3Fsnak%20%3Frank%0AWHERE%0A%7B%0A%09%7B%0A%09%09SELECT%20%3Fitem%20%3Fvalue%20%3Fresult%20%3Fsnak%20%3Frank%0A%09%09WHERE%0A%09%09%7B%0A%09%09%09%7B%0A%09%09%09%09%3Fitem%20p%3AP1065%20%5B%20ps%3AP1065%20%3Fvalue%3B%20wikibase%3Arank%20%3Frank%20%5D%20.%0A%09%09%09%09BIND%28%22mainsnak%22%20AS%20%3Fsnak%29%20.%0A%09%09%09%7D%20UNION%20%7B%0A%09%09%09%09%3Fstatement1%20pq%3AP1065%20%3Fvalue%3B%0A%09%09%09%09%09wikibase%3Arank%20%3Frank%20.%0A%09%09%09%09%3Fitem%20%3Fp1%20%3Fstatement1%20.%0A%09%09%09%09BIND%28%22qualifier%22%20AS%20%3Fsnak%29%20.%0A%09%09%09%7D%20UNION%20%7B%0A%09%09%09%09%3Fref%20pr%3AP1065%20%3Fvalue%20.%0A%09%09%09%09%3Fstatement2%20prov%3AwasDerivedFrom%20%3Fref%3B%0A%09%09%09%09%09wikibase%3Arank%20%3Frank%20.%0A%09%09%09%09%3Fitem%20%3Fp2%20%3Fstatement2%20.%0A%09%09%09%09BIND%28%22reference%22%20AS%20%3Fsnak%29%20.%0A%09%09%09%7D%20.%0A%09%09%09BIND%28%20REGEX%28%20STR%28%20%3Fvalue%20%29%2C%20%22%5E%28https%3F%3A%5C%5C%2F%5C%5C%2F%28web%5C%5C.archive%5C%5C.org%5C%5C%2Fweb%5C%5C%2F%5B0-9%5D%7B14%7D%7Carchive%5C%5C.org%5C%5C%2F%28details%7Cdownload%29%7Carchive%5C%5C.%28today%7Cis%7Cfo%7Cli%7Cph%7Cvn%29%5C%5C%2F%5B0-9%5D%7B4%7D%5B%5C%5C-%5C%5C.%5D%3F%5B0-9%5D%7B2%7D%5B%5C%5C-%5C%5C.%5D%3F%5B0-9%5D%7B2%7D%5B%5C%5C-%5C%5C.%5D%3F%5B0-9%5D%7B2%7D%5B%5C%5C-%5C%5C.%5D%3F%5B0-9%5D%7B2%7D%5B%5C%5C-%5C%5C.%5D%3F%5B0-9%5D%7B2%7D%7Cwebrecorder%5C%5C.io%7C%28www%5C%5C.%29%3Fwebcitation%5C%5C.org%7Cperma%5C%5C.cc%7Cperma%5C%5C-archives%5C%5C.org%7C%28%5B%5E%5C%5C%2F%5D%2B%5C%5C.%29%3Fmegalodon%5C%5C.jp%7Carchive%5C%5C.wikiwix%5C%5C.com%29%5C%5C%2F.%2B%7Chttps%3F%3A%5C%5C%2F%5C%5C%2Farchive%5C%5C.%28today%7Cis%7Cfo%7Cli%7Cph%7Cvn%29%5C%5C%2F%5Ba-zA-Z0-9%5D%7B4%2C%7D%29%24%22%20%29%20AS%20%3Fregexresult%20%29%20.%0A%09%09%09FILTER%28%20%3Fregexresult%20%3D%20false%20%29%20.%0A%09%09%09BIND%28%20IF%28%20%3Fregexresult%20%3D%20true%2C%20%22pass%22%2C%20%22fail%22%20%29%20AS%20%3Fresult%20%29%20.%0A%09%09%09FILTER%28%20%3Fitem%20NOT%20IN%20%28%20wd%3AQ4115189%2C%20wd%3AQ13406268%2C%20wd%3AQ15397819%20%29%20%29%20.%0A%09%09%7D%20%0A%09%09LIMIT%2020000%0A%09%7D%20.%0A%09SERVICE%20wikibase%3Alabel%20%7B%20bd%3AserviceParam%20wikibase%3Alanguage%20%22en-gb%2Cen%22%20%7D%20.%0A%7D the errors] are nevertheless neither links to valid copies of the pages nor links to the archive services listed on the page you linked to. I think simple domain matching would be passable for the rarer services, at least for now; so far I've only done more complex matching for archive.org and archive.today. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:31, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Agreed, a lot of garbage ends up the archive fields. On enwiki, my bot detects if the url and archiveurl are the same and removes the archiveurl if true. On Wikidata, if there is an archiveurl but no url, and the archiveurl is not a valid/known webarchive, it might reasonably be moved to the url field.. but would need to spend time in the data to make sure that is a decent heuristic. -- [[User:GreenC|GreenC]] ([[User talk:GreenC|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:59, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

== Bots for linking identically named categories ==

Hi. Is there an existing bot for linking identically named category on Commons with its equivalent on Wikipedia? I noticed that none of the categories in [[c:Category:Townships in Pennsylvania by county]] are properly linked up. I am willing and capable of writing my own bot if necessary but I would rather use an existing one if possible. [[User:Magog the Ogre|Magog the Ogre]] ([[User talk:Magog the Ogre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:43, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:I recall doing something like this back in the interwiki days, but I can't find the query. Probably got lost in one of the moves. You can just do a database query for the categories on the English Wikipedia and Wikimedia Commons that have the same name, but the Commons Category doesn't exist on the linked Wikidata item. Not all exact matches are the same by the way, some disambiguation might not have happened on either side so you have to apply some filtering. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:08, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

== Music festivals ==

Hi, anyone experience working on music festivals? I looked around and couldn't find any really good examples so I expanded {{Q|Q58329019}}. It contains things like where it was, when it was, who was playing, how much it costed and amount of people (once that data becomes available). Anything missing? Some points I ran into:
* Not sure what the best way is to indicate as a qualifier for {{P|P585}} that it's in the Pentecost weekend. Maybe make a new item "Pentecost weekend" for that?
* I used ''unknown value'' for {{P|P710}} qualified with {{P|P1810}} to get all the acts listed. Seems to be the cleanest approach
* Not sure what to make of {{Q|Q41582469}}. Seems to be an overly specific intersection of {{Q|Q27968043}} and {{Q|Q868557}}
* Any idea how to indicate it was sold out?
What do you think? Anything missing or should be improved? On [[User:Multichill/Pinkpop]] I created an overview of all editions. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:42, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:I use the gadget Recoin which suggests a number of additional properties.  The most important I'd say is:  {{Q|P664}}. - [[User:Kosboot|Kosboot]] ([[User talk:Kosboot|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:25, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{Ping|Kosboot}} Good point, I skipped it because it was this tiny organisation ({{Q|Q65720246}}) that mostly focuses on the festival. Added now. Also added {{P|P371}}. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:56, 21 July 2019 (UTC) 
:Looks good. If one uses a value in {{P|179}} probably it shouldn't be in {{P|31}} as well.  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 14:43, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{Ping|Jura1}} I looked at that when I was expanding the item and decided to do both. High profile items like {{Q|Q9095390}} and {{Q|Q50391517}} are also done like that. Bit of redundancy doesn't hurt I guess. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:56, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::: I have removed them and added {{P|179}} if neede. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:35, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::*Oh, the tennis stuff is somewhat complicated ;) <br>To determine if one wants to use music festival edition (Q41582469) or not, it might be interesting to see if the properties used on these instances are similar to the generic festival edition (Q27968043) or not.  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 16:41, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Other festivals, Tour de France, etc., it's all using {{P|31}}.
::::{{Ping|Eurohunter}} please don't [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q58329019&type=revision&diff=982928849&oldid=982918738 remove valid statements] especially when conversation is ongoing and the removal is disputed. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:52, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: {{re|Multichill}} If they are obviously incorrect they should be removed (it was known before this discussion). You should notice that they are not valid. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:12, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: Huh? You're disputing the fact that the festival took place in June 2019? [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:47, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::: No but there is already start time and end time. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:11, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::: Both time and space can be represented in multiple ways. Having one representation doesn't mean you should remove the other one. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:46, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
: You should add references otherwise data is unreliable. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:35, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

== 50 million triples deleted last week? ==

I just looked at [https://grafana.wikimedia.org/d/000000489/wikidata-query-service?panelId=7&fullscreen&orgId=1&from=1560727759000&to=1564814159000 this visualization of the number of triples] and was wondering what that large-scale deletion (or merging?) was about. Any pointers? Do we have tools that provide answers to such questions? Thanks, --[[User:Daniel Mietchen|Daniel Mietchen]] ([[User talk:Daniel Mietchen|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:42, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
{{phab|T228569}}
:There's a ticket. Gene merging, maybe, but it was slightly more than a month's worth of triple-growth, so maybe not. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:57, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

== Zewditu Menilek and Zewditu I - duplicate? ==

Looks like Zewditu Menilek ([[Q56825534]]) and Zewditu I ([[Q148524]]) may refer to the same person. Slight difference in birthdate, so I'm not 100% sure. Can someone take a look? thanks! [[User:BennyOnTheLoose|BennyOnTheLoose]] ([[User talk:BennyOnTheLoose|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:55, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
: Yes, it looks like the same person. I merged the items.--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:52, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:24, 27 July 2019 (UTC)}}
== Retrieving a QID from a DOI query? ==

Is there a template to return a wikidata QID from a given DOI?
*e.g. <code><nowiki>{{DOI_to_QID|10.1101/102046}}</nowiki></code> → Q28529449
I'm looking to implement something in Wikipedia and WikiJournals to return various Wikidata parameters of a publication given only the DOI. Thanks in advance. [[User:Evolution and evolvability|T.Shafee(evo&#38;evo)]] ([[User talk:Evolution and evolvability|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:00, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

: {{reply to|Evolution and evolvability}} You can do it with a query ([https://query.wikidata.org/#SELECT%20%3Fitem%20WHERE%20%7B%20%3Fitem%20wdt%3AP356%20%2210.1101%2F102046%22.%20%7D example]), but I don’t think it’s possible in Wikitext. --[[User:TweetsFactsAndQueries|TweetsFactsAndQueries]] ([[User talk:TweetsFactsAndQueries|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:08, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Isn't a Lua module, which the template would then call, workable? [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:56, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
::: You have to search for it, e.g. [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=haswbstatement%3AP356%3D10.1371%2FJOURNAL.PONE.0029797&fulltext=Search+for+%2710.1371%2FJOURNAL.PONE.0029797%27&fulltext=Search&ns0=1&ns120=1 haswbstatement:P356=10.1371/JOURNAL.PONE.0029797]. You can do that by bot or query, but I don't think it can be done by Lua. The best you can do is probably something like [[:en:Template:Cite Q]], which takes the Wikidata ID as the parameter and returns the rest of the article information. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:22, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
::::{{re|Mike Peel|TweetsFactsAndQueries|TweetsFactsAndQueries|Circeus}} Is that a fundamental limitation of the wikitext/lua language or just something that hasn't yet been implemented? It seems that part of the reason [[:en:Template:Cite Q|Cite Q]] isn't used is that looking up the QID is an extra hassle if you only know the doi/pmid. [[User:Evolution and evolvability|T.Shafee(evo&#38;evo)]] ([[User talk:Evolution and evolvability|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:42, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: Mostly the latter. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:47, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

== Racing and race ==

Shouldn't be race separated from {{Q|878123}}? [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:48, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{re|Eurohunter}} {{Q|Q22938576}} already exists, so sitelinks could be moved between the two items. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:30, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

== documentation ? - name for Wikidata Query Service visualization package ==

The [[Wikidata:Wikidata Query Service]] can output data from queries into various visualizations.

Do we have a documentation page for the WDQS visualizations? Do we call these the "Wikidata Query Service Visualizations"?

Answer here or at [[Wikidata_talk:SPARQL_query_service#Name_for_the_visualization_suite?]]. Thanks. [[User:Bluerasberry|<span style="background:#cedff2;color:#11e">''' Blue Rasberry '''</span>]][[User talk:Bluerasberry|<span style="cursor:help"><span style="background:#cedff2;color:#11e">(talk)</span></span>]] 22:44, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:&rarr;[[Wikidata:SPARQL query service/Wikidata Query Help/Result_Views]]. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:37, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
{{resolved}} This is what I wanted. [[User:Bluerasberry|<span style="background:#cedff2;color:#11e">''' Blue Rasberry '''</span>]][[User talk:Bluerasberry|<span style="cursor:help"><span style="background:#cedff2;color:#11e">(talk)</span></span>]] 13:12, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata weekly summary #374 ==

<div class="plainlinks mw-content-ltr" lang="en" dir="ltr">
[[File:Wikidata-logo-en.svg|150px|right]]
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">''Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.''</div>
<div style="-moz-column-count:2; -webkit-column-count:2; column-count:2; -webkit-column-width: 400px; -moz-column-width: 400px; column-width: 400px;">
* '''Discussions'''
** Open request for adminship: [[d:Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Administrator/1997kB|1997kB]]

* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Events|Events]]'''
** Past: IRC office hour, July 16th ([[d:Wikidata:Events/IRC office hour 2019-07-16|log]])
** Upcoming: Wikidata Tainan Meetup in Taiwan, July 31st ([https://www.facebook.com/events/1165403496977594/ Facebook event])

* '''Other Noteworthy Stuff'''
** Reminder: because of a database switch, Wikidata will be read-only on July 30th, between 05:00AM-05:30 AM UTC ([[phab:T227063|Phabricator task]], [https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Translate&group=Centralnotice-tgroup-read_only_banner&task=view&filter=%21translated&action=translate help translate the banner])
** You can nominate tools for the [[m:Coolest Tool Award|Coolest Tool Award]] until July 29th
** [[:wikimania:2019:Draft|Wikimania's draft program]] has been published
** [[User:Bodhisattwa]] joined [[m:CIS-A2K|CIS-A2K]] as Wikidata Advisor
** [https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikidata/2019-July/013278.html wbEntity config value to be dropped on July 24th] - if you use it, please consider replacing it

* '''Did you know?'''
<!-- NEW PROPERTIES DO NOT REMOVE -->
** Newest [[d:Special:ListProperties|properties]]:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Property:P7007|Wolfram Language unit code]], [[:d:Property:P7008|unabbreviated text]], [[:d:Property:P7009|extracted from]], [[:d:Property:P7010|imprimitur granted by]], [[:d:Property:P7014|terms of service]], [[:d:Property:P7015|surface gravity]], [[:d:Property:P7018|lexeme]], [[:d:Property:P7045|chassis]], [[:d:Property:P7047|enemy of]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Property:P7001|PharmGKB ID]], [[:d:Property:P7002|Handball123 player ID]], [[:d:Property:P7003|ACMI web ID]], [[:d:Property:P7004|AtlasFor ID]], [[:d:Property:P7005|Adventure Gamers ID]], [[:d:Property:P7006|BIC of the Canary Islands ID]], [[:d:Property:P7011|Russian organisation number]], [[:d:Property:P7012|World Encyclopedia of Puppetry Arts ID]], [[:d:Property:P7013|Anime Characters Database character ID]], [[:d:Property:P7017|Anime Characters Database anime ID]], [[:d:Property:P7019|ANZCTR ID]], [[:d:Property:P7020|Arachne collection ID]], [[:d:Property:P7021|Arachne object ID]], [[:d:Property:P7022|Australian Suppliers Directory ID]], [[:d:Property:P7023|Biyografya ID]], [[:d:Property:P7024|Flemish Public Libraries ID]], [[:d:Property:P7025|HCIS ID]], [[:d:Property:P7026|Lebanese National Library ID]], [[:d:Property:P7027|MPG ID]], [[:d:Property:P7028|National Library of Luxembourg ID]], [[:d:Property:P7029|National Library of Russia ID]], [[:d:Property:P7030|National Pollutant Inventory ID]], [[:d:Property:P7031|Penguin India author ID]], [[:d:Property:P7032|Repertorium van ambtsdragers en ambtenaren id]], [[:d:Property:P7033|Australian Educational Vocabulary ID]], [[:d:Property:P7034|Syriaca work ID]], [[:d:Property:P7035|TuttoCalciatori.Net coach ID]], [[:d:Property:P7036|TuttoCalciatori.Net player ID]], [[:d:Property:P7037|COURAGE ID]], [[:d:Property:P7038|Documenta Catholica Omnia author ID]], [[:d:Property:P7039|National Library of Iceland ID]], [[:d:Property:P7040|NosDéputés.fr identifiant]], [[:d:Property:P7041|Perseus author ID]], [[:d:Property:P7042|The Latin Library author ID]], [[:d:Property:P7043|TheTVDB episode ID]], [[:d:Property:P7044|Colonial Frontier Massacres ID]], [[:d:Property:P7046|HOV-ID]], [[:d:Property:P7048|PBS Drug Code]], [[:d:Property:P7049|AICS Chemical ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPERTIES -->
<!-- NEW PROPOSALS DO NOT REMOVE -->
** New [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Property proposal|property proposals]] to review:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/image of bone or fossil record|image of bone or fossil record]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/(de)evolution method|(de)evolution method]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/WeChat Official Account|WeChat Official Account]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Dose|Dose]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/hat Mitglied|hat Mitglied]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Variété de la forme|Variété de la forme]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/value group number|value group number]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/orientation|orientation]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Digital audio workstation|Digital audio workstation]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/title geographic ref|title geographic ref]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/location of point of view|location of point of view]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/misas.org Catholic church ID|misas.org Catholic church ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/identificador de arte público de Zaragoza|identificador de arte público de Zaragoza]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Taxonomicon ID|Taxonomicon ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Wayback ID|Wayback ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Common Sense Media ID|Common Sense Media ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/FFR fencer ID|FFR fencer ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Australian Marine Algal Name Index ID|Australian Marine Algal Name Index ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/ABBBS Taxon ID|ABBBS Taxon ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/AFCD PFKID|AFCD PFKID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Plant Breeders Rights Database AID|Plant Breeders Rights Database AID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/WaterNSW Rivers and Streams Site No.|WaterNSW Rivers and Streams Site No.]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Lens ID|Lens ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/LezWatch.TV actor ID|LezWatch.TV actor ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/LezWatch.TV show ID|LezWatch.TV show ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Grand Canyon Trust ID|Grand Canyon Trust ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/LezWatch.TV character ID|LezWatch.TV character ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Bossu ID|Bossu ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Textile Connect publication ID|Textile Connect publication ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPOSALS -->
** Query examples: 
*** [https://query.wikidata.org/#%23%20number%20of%20living%20people%20who%20have%20walked%20on%20the%20moon%2C%20over%20time%0A%0A%23defaultView%3ALineChart%0ASELECT%20%3Fdate%20%28COUNT%28DISTINCT%20%3Fitem%29%20AS%20%3Fcount%29%0AWITH%20%7B%0A%20%20%23%20get%20all%20the%20dates%20where%20the%20number%20of%20living%20people%20who%20have%20walked%20on%20the%20moon%20changed%0A%20%20%23%20%28person%20walked%20on%20the%20moon%20or%20person%20died%29%0A%20%20SELECT%20DISTINCT%20%3Fdate%20WHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%20%20%7B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20person%20walked%20on%20the%20moon%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%3Fitem%20p%3AP793%20%5B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20ps%3AP793%20wd%3AQ42882411%3B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20pq%3AP580%20%3Fdate_%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%5D.%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%20UNION%20%7B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20person%20died%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%3Fitem%20p%3AP793%2Fps%3AP793%20wd%3AQ42882411%3B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20wdt%3AP570%20%3Fdate_.%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%0A%20%20%20%20%23%20for%20each%20date%2C%20inject%20a%20second%20date%2C%20one%20day%20before%2C%0A%20%20%20%20%23%20so%20that%20we%20get%20a%20straight%20line%20until%20that%20date%20and%20then%20a%20steep%20climb%2Fdrop%20for%20the%20real%20change%2C%0A%20%20%20%20%23%20instead%20of%20a%20diagonal%20slope%20over%20the%20entire%20preceding%20period%0A%20%20%20%20VALUES%20%3Ftoggle%20%7B%20true%20false%20%7D%0A%20%20%20%20BIND%28IF%28%3Ftoggle%2C%20%3Fdate_%2C%20%3Fdate_%20-%20%22P1D%22%5E%5Exsd%3Aduration%29%20AS%20%3Fdate%29%0A%20%20%7D%0A%7D%20AS%20%25dates%0AWHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%23%20inject%20the%20current%20time%20as%20another%20date%2C%20so%20that%20the%20chart%20continues%20until%20the%20present%20day%0A%20%20%7B%20INCLUDE%20%25dates.%20%7D%20UNION%20%7B%20BIND%28NOW%28%29%20AS%20%3Fdate%29%20%7D%0A%20%20%23%20main%20query%3A%20find%20all%20living%20people%20who%20have%20walked%20on%20the%20moon%20at%20each%20date%0A%20%20%3Fitem%20p%3AP793%20%5B%0A%20%20%20%20ps%3AP793%20wd%3AQ42882411%3B%0A%20%20%20%20pq%3AP580%20%3Fwalkdate%0A%20%20%5D.%0A%20%20FILTER%28%3Fdate%20%3E%3D%20%3Fwalkdate%29%20%23%20must%20have%20walked%20on%20the%20moon%20already%0A%20%20OPTIONAL%20%7B%20%3Fitem%20wdt%3AP570%20%3Fdied.%20%7D%0A%20%20FILTER%28%21BOUND%28%3Fdied%29%20%7C%7C%20%3Fdate%20%3C%20%3Fdied%29%20%23%20must%20not%20yet%20have%20died%0A%7D%0AGROUP%20BY%20%3Fdate%0AORDER%20BY%20%3Fdate Number of living people who have walked on the Moon] ([https://twitter.com/WikidataFacts/status/1152587061347487747 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/6M8 Artworks depicting the Moon] ([https://twitter.com/sukkoria/status/1152568755500802048 source])
*** [https://query.wikidata.org/#%23%20persons%20that%20have%20been%20on%20spaceflights%20operated%20by%20at%20least%20two%20distinct%20%0A%23%20sovereign%20states%2C%20and%20the%20number%20of%20seconds%20they%20have%20spent%20in%20space%0ASELECT%0A%3Fperson%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20find%20persons%20%E2%80%A6%0A%3FpersonLabel%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20their%20label%0A%3FsecondsInSpace%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20seconds%20spent%20in%20space%0A%28GROUP_CONCAT%28DISTINCT%20%3FcountryLabel%3B%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20and%20all%20operating%20countries%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20SEPARATOR%3D%22%2C%20%22%29%20AS%20%3Fcountries%29%20%20%20%20%20%20%0AWITH%20%7B%0A%20%20%23%20this%20subquery%20finds%20all%20humans%20on%20spaceflights%20and%20their%20operators%0A%20%20SELECT%20%3Fperson%20%3Fflight%20%3Fcountry%20WHERE%20%7B%20%20%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%3Fflight%20wdt%3AP31%20wd%3AQ752783%20%3B%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20human%20spaceflight%20%E2%80%A6%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20wdt%3AP620%20%5B%5D%20%3B%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20has%20landed%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20wdt%3AP619%20%5B%5D%20%3B%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20has%20launched%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20wdt%3AP137%2Fwdt%3AP17%20%3Fcountry%20%3B%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20sovereign%20state%20of%20operator%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20wdt%3AP1029%20%3Fperson%20.%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20with%20%3Fperson%20as%20crew%20member%0A%20%20%7D%0A%7D%20AS%20%25spaceflight%20WITH%20%7B%0A%20%20%23%20this%20subquery%20finds%20two%20distinct%20launch%20operators%20for%20humans%20on%0A%20%20%23%20spaceflights.%20we%20order%20countries%20A%20and%20B%20by%20their%20URI%2C%20so%20that%20we%0A%20%20%23%20can%20more%20easily%20filter%20out%20duplicates%0A%20%20SELECT%20DISTINCT%20%3Fperson%20%3FcountryA%20%3FcountryB%20WHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Fperson%20%3FflightA%20%3FcountryA%20WHERE%20%7B%20%20%20%23%20find%20a%20spaceflight%20for%20%3Fperson%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20INCLUDE%20%25spaceflight%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20BIND%28%3Fflight%20AS%20%3FflightA%29%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20BIND%28%3Fcountry%20AS%20%3FcountryA%29%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%7D%0A%20%20%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Fperson%20%3FflightB%20%3FcountryB%20WHERE%20%7B%20%20%20%23%20find%20a%20second%20spaceflight%20for%20the%20%3Fperson%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20INCLUDE%20%25spaceflight%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20BIND%28%3Fflight%20AS%20%3FflightB%29%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20BIND%28%3Fcountry%20AS%20%3FcountryB%29%20%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%7D%0A%20%20%20%20FILTER%20%28STR%28%3FflightA%29%20%3C%20STR%28%3FflightB%29%29%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20enforce%20that%20the%20launches%20are%20distinct%0A%20%20%20%20FILTER%20%28STR%28%3FcountryA%29%20%3C%20STR%28%3FcountryB%29%29%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20enforce%20that%20the%20operating%20countries%20are%20distinct%0A%20%20%7D%7D%20AS%20%25flightCountries%0AWHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Fperson%20%3Fcountry%20WHERE%20%7B%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20now%20get%20both%20results%20into%20the%20same%20column%0A%20%20%20%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Fperson%20%3Fcountry%20WHERE%20%7B%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20find%20%3FcountryA%20for%20%3Fperson%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20INCLUDE%20%25flightCountries%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20BIND%28%3FcountryA%20AS%20%3Fcountry%29%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%7D%20UNION%20%7B%20SELECT%20%3Fperson%20%3Fcountry%20WHERE%20%7B%20%20%20%20%23%20find%20%3FcountryB%20for%20%3Fperson%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20INCLUDE%20%25flightCountries%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20BIND%28%3FcountryB%20AS%20%3Fcountry%29%0A%20%20%20%20%7D%7D%0A%20%20%7D%7D%0A%20%20%3Fperson%20wdt%3AP2873%20%3FsecondsInSpace%20.%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20also%20get%20the%20time%20spent%20in%20space%0A%20%20SERVICE%20wikibase%3Alabel%20%7B%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20finally%2C%20get%20the%20labels%20%E2%80%A6%0A%20%20%20%20bd%3AserviceParam%20wikibase%3Alanguage%20%22%5BAUTO_LANGUAGE%5D%2Cen%22%20.%20%0A%20%20%20%20%3Fperson%20rdfs%3Alabel%20%3FpersonLabel%20.%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20for%20person%0A%20%20%20%20%3Fcountry%20rdfs%3Alabel%20%3FcountryLabel%20.%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20and%20for%20the%20country%0A%20%20%7D%0A%7D%20GROUP%20BY%20%3Fperson%20%3FsecondsInSpace%20%3FpersonLabel%20%20%20%23%20group%20by%20%3Fperson%20%E2%80%A6%0AORDER%20BY%20DESC%28%3FsecondsInSpace%29%20ASC%28%3FpersonLabel%29%20%20%23%20%E2%80%A6%20and%20order%20by%20time%20in%20space%20and%20name People that have been on spaceflights operated by at least two different sovereign states, and their time in space] ([https://twitter.com/korenchkin/status/1152688694861664262 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/6MA Temporal distribution of book editions in Swedish] ([https://twitter.com/fagerving/status/1151848898299944961 source])
*** [https://query.wikidata.org/embed.html#select%20distinct%20%3Fitem%20%3FitemLabel%20%3Fleadership_start_time%20(MAX(%3Felec_date)%20AS%20%3Felec_date)%20(MIN(%3Fdays)%20AS%20%3Fdays)%20%0A%0Awith%20%7B%0A%20%20select%20%3Felec%20%3Felec_date%20WHERE%20%7B%0A%20%20%20%20%20%3Felec%20wdt%3AP31%20wd%3AQ15283424%20.%0A%20%20%20%20%20%3Felec%20wdt%3AP585%20%3Felec_date%20.%0A%20%20%7D%20%0A%7D%20AS%20%25elections%0A%20%20%20%20%0Awhere%20%7B%0A%20%20hint%3AQuery%20hint%3Aoptimizer%20%22None%22.%0A%20%20%3Frole%20wdt%3AP279%3F%20wd%3AQ1553195%20.%0A%20%20%3Fpos_stmt%20ps%3AP39%20%3Frole%20.%0A%20%20%3Fpos_stmt%20pq%3AP580%20%3Fleadership_start_time%20.%0A%20%20FILTER%20(year(%3Fleadership_start_time)%20%3E%201945)%20.%0A%20%20MINUS%20%7B%3Frole%20p%3AP279%2Fpq%3AP642%2Fwdt%3AP31%20wd%3AQ848197%7D%20.%0A%20%20%3Fitem%20p%3AP39%20%3Fpos_stmt%20.%0A%20%20%3Fitem%20wdt%3AP39%2Fwdt%3AP279%20wd%3AQ16707842%20.%0A%20%20INCLUDE%20%25elections%20.%0A%20%20FILTER%20(%3Felec_date%20%3C%20%3Fleadership_start_time).%0A%20%20BIND%20((%3Fleadership_start_time%20-%20%3Felec_date)%20AS%20%3Fdays)%0A%20%20%20%20%0A%20%20SERVICE%20wikibase%3Alabel%20%7B%20bd%3AserviceParam%20wikibase%3Alanguage%20%22%5BAUTO_LANGUAGE%5D%2Cen%22.%20%7D%20.%0A%7D%20GROUP%20BY%20%3Fitem%20%3FitemLabel%20%3Fleadership_start_time%0AORDER%20BY%20DESC(%3Fdays)%0A%20%20%20%20 How long after a UK general election that a political party has appointed a new leader, since 1945] ([https://www.facebook.com/nicholas.whyte/posts/10161973875865228?comment_id=10161974589555228 source])
** Newest database reports: [[d:Wikidata:WikiProject Ireland/lists/names/family names|family names in Ireland]]

* '''Development'''
** Fix a bug that was preventing to add multiple glosses ([[phab:T228080]])
** Show number of senses and forms on page information for WikibaseLexeme entities ([[phab:T224844]])
** Show number of statements and external identifiers on page information for Wikibase entities ([[phab:T224842]]))
** Track number of external identifiers on Wikidata over time ([[phab:T224129]])
** Fix a few queries on Grafana ([[phab:T227788]])
** Update the query host for Grafana ([[phab:T218710]])
** Add support for "MediaInfo" as value for "allowed entity types"-constraint ([[phab:T224362]])
** Data bridge: open a modal with edit link information ([[phab:T226996]])
** Show the current Wikidata value in edit modal ([[phab:T226997]])
** Extract data bridge parameters from edit links ([[phab:T226994]])
[[phab:maniphest/query/4RotIcw5oINo/#R|You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here]]. If you want to help, you can also have a look at [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/project/board/71/query/zfiRgTnZF7zu/?filter=zfiRgTnZF7zu&order=priority the tasks needing a volunteer].

* '''Monthly Tasks'''
** Add labels, in your own language(s), for the new properties listed above.
** Comment on property proposals: [[d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Overview|all open proposals]]
** [[d:Wikidata:Contribute/Suggested and open tasks|Suggested and open tasks]]!
** Contribute to a [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Showcase items|Showcase item]].
** Help [[d:Special:LanguageStats|translate]] or proofread the interface and documentation pages, in your own language!
** [[d:User:Pasleim/projectmerge|Help merge identical items]] across Wikimedia projects.
** Help [[d:Wikidata:Status updates/Next|write the next summary!]]

</div>
<div style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">'''[[:d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Status updates/2019 07 22|Read the full report]]''' &middot; [[m:Global message delivery/Targets/Wikidata|Unsubscribe]] &middot; [[:d:User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] 10:52, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
</div>
</div>
<!-- Message sent by User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)@metawiki using the list at https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Global_message_delivery/Targets/Wikidata&oldid=19220760 -->

== archive url and archive date ==

{{Tracked|T229178}}
{{P|1065}} and {{P|2960}} are {{Q|18608359}}. Is there a property constraint that, if the source have the one then must have the other too? And if yes, do you believe we have to add that constraint? [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:32, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

Or where can I suggest the creation of that type of constraint? [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:05, 18 July 2019 (UTC)
*In sources, I think "retrieved date" is the one more likely to be used. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:48, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

Ok. But I think that has nothing to do with my question. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:06, 21 July 2019 (UTC)

{{ping|Jura1}} Where can I ask for such constraint to create? [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:11, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
: I did so in the [[phab:T229178|Phabricator]]. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:00, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:00, 28 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== wbEntity config value to be dropped on July 24th ==

Hello all,

This message is important for people who still use the config value <code>mw.config.get( 'wbEntity')</code> in their tools or scripts. This value, deprecated for two years, will be completely dropped on July 24th.

The config value  <code>mw.config.get( 'wbEntity')</code> has been deprecated in order to improve the page load time, especially on large Items. Currently, a significant proportion of the HTML on every entity page is generated by this value. Dropping wbEntity completely will make the first paint (time needed to load the page) faster, and will better utilize the server and client cache.

If [[phab:T85499#5330372|your code is still using]] <code>mw.config.get( 'wbEntity')</code>, you can replace it by the hook <code>wikibase.entityPage.entityLoaded</code> ([https://github.com/wikimedia/mediawiki-extensions-Wikibase/blob/47952b3b22a4550f3b2677b96c820e559123864c/repo/resources/wikibase.entityPage.entityLoaded.js#L13 see an example here]).

On Wednesday, July 24th, we will drop  <code>mw.config.get( 'wbEntity')</code> from Wikidata’s codebase and calling the value will result in an error.

If you have any questions or need help, feel free to leave a comment under [[phab:T85499|the related task]].

Thanks for your understanding, [[User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] ([[User talk:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:44, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
:[https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=50&offset=0&ns2=1&ns8=1&search=%22mw.config.get%28+%27wbEntity%27%29%22&advancedSearch-current={} quick search for the about 50 user scripts that will break]. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:18, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata Shape Expressions Inference tool is working again ==

[[toolforge:wd-shex-infer|Wikidata Shape Expressions Inference]] ([[User:Lucas Werkmeister/Wikidata Shape Expressions Inference|documentation]]) is a tool I wrote
(as part of my master’s thesis, {{Q|Q57385555}})
that takes a SPARQL query returning a limited set of exemplary items and infers a {{Q|Q29377880}} schema from them.
I’ve never properly announced it here –
the [[Wikidata talk:WikiProject ShEx#Wikidata ShEx Inference tool|original announcement to WikiProject chat]] was [[Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2018/08#Wikidata weekly summary #326|linked in the weekly summary]],
and [[User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Léa]] mentioned it below the [[Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2019/05#Shape Expressions arrive on Wikidata on May 28th|Shape Expressions on Wikidata announcement]],
but by that point it was already broken and then I had other things to do for a while.
I’ve finally fixed it now, which seems as good a time as any to properly announce it here :)

As detailed in [[Q57385555|my thesis]], the schemas can’t be used directly for validation
(they’re so large that every validator I tried would crash, though at least one new implementation has been announced since then, which I haven’t tried yet),
but hopefully they can still be useful,
by highlighting problems in the source data (“why does the schema say that {{Q|Q202444}} is a valid class for {{P|P40}}?”)
or as a starting point for more useful schemas that you manually extract from the automatically infererred ones.

Please take a look and let me know if it works for you! --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:21, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

== Strange French Wikiquote item ==

{{Q|24248421}} came up as part of WikiProject Random and I've been unable to figure out what exactly it represents from the page history. It seems that the French Wikiquote does not have a {{Q|1197883}} page, so I figure the best I can do is share here for any French speaking Wikidata users to take a look. --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:43, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:The Wikidata title ("constraint") was an Englsh false friend. This page should have been connected to {{Q|325980}}. I've merged them. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:59, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
::Perfect, thank you! --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:44, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section_resolved|--[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:44, 28 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Need help fixing template transclusion issue ==

It's my first time really working with templates/transclusion in any meaningful way and I've run into an unexpected issue. If you check out the properties section of [[Wikidata:WikiProject_Random/Generation]] the table has an extra column compared to [[Template:Property_table]] which is breaking the links. I can only assume it's something to do with a pipe character resolving from [[Template:P]] - which I'm not sure how to fix. Any help is appreciated. --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:02, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
* I've just figured out it breaks when there are newlines between the template parameters. Ideally I'd like to fix the template so that it handles those gracefully rather than require it be used inline. --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:47, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
** Seems I've managed to solve my own problem by using [[Template:trim]] to remove excess whitespace around the passed through parameters of [[Template:P]]. --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:20, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

{{Section resolved|--[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:20, 28 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Torture type, Confession dates/locations and the Kartographer extension ==

Hi, further to our ongoing work taking information from [http://witches.shca.ed.ac.uk/ the Survey of Scottish Witchcraft database], we are looking at how to model the types of torture endured by the accused witches in this period (1563 to 1736) and how this could be incorporated into Wikidata. The information on the torture type is described as "''this field records the types of torture used in witchcraft investigations.  Torture was the application of measured pain in order to coerce a person to provide information.  None of these tortures seem to have been technically judicial torture.''" As [[Wikidata:Project_chat/Archive/2019/01#Survey_of_Scottish_Witchcraft_database_-_torture/death_modelling_and_modelling_of_16th/17th_century_locations|previous Project Chat discussions]] revolved around whether the torture was '''judicial''' or '''extrajudicial''' I'm wondering where we could go from here to model this information? A new property perhaps? 
In addition we are looking at different methods of visualisation the geographical elements from the database now that we have added 3,100 places of residence to Wikidata for these accused witches along with 543 places of detention. Simon Cobb has suggested the Kartographer extension might be one way to go. Does anyone have experience of working with this extension or could maybe suggest where we could find out more about it and how to use it? Very best, [[User:Stinglehammer|Stinglehammer]] ([[User talk:Stinglehammer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:59, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
* We do have {{P|1596}} but it seems like that property isn't what you are looking for. It might be that we do need a new property. Before making a proposal it would be valuable to look at how this kind of information is modeled out there in the world to find a good solution that works beyond the needs of your particular project. It's worth investigating whether organizations such as Amnesty International have a standardized way to record this information. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 16:45, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
** Ok, thanks. Have raised with Amnesty International as to whether they think 'manner of torture' would be an appropriate Property name given what they record. Will let you know their response.[[User:Stinglehammer|Stinglehammer]] ([[User talk:Stinglehammer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:13, 16 July 2019 (UTC)
***Hi [[User:ChristianKl|ChristianKl]], have had a reply from Amnesty as follows:
''We would normally categorise torture in line with UN descriptions - how much detail we record and/or make public depends on the circumstances and individual cases.  The facts are sometimes stated when we discuss the experiences of individuals such as Moses Akatugba who, while imprisoned in Nigeria, experienced torture such as having his finger nails pulled out by police. Here are a couple of overview pages including official torture thresholds/descriptions:[https://www.ohchr.org/en/professionalinterest/pages/cat.aspx][https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_torture_since_1948]. We are calling for clearer definitions of torture [https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/torture/]. Agree it’s important to highlight the level of suffering someone experiences due to torture but we may not always describe explicitly due to concerns about who can access the information, is it exploitative or triggering etc. This might not be what you were after but do give me a shout if I can help with anything else.''
:::*My sense is that we do need a new property to cover 'method of torture' or 'manner of torture' as it will be applicable in historic and modern instances and many of the values will be ones that already exist or be useful if they do need creating. Thoughts? [[User:Stinglehammer|Stinglehammer]] ([[User talk:Stinglehammer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:47, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::Given that the linked document speaks of "Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment" it seems to me that we need a hypernym that not only encompasses torture but also "other treatment and punishment". I do agree that it would be good to have a property proposal. We can also have the discussion about what might be a good term (e.g. the hypernym) on that proposal page. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 13:08, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::{{ping|ChristianKl}} [[Wikidata:Property_proposal/Manner_of_torture|Property proposal created here]]. We do also have rich information on date of confession and location of confession. Is it worth considering properties for place of confession and date of confession? [[User:Stinglehammer|Stinglehammer]] ([[User talk:Stinglehammer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:45, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

== Representation of Visa Policies: Attempt 2 ==

I'm not sure what the normal etiquette is for this, but since my last attempt didn't draw any discussion, I'm going to re-post my request for an explicit {{Q|Q16725895}} representation. You can find my more detailed description of the problem here:
https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/User:Tga.D/Draft:Visa_Policy_Representation

Basically, I would like some feedback from more experienced Wikidata users on which of the three representations listed there would integrate best with the rest of Wikidata. It seems to clearly be one of the first two, but I don't know enough about Wikidata norms to say which. --[[User:Tga.D|Tga.D]] ([[User talk:Tga.D|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:03, 23 July 2019 (UTC)
:For one, it's not a simple graph; it'll be a graph with multiple edges per node pair, since visa policies are typically conditioned on things like criminal history. The way these multiple (directed) edges are disambiguated on Wikidata is typically through the use of qualifying statements. For the first proposal: it's not considered good practice to create items for every "edge" as that would lead to <math>\Omega(n^2)</math> items and would be unscalable. Similarly, since the edges are directed, the third option doesn't seem to make sense to me. The second option seems best but even it needs refinement in my opinion: I don't really see the need to link another country's visa policy when discussing visa requirements for travel in the other direction. Visa policies do not partition evenly into a small number of subtypes so we should not try to summarize every visa policy "edge" that way. Instead, we should use a new statement for each type of visa entry, and for every different type of requirement. Saudi Arabia, for example, has different requirements for tourist and Hajj visas, and within each type of visa, differing requirements on a per-country basis.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:13, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

== Meta question ==

Is this always so? You're new to Wikidata, concentrate on a project topic, find a problem, come here for clarification, and then see that there are much more pressing, elementary problems on which you should work? --[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:46, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
*To some extent yes I have had a similar experience. Alternatively you encounter a modelling problem and there isn't enough interest to have a discussion and solve it (or perhaps it's that not enough users feel confident contributing to the discussion). That said, I think you should feel free to work on whatever takes your interest. What problem did you encounter? --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:03, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
**I found that protein objects were given nonsensical aliases by several bots (e.g. [[Q24248974|this double title]] or the alias "Listeria gene" in the same object or the redundant [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q24248974&diff=957301567&oldid=954083262 1]), and I was not sure if trying to stop the bot or straight batch re-editing was the best strategy. --[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:40, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

*when I don't feel like sorting out questions myself, I tend to deposit them on [[Wikidata:Interwiki_conflicts]] or [[Wikidata:Bot_requests]]. If it's a problem with a bot edit, you could try the bot operator, some are responsive, others prefer to be blocked by an administrator first. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:53, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:There used to a problem with the gene aliases, see [[User_talk:MicrobeBot#Alias]]. Maybe we didn't cleanup all old ones. From the sample given, I'd couldn't tell myself if it's problematic. Description in Indonesian seems fine. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 14:00, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::I added a [[Wikidata:Bot_requests#Protein_aliases|Bot request]]. --[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:19, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::I'm surprised you don't see the double title as problem. --[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:22, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Not sure why I was focused on the alias .. yes, it's odd. Definitely something for the bot operator to look into. Even if someone else eventually fixes it, we don't want the bot to add more of it. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 14:24, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::::OK I added a question on the bot talk page. Probably I'll look into documenting all the mess too. One code bug, and people being busy for hours. This is not effective, nor sustainable. --[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:21, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|--[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:05, 29 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== phenylbiguanide duplicate? ==

{{Q|Q25100298}} and {{Q|Q27071250}} look like duplicates, but could someone familiar with this verify before merging? Seen at [[Wikidata:Database_reports/Constraint_violations/P117#"Unique_value"_violations]]. [[Special:Contributions/73.202.12.249|73.202.12.249]] 18:59, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:The external identifiers on the two items are the same, so I went ahead and merged them. [[User:Mahir256|Mahir256]] ([[User talk:Mahir256|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:08, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved|1=[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:29, 29 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Relevance Criteria ==

Heyho, Newbie from eastern germany here. Are there any guidelines regarding possible relevance criteria for being item of Wikidata? I also noticed that there are lots of duplicate items, are there possibilities for (speedy) deletions? Greets, [[User:Arjoopy|Arjoopy]] ([[User talk:Arjoopy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:53, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{ping|Arjoopy}} [[Wikidata:Notability]]? And duplicate items should be [[Help:Merge|merged]]. [[User:Nomen ad hoc|Nomen ad hoc]] ([[User talk:Nomen ad hoc|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:01, 28 July 2019 (UTC).
:: Thx for your quick response, I'll try to get into it. [[User:Arjoopy|Arjoopy]] ([[User talk:Arjoopy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:11, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Section resolved| - [[User:Premeditated|Premeditated]] ([[User talk:Premeditated|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:27, 29 July 2019 (UTC)}}

== Duplicated values for the same property ==

Can anyone explain why it is possible to have duplicated values for the same property? [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q51138872&diff=940465820&oldid=940465348] [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q51138872&diff=982908576&oldid=947420823] -- [[User:Meisam|Meisam]] ([[User talk:Meisam|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:47, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{re|Meisam}} Sometimes this can be appropriate; for example, a person may hold an office twice. Although the qualifiers should be different in such cases, because the Wikidata website submits complex changes as multiple edits, I don't think it would be feasible to prevent this without that behaviour (and similar behaviour in third-party editing software) being changed. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:58, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
::Because nothing is preventing you from doing that. We validate after the item is saved. In this case I would expect a {{Q|Q19474404}}, but [[user:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Property%3AP2373&type=revision&diff=843405373&oldid=835222070 completely removed] that constraint. Not sure why because it had only [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:Database_reports/Constraint_violations/P2373&oldid=834593398#%22Single_value%22_violations 4 violations] so these could easily be listed as exceptions or it could be turned into a {{Q|Q62026391}}. I would restore it. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:03, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
*There is a bot that cleans out some of the unneeded statements. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 15:58, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
:Thank you all for the explanations. You are right! With the current interface (complex edits being split into multiple smaller ones) it is not possible to automatically prevent this. The bots have to do the clean-up for now. -- [[User:Meisam|Meisam]] ([[User talk:Meisam|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:10, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
Looks like I have done a mistake here. But it should be cleaned by bots (like KrBot) who looks after duplicated values. I have fixed it and i'm working on a blacklist [https://w.wiki/6Ss query] to not add same ID on multiple sites. - [[User:Premeditated|Premeditated]] ([[User talk:Premeditated|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:46, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
== Modifications via URL, batches not running ==

Hi, all:
I posted some batches via URL. I received the correct JSON message with OK and the corresponding batch number.<br>
Numbers are 16099...16105. The last one refers to wikidata, the others refer to wikidata-test.<br>
None of them run. Why? Thx. [[User:Bargioni|Bargioni]] ([[User talk:Bargioni|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:10, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
: It sounds to me like you are trying to be a bot without using the bot API or getting a bot approval. Is that the case? [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 15:14, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{Ping|ChristianKl}} I assume he's referring to https://tools.wmflabs.org/quickstatements/#/batches/Bargioni . [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:14, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

::{{Ping|ChristianKl}} You are right. https://tools.wmflabs.org/quickstatements/#/user put me in a wrong direction: ''Use the token to submit a batch to QuickStatements from your own bot (please use POST): ./api.php?action=import&submit=1&foo&bar''<br>Please give me the doc for writing a bot for atomic modifications. My idea is to keep items in sync with PUSC author id.
:::Automated bot tasked should only done by bot accounts that are approved via: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Bot_requests https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Tools/For_programmers provides a variety of tools for programmers of bots. The Python API would be an example: https://github.com/dahlia/wikidata [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 14:10, 25 July 2019 (UTC)

== property related to  fellow student ([[Q202402]]) ==

Hi! I could find the properties '''student of''' ([[property:P1066|P1066]]) , '''student''' <sup>notable student(s) of an individual</sup> ([[property:P802|P802]]) as well as '''doctoral student''' <sup>doctoral student(s) of a professor</sup> ([[property:P185|P185]])..<br/>
Is there a property related to ''' fellow student''' ([[Q202402]])? Thanks in advance! Best regards<br/>
<span dir="ltr">[[user:קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|no bias — קיין אומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן — keyn umvisndik preferentsn]] <sup>[[user talk:קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|talk]] [[special:contributions/קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|contribs]]</sup></span> 19:13, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
:As far as I know the property doesn't exist. You can still use {{p|3342}} with a qualifier. This  is an effective approach to document important relationships in a person's life, which can be quite diverse (friend, confessor, psychoanalyst, colleague, business partner...). [[User:Alexander Doria|Alexander Doria]] ([[User talk:Alexander Doria|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:22, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
: Thanks [[user:Alexander Doria|Alexander]] for the answer. What I wanted to do is adding the following relations:
: '''Alex Jacobowitz''' ([[Q338336]]) has studied marimba in New York with notable colleagues '''Gordon Stout''' ([[Q1890630]]), John Beck and '''Leigh Howard Stevens''' ([[Q16185606]]). The information is from w:de: . Could you '''please''' make / add the relation as a further sample for similar ''Wikidata linking''. Please see also [https://tools.wmflabs.org/reasonator/?lang=en&q=338336&live Reasonator for Alex Jacobowitz]. Thank you very much in advance!  Greetings from Munich, Germany
: <span dir="ltr">[[user:קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|no bias — קיין אומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן — keyn umvisndik preferentsn]] <sup>[[user talk:קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|talk]] [[special:contributions/קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|contribs]]</sup></span> 08:46, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{done}}. I wanted to add the marimba as an instrument as well but {{p|3342}} does not support that (it was anyway a bit of a hack). [[User:Alexander Doria|Alexander Doria]] ([[User talk:Alexander Doria|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:48, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
== Per-statement protection ==

Several other Wikimedia projects are (validly) concerned about the reliability of information on this project. There is much information on here that should not be changed, such as people's birthdates, and yet the only way to protect such statements is to protect the whole item. For some highly-visible items, this should not be the case. I'm hoping I'm not the only one in favor of allowing protection at this level of granularity.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:38, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
:The issue just seems to be that the development team does not consider this a priority (I know I've informally raised this to them at least once). --'''[[User:Rschen7754|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754|7754]]''' 00:42, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
:Birthdates are not a good example. There are still many errors, partly caused by the fact that the method of inserting julian/gregorian dates changed on the run, many others just because the sources don't indicate which calendar they use. The possibility to correct a date, to add another value (with a reliable source, of course) to add a source or to change rank should stay open.--[[User:Shlomo|Shlomo]] ([[User talk:Shlomo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:53, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
:As for the concerns about reliability: Protecting an item or a statement doesn't improve ''reliability'', it just increases ''stability''. If you protect a bad-sourced or misleading statement, it would more probably stay bad-sourced or misleading, because you'd reduce the set of people who are able and willing to do something to improve it. The reliability problem relates more to where the data come from. A nonnegligible (to put it mildly) part of data comes via robotic additing from unreliable and/or unindicated sources. Any perceptible progress in this issue would have much more impact on other WM projects perception of Wikidata than making editing more difficult for newcomers and occasional editors.--[[User:Shlomo|Shlomo]] ([[User talk:Shlomo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:53, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{ping|Shlomo}} Your criticism of my birthdates example is simply a red herring (i.e. irrelevant); the point being made still stands. Do not confuse this with blanket semi-protection, which there was somewhat of a consensus for (see the recent RfC), but which I opposed. Presumably, the per-statement protection would be applied after multiple instances of the correct value (''as deemed by consensus and sourcing, not just any value'') of that statement being changed to the wrong value.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:45, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
: This is a great idea which will help indeed to solve many issues, however, I am afraid, the bottleneck are the developers. We can consider trying to make it to the next year Community wishlist, but this would require a serious lobbying work on the projects.--[[User:Ymblanter|Ymblanter]] ([[User talk:Ymblanter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:01, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
: See phab. --[[User:Jklamo|Jklamo]] ([[User talk:Jklamo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:44, 12 July 2019 (UTC){{phab|T189412}}
*It would be good to see a usecase for this. The birthday sample is somewhat suboptimal: either there are references for various dates and they all should be added or there additional references for the same date and they could also be added. Maybe a filter disallowing changes to the date would be the better solution. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 11:56, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
:: The example that popped to my mind is the claim that {{Q|556}} has {{P|1086}} 1, which is unambiguously provably to be absolutely right and which is never going to change.  (And similarly for the atomic numbers of the other ~117 elements, of course.)
:: There are a lot of external ID numbers which I think fall into somewhat the same category.  {Wikipedia has some mechanism for tagging those as "verified", although I've never dug into the details.) —[[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:54, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{ping|Jura1}} You are missing the entire point of my example, which is to protect the birthdate statement ''after'' we have referenced it and solidified it to the correct, reliable, value. Creating a myriad of filters would not be scalable and would bog down everyone's editing.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:26, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Provide a better sample then. Even if a statement has a reference, it can use better references. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 14:51, 18 July 2019 (UTC)

* It would be useful to have the ability to give per-statement protection but it costs development resources. Given that statement-signing is part of the yearly roadmap for Wikidata I however don't think that it's best to push for per-statement protection right now. Let's see how statement-signing works first and afterwards we might discuss about the best way to do protection. Maybe we end up with some way where signed statements by specific sources are semi-protected. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 07:52, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
**No amount of statement signing would obviate the clear use for per-statement protection at {{Q|Q15925869}}, where I have had to protect the whole item just because some spambots are targeting one particular statement.--[[User:Jasper Deng|Jasper Deng]] ([[User talk:Jasper Deng|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:08, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

Somewhat related, it would be better if we can do per label/desc/alias language-protection: See {{Q|27092}}'s history for example. &mdash;&nbsp;regards, [[User:-revi|<span style="color:green;font-family:Courier new, serif;font-variant:small-caps">Revi</span>]] 14:24, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
=== Classify sources --> protect statements or flag when mismatch in Wikidata===
I think Wikidata as a world wide project with > 300 languages needs some kind of source "trust ranking" I can see the following scenarios that is away of a "loose protection" or at least '''{{red|warning scenario}}'''
# We use Federated search to check with a "trusted" source
## a mismatch is flagged in Wikidata
## a mismatch is seen in Wikipedia infoboxes
## a mismatch can be documented as '''{{green|OK}}'''
See more thoughts on this subject [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T222142 link] {{phab|T222142}} - [[User:Salgo60|Salgo60]] ([[User talk:Salgo60|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:56, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

== Discrepancy between gradient properties ==

I notice that {{P|2198}} has a constraint to be between values of 0 and 1 (enforcing a normalised form). Meanwhile {{P|2595}} doesn't have this constraint and allows for units of {{Q|11229}} or {{Q|181011}}.

It seems to me that both properties should follow the second approach since a gradient can be specified in multiple ways. Perhaps {{Q|1618549}} could be added as another allowed value for explicit use of dimensionless normalised form (or is it better to use <code>no value</code>?). --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:13, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

*{{ping|Smalyshev (WMF)}} could we add a conversion on query server for both as we do for SI units? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 20:53, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Tracked|T228645}}
* It should be possible to create normalization between {{Q|11229}} and {{Q|181011}}. Let's add phab task and I can take a look. [[User:Smalyshev (WMF)|Smalyshev (WMF)]] ([[User talk:Smalyshev (WMF)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:02, 18 July 2019 (UTC)

*Would we need to define [[Q199]] = 1 [[Q199]] for every (Wikidata) unitless quantity? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 22:48, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

*Unsure if relevant, but worth noting {{Q|33680}} is also a dimensionless unit which technically gradient could be specified in. --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:12, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

== Given name (or surname) populator? ==

I created {{Q|65925324}}. Now I wanna add it to all [[special:search/家駒]]. Is there a handy tool/script?--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:54, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
:Personally I'm not in favor of creating items for Chinese given names (there're millions of them with minimal additional information), but you can try [https://petscan.wmflabs.org/?language=en&project=wikipedia&ns%5B0%5D=1&search_query=%22%E5%AE%B6%E9%A7%92%22&search_wiki=wikidatawiki&search_max_results=500&wikidata_label_language=zh&interface_language=en&active_tab=tab_other_sources&doit= this] (make sure you have checked all entries before edit).--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:18, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
::We have a lot more geonames material of more dubious quality. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:39, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{re|GZWDer}} I still share the exact same thought with you. Given name should not be an item but a string. Anyway, other users disagree: [[Wikidata:Project_chat/Archive/2019/05#given_names]]. So be it. Many thanks for the link!--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:19, 25 July 2019 (UTC)

=== funny petscan result ===
The link above finds {{Q|11585042}} even though it does not contain "家駒". Instead, its description ends in 家 and its alias starts with 駒.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:32, 25 July 2019 (UTC)

*You might want to filter more, e.g. https://petscan.wmflabs.org/?psid=10251042 ( including <code><nowiki>haswbstatement:P31=Q5 -haswbstatement:P735</nowiki></code> in search, and applying some regex filter in the output tab (maybe <code><nowiki>^.*家駒$</nowiki></code>) --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:46, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

== Unit using a redirect ==

Hi. While entering data for the new {{P|7007}} I ran various consistency checks and allowed myself to fix a few unit-related data points. One fix was merging {{Q|39468084}} into {{Q|11830636}}. What happens with values for the unit-part of a quantity that is a redirect? Is there some automatic process to replace them with the target of the redirect? So far this does not seem to have happened: The following query shows (I think) that this issue currently exists.
{{
SPARQL|query=select * where {
  ?x wikibase:quantityUnit / owl:sameAs [].
}
}}
[[User:Toni 001|Toni 001]] ([[User talk:Toni 001|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:53, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
:I fixed it, as there is no bot which resolves redirects in units to my knowledge. —[[User:MisterSynergy|MisterSynergy]] ([[User talk:MisterSynergy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:12, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::Thanks. I would have done that myself, too, but wanted to know whether this is something to look out for in the future. [[User:Toni 001|Toni 001]] ([[User talk:Toni 001|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:18, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::: I believe my bot still does it but as usually it waits some time. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:36, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Well, I would not be surprised if it didn't work on units as that is a rather remote place to expect these problems. There was [[Wikidata:Project_chat/Archive/2019/05#Bug_when_units_redirected|a similar request in May]], two months after the redirect in question had been created [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q59221354&type=revision&diff=885988929&oldid=852843534]. --[[User:MisterSynergy|MisterSynergy]] ([[User talk:MisterSynergy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:40, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

: I didn't understand why a redirect is bad in this case. Are they a problem in general? I tried the query above and there is still one hit, but it's a special page so perhaps to be ignored in the query: [http://www.wikidata.org/value/e2bfb77df4ad1340fb954a85f3ee628c] [[User:Jagulin|Jagulin]] ([[User talk:Jagulin|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:05, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::Most people writing queries don't allow for them. This probably applies to every sample query and automatic unit conversion on Wikidata Query Service.--- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 14:10, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Yes, that was the motivation for my question: One could insert owl:sameAs in various places when writing queries just to follow redirects, but this might or might not have performance implications and also clutters the query. [[User:Toni 001|Toni 001]] ([[User talk:Toni 001|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:14, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

== Enquête auprès de la communauté ==

Hello les wikidatiens !

Depuis plusieurs mois, les bénévoles des [https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Working_Groups/fr groupes de travail stratégiques] réfléchissent à comment améliorer le fonctionnement de nos communautés (online et offline) et du mouvement Wikimédia en général. Pour recueillir vos avis à ce sujet, ils ont conçu un sondage qu'ils aimeraient vous soumettre.

9 thématiques sont abordées (par exemple Santé communautaire, Produits et technologies, Diversité, Plaidoyer...). Vous pouvez choisir de répondre aux questions de l'une ou plusieurs de ces thématiques.

Pour répondre à l'enquête, c'est ici : https://wikimedia.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_d718KRfJ5W3OVYV?Q_Language=FR

(Je vous encourage vivement à y participer, c'est le moment de proposer vos idées pour améliorer tout ce qui ne vous convient pas ! - Et N'hésitez pas à le diffuser autour de vous.)

[[User:DRanville (WMF)|DRanville (WMF)]] ([[User talk:DRanville (WMF)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:25, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{ping|DRanville (WMF)}} Le bistro francophone de Wikidata est [[Wikidata:Bistro|ici]] ;-) — [[User:Envlh|Envlh]] ([[User talk:Envlh|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:50, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

== Community Survey ==

Hello dear inhabitants of Wikidata ;)

For months, volunteers from [https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Strategy/Wikimedia_movement/2018-20/Working_Groups/ working groups] have been thinking about how to improve how our communities work(online and offline) and how the Wikimedia Movement works in general. Now they want to know what ''you'' think, so they designed a survey they would like you to complete.

The survey has 9  thematic areas (like Community Health, Products and Technology, Diversity, Advocacy...). You can choose to answer the questions of one or several of these thematic areas.

The survey is accessible here in 7 languages : https://wikimedia.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_d718KRfJ5W3OVYV?Q_Language=EN

Your participation is important: it is a great opportunity to suggest ideas and say how you would like our movement to evolve!

Please also share this survey around you.

[[User:DRanville (WMF)|DRanville (WMF)]] ([[User talk:DRanville (WMF)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:25, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
== A bot should add [en] labels based on commons cat names ==

E.g. {{Q|11177331}}, {{Q|10110053}}...--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:42, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{ping|Roy17}} I have code to do that, but stopped it due to [[User_talk:Mike_Peel#English_labels_from_Commons_categories_not_in_english]]. I can resume it again if that's desired. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:57, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::Yes, please do. I don't see why contributors wouldn't just edit the label if the default one isn't as good as they'd like it to be. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 05:20, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::: OK, I'm going to start running it again via {{u|Pi bot}}, in batch mode for now but I'll aim to run it daily in the future. Any problems, please shout. Pinging {{ping|Hjart}} for awareness. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:22, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Ok, I'll just remind you that lots of Commons Categories are named by native names/descriptions (see e.g. [[commons:Category:Lighthouses in France by name]]), so that this will effectively often be futile. --[[User:Hjart|Hjart]] ([[User talk:Hjart|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:06, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

== Links for units ==

Hi. I recently fixed a {{P|2442}} for {{Q|11570}}: [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q11570&diff=984839238&oldid=983501264 From "grain(s)" to "grain(s)"]. I spotted this issue using programmatic consistency checks, but it is somewhat hard to discover in the user interface. It might help if units were links or had a tooltip. Also, when opening the edit dialog it is not possible to see which unit item has been selected: Only its label is shown.
[[User:Toni 001|Toni 001]] ([[User talk:Toni 001|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:35, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

*The unit interface could probably be improved. 
:I think we can delete the {{P|P2442}} statements on {{Q|11570}}. Most other properties have checks on units implemented. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:28, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
:: In general, the Wikidata interface still leaves a lot to be desired. I would sum it up as "it's too slow and doesn't surface the right things unless specifically asked to". [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:56, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

== Are these two edits normal? ==

[[special:diff/169878974]] [[special:diff/169875877]] each merely added a sitelink, but the change was +7k bytes.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:32, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
: Yes, these are normal. See [[Help:FAQ#Editing]], #13. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:21, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

== Q65004088 and Q4987532 ==

[[Q65004088]] and [[Q4987532]] seem to be about the same footballer. I created Q65004088 a few weeks ago aware of the existence of Q4987532. Now that I found it, I decided to merge both, but the problem is that the footballer's name is different in the two places. In Q65004088 (that I created) she is called "Barbara Lorsheyd". In Q4987532 she is called "Barbara Lorsheijd". Several sources call her "Barbara Lorsheyd" including her profile at the [https://www.uefa.com/womenschampionsleague/season=2020/clubs/player=1904801/ UEFA website], her profile at the [https://www.worldfootball.net/player_summary/barbara-lorsheyd/ World Football] and even an [https://www.omroepwest.nl/nieuws/3514732/Oranje-debuut-lonkt-voor-ADO-keepster-Barbara-Lorsheyd article in Dutch]. However, at least two sources: [https://nl.women.soccerway.com/players/barbara-lorsheijd/18145/ 1] and [https://www.eurosport.com/football/barbara-lorsheijd_prs333516/person.shtml 2] calls her "Barbara Lorsheijd". What to do now? [[User:SirEdimon|SirEdimon]] ([[User talk:SirEdimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:51, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:As an example the name of [[Q12341630|this islet]] can be spelled in 2 slightly different ways. Just decide on which of your footballers names is the primary and enter the other name as an alias.--[[User:Hjart|Hjart]] ([[User talk:Hjart|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:37, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

== Changes to Wikia/Fandom URL structure for non-English wikis ==

At some point, Fandom changed their URL structure for non-English wikis from <code>$lang.$id.fandom.com</code> to <code>$id.fandom.com/$lang</code>. The interwiki fixer at wikia.com still works, and I updated the formatter URL for {{P|P4073}} to use it (this also fixes any links to wikia.org subdomains), but it's not clear if this will work in the future. Should the values for {{P|P4073}} and {{P|P6262}} be updated in any way? [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:46, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

== Grandfather ==

Hello. We are not adding that a person has another person as and grandfather, if there is already {{P|22}} in the item? Because we are not allowed to use {{Q|19682162}} with {{P|1039}} for {{P|1038}}. See [[Q65942054#P1038]] [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:33, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

*Should we? See [[Wikidata:Property_proposal/Archive/17#P1038]]. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:13, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

Then why I am getting a constraint? [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:32, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

*You read the proposal and the constraint matches that. So why should we still be adding it? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 17:42, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

How I suppose to add the information? And why the opposite is allowed? [[Q58456663#P1038]] [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:21, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{ping|Xaris333}}. The general rule is that we give simple relationships (father, child, etc) using the dedicated properties, and if we can trace a line through those on different items, we don't need {{P|1038}}. In this case, because {{Q|65942054}} has {{P|22}} {{Q|Q317648}}, which has {{P|22}} {{Q|Q58456663}}, we don't need to link {{Q|65942054}} and {{Q|Q58456663}} directly - by adding the parent/child links to all of the items in the chain, we have all he information we need.
:{{P|1038}} is to be used where we can't work out a middle item - for example, maybe we know someone was someone else's brother-in-law, but we don't know anything about the sister - or where there's a direct connection between the two items, but we don't have a suitable property (like "adopted sibling").
:I don't know why grandchild isn't in the constraint, but it might be that someone just forgot to add it. [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:53, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Fully agree w/ Andrew, [[User:Nomen ad hoc|Nomen ad hoc]] ([[User talk:Nomen ad hoc|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:30, 28 July 2019 (UTC).

== Display of "different from" ==

Has anyone an idea how to improve the display of {{P|1889}}?
* Example {{Q|1539518}}, different from:
# Gottfried W. Locher
# Gottfried Wilhelm Locher
# Gottfried Locher
# Gottfried Wilhelm Locher
# Gottfried Wilhelm Locher
I need at least one more information (like year of birth or occupation) unless I want to click through all possible namesakes. --[[User:Kolja21|Kolja21]] ([[User talk:Kolja21|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:02, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
* Do we have an optional tool on here that lets you see description & a.k.a. by hovering? - [[User:Jmabel|Jmabel]] ([[User talk:Jmabel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:02, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
** I don't think we have one, but that would be a great idea - like the WP popups. [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:48, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
* "{{MediaWiki:Gadget-PopupsFix/en}}" in the preferences should work. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:23, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::I might be an idiot (I usually am) but ... I can see how to enable the fix in preferences, but I can't find how to turn on popups proper. [[:mw:Page_Previews]] suggests it should be on Preferences > Appearance, but I don't have a popups option there. [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:47, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
{{Tracked|T229179}}{{Tracked|T222491|resolved}}
::: This time you were right. When I made that suggestion, I didn't realize that...
:::* For some reason, I haven't had it enabled. So I did it now. When I realized it doesn't work itself I started wondering why. It seems the gadget only loads when you have Page Prewies enabled... which nobody can because we don't have it [[Special:Version|installed]] (it must have been uninstalled but I don't now know when).
:::* Interestingly, it's enabled for all users by default. That's not good.
:::* There is also "{{int:Gadget-Descriptions}}". I tried to enable this one. It doesn't work, for the same reason as the other one.
::: Another source for Phabricator tasks. --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:50, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

::::{{ping|Matěj Suchánek}} Looks like I did exactly the same as you :-). Found out it the fix enabled for me, got confused, tried turning on descriptions, found that didn't work either ...  [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:59, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::To test, I had activated both *Navigation popups" and "PopupsFix". It works partially: some error message indicates the use of deprecated code. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:06, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

== SE SE Section 30 Mine (in Montana, USA) ==

Thanks to [[Wikidata:WikiProject Random]], I ended up on {{Q|Q49447247}}. I wasn't really successful trying to figure out the naming convention. I added a map query on [[Talk:Q49447247]], but maybe it's just the coordinates that are wrong. Any suggestions? ----- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 20:04, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{ping|Jura1}} I ''think'' it's a [[:w:Section (United States land surveying)]] reference format - the numbered section was the main division of land, a quarter of the section would be "SE Section 30", and a quarter of that quarter - the standard unit for selling land - would be SE SE Section 30 (or NW SE, etc). I haven't seen many places named like this so I guess they were feeling very unimaginative and there wasn't anything else locally to name it after! (Compare the tiny village of {{Q|Q7444673}}...)
:The problem is that Section 30 isn't quite enough to identify its location. The sections are numbered inside larger areas, so there will be a few different Section 30s within Silver Bow County (and that's even assuming the county label is correct). Poking around the [http://svc.mt.gov/msl/mtcadastral/ Montana Cadastral data] suggests that Section 30 of area 2S 8W is about in the right place for those coordinates, a little way east of Melrose. Nothing seems to be there any more, though. [[User:Andrew Gray|Andrew Gray]] ([[User talk:Andrew Gray|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:53, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:*Thanks, most helpful. I made an [https://tools.wmflabs.org/reasonator/?q=Q65965939&lang=en item for the block] and suggested [[Wikidata:Property_proposal/axis|x-axis and y-axis]] to define it. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 01:44, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
== How to display names for the capitals of the Ottoman Empire? ==

Hi, guys! Due to complexities in the naming issues regarding the Ottoman capital and differences between Turkish and French/English, I started a discussion at [[Talk:Q12560]]. In a nutshell, the name Istanbul only became applied to the ''whole city'' after 1923, with the name applied in English and French ''after 1930''. Before then Stamboul (French/English) or Istanbul (Turkish) referred to specifically the old city while Constantinople/Konstantiniyye referred to the entire city. What complicates it is that in Turkey today it is improper to use "Constantinople" to refer to the Ottoman capital even though historically that is what was done. 

I would like to explore whether a custom display of the city names is possible, and making it different by language (displaying "Edirne" only in Turkish but "Adrianople (Edirne)" in French and English) is possible.

Thanks,
[[User:WhisperToMe|WhisperToMe]] ([[User talk:WhisperToMe|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:34, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
: {{re|WhisperToMe}} If this is an issue with what text is being displayed on the Commons category, and the infobox header ''should be different'' to the Wikidata label, I would suggest allowing the infobox header for each language to be customized in the template on Commons, with usage being tracked so that they can be easily be reviewed if someone wants to investigate the discrepancies. Possible parameter formats could be {{para|header-fr}}, {{para|fr}} or {{para|header|fr:...;...}}. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:08, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
::Re: the header that sounds good to me! For contents inside (for example the entries in the heading "capitals") is there a way to make them display differently on the Commons? [[User:WhisperToMe|WhisperToMe]] ([[User talk:WhisperToMe|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:27, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
::: {{re|WhisperToMe}} It's possible in theory, but it could be difficult to code all of it while still making the template usable (you would have to make it possible to provide local values for each parameter in every language). It's also dependent on whether anyone's willing to do it. [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:27, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: Thanks for the answer! I wonder where I could/should make that request? Would it be in Lua? [[User:WhisperToMe|WhisperToMe]] ([[User talk:WhisperToMe|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:33, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: {{re|WhisperToMe}} Well, [[:c:Template talk:Wikidata Infobox]] seems reasonably active, so I imagine you would ask there first? [[User:Jc86035|Jc86035]] ([[User talk:Jc86035|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:21, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: {{ping|Jc86035}} Ok! I asked at [[:Commons:Template_talk:Wikidata_Infobox#Customizing_displays_of_contents_of_Wikidata_infoboxes_used_in_the_Commons]] and the response from [[User:Mike Peel]] was that language-specific stuff should be done on Wikidata, not on the Commons [[User:WhisperToMe|WhisperToMe]] ([[User talk:WhisperToMe|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:33, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::: Yup, this seems to be a data problem, not a template problem. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:53, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::: To elaborate a bit, {{ping|Jc86035}} what you're suggesting is basically to reproduce Wikidata in template parameter code. That requires >200 template parameters per field, one for each language supported. Given that the infobox has circa 500 fields (= # of Wikidata items used), that quickly becomes >100,000 template parameters. It should be far simpler to model it better on Wikidata. Thanks. [[User:Mike Peel|Mike Peel]] ([[User talk:Mike Peel|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:10, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::(To make it even worse) You have a whole item in itself about one of the names of the city in [[Q2008228]]. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 10:11, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
:::And all the enyclopedia entries are for "Miklagård"? I don't get this wikidata entry... [[User:WhisperToMe|WhisperToMe]] ([[User talk:WhisperToMe|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:27, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
::::Thought that Miklagård was referring to a fantasized Constantinople (a city in the viking tales) ? Just asking. [[User:Bouzinac|Bouzinac]] ([[User talk:Bouzinac|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:48, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::That some of them visited the city is beyond doubt. You find rune-graffiti inside Hagia Sofia. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 12:11, 24 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{re|WhisperToMe}}If it means anything I'd like to give own 2 cents, I think you're looking too deep into this. I mean while we're at it why not change {{Q|31487}} capital of {{Q|172107}} to Cracow or {{Q|1899}} capital of the {{Q|1108445}} to Kyiv as that was the historical spelling in English? 

:I think it's best practice in all cases to go with the modern, recognizable name for a given language (consulting something like ngram if it ever changes) and keep the rest as aliases. Or better yet maybe we should have a new property for historic names appear on the associated page instead of just an alias where it can be properly cited and everything? [[User:Themadprogramer|Themadprogramer]] ([[User talk:Themadprogramer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:26, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

== Q9868699 (Established in 338) and its siblings ==

One day I had the sudden urge to click '''random item''' to find something to edit. I happened to discover that there were a ton of category pages from Newari Wikipedia that follow the pattern below that had item entries designated for them here on Wikidata:

पुचः:ने॰सं॰ ३८८य् पलिस्था 

Loosely translated as (based on the Bengali label, which was the only other translation available):

Category:Established in the year 388

Looking into the history, all of these Wikidata entries seem to have been generated by a bot, as even this one for {{Q|9868699}} is actually empty, more like a default template, rather than a non-existent page. It's probably not a good decision to enforce rigorous standardization on the Wikipedias but that being said we ought to make a choice for how they (or similar auto-generated pages from Wikipedias in other languages) should be handled:

# Make sure all of these pages are marked as instances of {{Q|4167836}} and label them for at least a couple more languages since Newari has around a million or so speakers it would be a good idea to help non-speakers understand what these are.
# Link similar year-based categorization items generated from other wikis
# Delete all items which correspond to an empty page
# Delete all such items and communicate with the Newari community to make something more compatible (kind of as a last result, not really a preferable option)

Personally I think the 2nd would be the option so I'd love it if anyone could tell us if their Wiki's have anything similar.

[[User:Themadprogramer|Themadprogramer]] ([[User talk:Themadprogramer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 06:48, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:I'm new here but I think you should make a [[Wikidata:Bot requests|Wikidata:Bot request]]. --[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:03, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
*English labels for category items should start with "Category:". I added that to {{Q|9868699}}. <br><s>Maybe you could use quickstatements to merge them with some of the [https://query.wikidata.org/#SELECT%20%3Fitem%20%3Fl%0A%7B%0A%09%3Fitem%20wdt%3AP31%20wd%3AQ4167836%20%3B%20rdfs%3Alabel%20%3Fl%20.%20%0A%20%20%20%20FILTER%0A%20%20%20%20%28%20%20%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20lang%28%3Fl%29%3D%22en%22%20%0A%20%20%20%20%20%20%26%26%20REGEX%28%20str%28%3Fl%29%2C%20%22%5ECategory%3A%5B12%5D%5C%5Cd%5C%5Cd%5C%5Cd%20establishments%24%22%20%29%0A%20%20%20%20%29%0A%7D%0ALIMIT%20100 these items].</s> --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:22, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::Just saying : are year calendars in newari same than in {{Q|Q12138}}? [[User:Bouzinac|Bouzinac]] ([[User talk:Bouzinac|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:31, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
*{{ping|Themadprogramer|Jura1|Bouzinac|SCIdude}} If there's one thing I regret doing the most on Wikidata, it's early on creating items for every such other empty category on newwiki. (My honest view is that newwiki is to Indian topics what cebwiki is to world geography at large.) The year to which the category titling this section refers is not a Gregorian calendar year but instead one in the {{Q|1268741}}. (There are similar empty category items making references to years in the {{Q|1370848}} and the {{Q|370752}}. There is no such thing as a "Newari Wikipedia community"; [[User:Eukesh|the only member of said community]] lives in Los Angeles, not Kathmandu, and I have not been able to get a hold of him myself to ask about these categories. I suspect that you'll have a hard time doing this too; therefore, in the absence of such a point of contact with whom to discuss these items, the third or fourth of your given options (preferably the third) appears to be the best, both on newwiki and on Wikidata. [[User:Mahir256|Mahir256]] ([[User talk:Mahir256|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:31, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
**As it's a category item, I added "(Nepal Sambat)" to its label. Forget about merging then. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:37, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

== Wikidata weekly summary #375 ==

<div class="plainlinks mw-content-ltr" lang="en" dir="ltr">
[[File:Wikidata-logo-en.svg|150px|right]]
<div style="margin-top:10px; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">''Here's your quick overview of what has been happening around Wikidata over the last week.''</div>
<div style="-moz-column-count:2; -webkit-column-count:2; column-count:2; -webkit-column-width: 400px; -moz-column-width: 400px; column-width: 400px;">
* '''Discussions'''
** Closed request for adminship: [[d:Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Administrator/1997kB|1997kB]], welcome on board!
** Closed request for comments: [[d:Wikidata:Requests for comment/Adopt a username policy|Adopt a username policy]]

* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Events|Events]]'''
** Past: [https://drive.google.com/file/d/1E4OFIAqV8Cx4Uep19iRHfHXIr-f09j8G/view lecture on Wikidata and Mix'n'Match] at the Digital Humanities at Oxford Summer School, Oxford University, 24 June
** Upcoming: Wikimania, 16-18 August in Stockholm. [[:wmania:2019:Program|Full program]], [[d:Wikidata:Wikimania 2019|list of Wikidata-related sessions]]
** Upcoming: Next Linked Data for Libraries LD4-Wikidata Affinity Group call discussing communication in Wikidata/Wikimedia communities, 30 July. [https://docs.google.com/document/d/1C8AzcrX0Jps6010d7FjUAqRY0aLdww885tZQsi_bUg8/edit?usp=sharing Agenda]

* '''[[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Press coverage|Press, articles, blog posts]]'''
** [https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/f6d1/6eaf975af03a172c73843ff506592c952a04.pdf?_ga=2.219429597.519115585.1564069475-426632157.1564069475 Technical usability of Wikidata’s linked data - Evaluation of machine interoperability and data interpretability], by Nuno Freire and Antoine Isaac

* '''Other Noteworthy Stuff'''
** Reminder: because of a database switch, Wikidata will be read-only on July 30th, between 05:00AM-05:30 AM UTC ([[phab:T227063|Phabricator task]], [https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Translate&group=Centralnotice-tgroup-read_only_banner&task=view&filter=%21translated&action=translate help translate the banner])
** [https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikidata/2019-July/013283.html Scripts that use the Query Service need to be identified by user-agent header]
** Structured Data on Commons - [[c:Commons_talk:Structured_data#Testing_support_for_all_statements|testing statements other than Depicts]] is ongoing this week before release into production on Commons.
** [https://github.com/OpenRefine/OpenRefine/releases/tag/3.2 OpenRefine 3.2] was released
** [https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikidata//2019-July/013278.html The config value mw.config.get('wbEntity') has been dropped in order to improve the page load time]

* '''Did you know?'''
<!-- NEW PROPERTIES DO NOT REMOVE -->
** Newest [[d:Special:ListProperties|properties]]:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Property:P7069|IAAF competition category]], [[:d:Property:P7075|video game mod of]], [[:d:Property:P7078|typing discipline]], [[:d:Property:P7079|shrinkage]], [[:d:Property:P7080|specific absorption rate]], [[:d:Property:P7081|quotation or excerpt]], [[:d:Property:P7083|surface roughness]], [[:d:Property:P7084|related category]], [[:d:Property:P7086|start grade]], [[:d:Property:P7087|inverse label item]], [[:d:Property:P7095|end grade]], [[:d:Property:P7101|privacy policy URL]], [[:d:Property:P7103|start of covered period]], [[:d:Property:P7104|end of covered period]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Property:P7050|Album of the Year artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P7051|Atlas of Living Australia ID]], [[:d:Property:P7052|Jaxsta profile ID]], [[:d:Property:P7053|Indian Super League player ID]], [[:d:Property:P7054|misas.org Catholic church ID]], [[:d:Property:P7055|Jaxsta release ID]], [[:d:Property:P7056|Jaxsta recording ID]], [[:d:Property:P7057|FEC Campaign Committee ID]], [[:d:Property:P7058|National Library of Morocco ID]], [[:d:Property:P7059|Premier Badminton League player ID]], [[:d:Property:P7060|NosSénateurs.fr identifier]], [[:d:Property:P7063|Supreme Court docket number]], [[:d:Property:P7064|PBS Manufacturer ID]], [[:d:Property:P7065|Kerala state school code]], [[:d:Property:P7066|Taxonomicon ID]], [[:d:Property:P7067|Album of the Year album ID]], [[:d:Property:P7068|Gotlands museum]], [[:d:Property:P7070|Musixmatch writer ID]], [[:d:Property:P7071|Qobuz artist ID]], [[:d:Property:P7072|wiki on WikiApiary]], [[:d:Property:P7073|extension on WikiApiary]], [[:d:Property:P7074|skin on WikiApiary]], [[:d:Property:P7076|Zaragoza public art ID]], [[:d:Property:P7077|Paris Foreign Missions Society ID]], [[:d:Property:P7085|TikTok username]], [[:d:Property:P7089|AFCD PFKID]], [[:d:Property:P7090|Australian Marine Algal Name Index ID]], [[:d:Property:P7091|Common Sense Media ID]], [[:d:Property:P7092|FFR fencer ID]], [[:d:Property:P7093|ABBBS Taxon ID]], [[:d:Property:P7094|WaterNSW Rivers and Streams Site No.]], [[:d:Property:P7100|Lens ID]], [[:d:Property:P7102|Grand Canyon Trust ID]], [[:d:Property:P7105|LezWatch.TV actor ID]], [[:d:Property:P7106|LezWatch.TV character ID]], [[:d:Property:P7107|LezWatch.TV show ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPERTIES -->
<!-- NEW PROPOSALS DO NOT REMOVE -->
** New [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Property proposal|property proposals]] to review:
*** General datatypes: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/estimated IQ|estimated IQ]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Manner of torture|Manner of torture]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/date of the first one & date of the last one|date of the first one & date of the last one]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Glacier Status|Glacier Status]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/School code of the Ministry of Education, Taiwan|School code of the Ministry of Education, Taiwan]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/bequest|bequest]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Sells|Sells]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Opinion joined by|Opinion joined by]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/ComingSoon.it film ID|ComingSoon.it film ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Acknowledgments|Acknowledgments]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/copyright exemption|copyright exemption]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Subscribers|Subscribers]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/external georeferencer URL|external georeferencer URL]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/出演作品|出演作品]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Bar|Bar]]
*** External identifiers: [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Media Art Database console games ID|Media Art Database console games ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Acharts artist ID|Acharts artist ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Acharts chart ID|Acharts chart ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Museu do Diamante ID|Museu do Diamante ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/CUP2002.RU person ID|CUP2002.RU person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Euro04.Ru person ID|Euro04.Ru person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Germany06.Ru person ID|Germany06.Ru person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/08euro.Ru person ID|08euro.Ru person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/WorldCup10.Ru person ID|WorldCup10.Ru person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Gazeta.Ru Euro 2012 person ID|Gazeta.Ru Euro 2012 person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/AMPAS collections person ID|AMPAS collections person ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/AMPAS collections film ID|AMPAS collections film ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Hiking Project ID|Hiking Project ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Douyin|Douyin]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Vidwan ID|Vidwan ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/AllTrails ID|AllTrails ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Archives Directory for the History of Collecting in America ID|Archives Directory for the History of Collecting in America ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/PEPC ID|PEPC ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Bureau des longitudes ID|Bureau des longitudes ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Goibibo Hotel ID|Goibibo Hotel ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Cleartrip Hotel ID|Cleartrip Hotel ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/identifier of french public Forest|identifier of french public Forest]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Rijksmonument complex ID|Rijksmonument complex ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Mojarto artist ID|Mojarto artist ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/located on street with OSM relation ID|located on street with OSM relation ID]], [[:d:Wikidata:Property proposal/muenchenwiki.de article ID|muenchenwiki.de article ID]]
<!-- END NEW PROPOSALS -->
** Query examples: 
*** [https://w.wiki/6cX Settlements along the Way of Saint James in Basque Country] ([https://twitter.com/theklaneh/status/1155762007301378051 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/6cZ Map of places of residence of accused witches in Scotland] ([https://twitter.com/emcandre/status/1154777898647203843 source])
*** [https://w.wiki/6ca List of regional languages of France] ([https://twitter.com/ash_crow/status/1154339720660488193 source])

* '''Development'''
** [[phab:T228297|Re-evaluate supporting dcatap namespace]] (feel free to give feedback)
** Data bridge: open modal with edit link information ([[phab:T226996]])
** Show the current Wikidata value in the modal ([[phab:T226997]])
** Add editing widget/input to client edit modal ([[phab:T226998]])
** supporting baserevid request param in lexeme api endpoints ([[phab:T217245]])
** Fix new store code in order to continue the terms migration ([[phab:T226008]])
** Fix an issue with broken WikibaseQualityConstraints tests ([[phab:T228855]])
** Fix issue that used to cause many fatals on production ([[phab:T227450]])
** Drop wbEntity config in entity pages ([[phab:T85499]])
** Fix an Internal error in Recent Changes for Lexeme ([[phab:T228996]])
** Create better summaries for our wbeditentity endpoint ([[phab:T220696]])
** Respect user's preference for thumbnail sizes on Wikidata ([[phab:T224189]])
** Allow linking to Schemas in statements ([[phab:T214884]])
** Fix a bug with Wikidata Tours ([[phab:T223999]])
** Update accounting for WDQS lag in wikidata maxlag param ([[phab:T221774]])
** More work on allowing accesing one wikibase instance from another ([[phab:T214557]])
** Deploy the mobile termbox on test.wikidata.org and fix various bugs
** Show progress/activity on termbox mobile if a save request is still being processed ([[phab:T222890]])
[[phab:maniphest/query/4RotIcw5oINo/#R|You can see all open tickets related to Wikidata here]]. If you want to help, you can also have a look at [https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/project/board/71/query/zfiRgTnZF7zu/?filter=zfiRgTnZF7zu&order=priority the tasks needing a volunteer].

* '''Monthly Tasks'''
** Add labels, in your own language(s), for the new properties listed above.
** Comment on property proposals: [[d:Wikidata:Property proposal/Overview|all open proposals]]
** [[d:Wikidata:Contribute/Suggested and open tasks|Suggested and open tasks]]!
** Contribute to a [[d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Showcase items|Showcase item]].
** Help [[d:Special:LanguageStats|translate]] or proofread the interface and documentation pages, in your own language!
** [[d:User:Pasleim/projectmerge|Help merge identical items]] across Wikimedia projects.
** Help [[d:Wikidata:Status updates/Next|write the next summary!]]
</div>
<div style="margin-top:10px; font-size:90%; padding-left:5px; font-family:Georgia, Palatino, Palatino Linotype, Times, Times New Roman, serif;">'''[[:d:Special:MyLanguage/Wikidata:Status updates/2019 07 29|Read the full report]]''' &middot; [[m:Global message delivery/Targets/Wikidata|Unsubscribe]] &middot; [[:d:User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)|Lea Lacroix (WMDE)]] 15:18, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
</div>
</div>
<!-- Message sent by User:Lea Lacroix (WMDE)@metawiki using the list at https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Global_message_delivery/Targets/Wikidata&oldid=19225309 -->

== Inverse of P138 ==

Hello. Do we have the inverse of {{P|138}}? For example if a street take the name of a politician, we can have "Street item -> {{P|138}} -> Politician item". Do we have a property to show "Politician -> his/her name given to -> Street item"? Something like that. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:37, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
: I don't think such property ever existed. [[User:Nomen ad hoc|Nomen ad hoc]] ([[User talk:Nomen ad hoc|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:55, 29 July 2019 (UTC).
:: Just an useless inverse property with will lead to heavy items which will become impossible to download (some persons have dozen or even hundred streets/places with their name). The only reason of the multiplication of this kind of inverse properties seems that people don't want to use lua templates with proper extraction function. Or is there any other reason ? [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:43, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Can you link such a LUA template or is it just something you made up now? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 15:48, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: {{ping|Jura1}} Why do we have to develop lua template if people are not interested to use them ? Most WP contributor want to use wiki template and add some extraction commands in that code. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:10, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: But if you are really interested, you can have a look at [https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mod%C3%A8le:Wikidata_list Module:Wikidata_list], the data extraction function exists, there is some work to handle the output in template code. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:30, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::I don't think this template does what Xaris was looking for. "people don't want to use lua templates with proper extraction function" might suggest that such a template actually exist.  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 19:37, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::Looks like you edited your comment while I was replying to it [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:Project_chat&diff=prev&oldid=988648407], replacing LUA with with Listeria ;) --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 21:22, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::::I don't think Listeria involves any LUA whatsoever. What did you lead you to believe that? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 21:27, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::: I understood that Xaris333 wanted to perform a query and as I suppose he knows about Wikidata Query Service, the only reason to ask how doing a query is to find the way to present the results of it in table or infobox. The template I proposed indicates how to perform a query from WP and to generate a table with the results. But this template was banned from some WPs. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:51, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
: Use this query (streets named after Wilson Churchill):
:{{SPARQL|query=
SELECT ?street ?streetLabel WHERE {
  ?street wdt:P31 wd:Q79007 ;
          wdt:P138 wd:Q8016.
   SERVICE wikibase:label { bd:serviceParam wikibase:language "[AUTO_LANGUAGE],en". }
}
}}
: [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:44, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

== Patents ==

Now that every scientific publication is in Wikidata via ORCID, and editors are feverishly trying to disambiguate authors and aggregate their publications, is there any plan to upload every patent and do the same thing? Patents have extra data to aid in disambiguation. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:31, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

: "'''Every''' scientific publication"? Seriously...? [[User:Nomen ad hoc|Nomen ad hoc]] ([[User talk:Nomen ad hoc|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:35, 29 July 2019 (UTC).
: {{ping|Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )}} See [[Wikidata:WikiProject Patents]]. [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:07, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

And what about every book? --[[User:Scs|Scs]] ([[User talk:Scs|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:28, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
== Wikidata read-only period on July 30 at roughly 05:00 AM UTC ==

This was already mentioned in Wikidata weekly summary #372, but I'd just like to highlight that there's a read-only period for Wikidata on July 30. We need to replace the primary database master: the old one is old and out of warranty, and we need a new one of continue the <code>[[phab:T221764|wb_terms]]</code> redesign.

This means that the wiki can be read but not edited. The read-only window is 05:00AM UTC to 05:30 AM UTC, but if everything goes well the actual period of no editing will be shorter. When editing on Wikidata, it will be apparent that the changes are not working; you can read [[phab:T227063#5323866]] to follow the discussion about how to best solve the problem when someone moves a page on another Wikimedia wiki.

If you've got any questions, please ping me. If I can't answer, I'll try to find someone who can. /[[User:Johan (WMF)|Johan (WMF)]] ([[User talk:Johan (WMF)|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:05, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
:[https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Wikidata+ReadOnly&iso=20190730T05&p1=1440&am=30 2019-07-30 05:00~05:30 UTC in your timezone] &mdash;&nbsp;regards, [[User:-revi|<span style="color:green;font-family:Courier new, serif;font-variant:small-caps">Revi</span>]] 12:03, 15 July 2019 (UTC)
:This should stay till the readonly window is complete. &mdash;&nbsp;regards, [[User:-revi|<span style="color:green;font-family:Courier new, serif;font-variant:small-caps">Revi</span>]] 05:30, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

== How best to link the subject of an obituary at Wikisource to Wikidata ==

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_New_York_Times/Obituary;_Henry_Clay_Nelson and {{Q|Q65965909}}. If no other way I will just add as "described at url". In the past when I tried making a category for a person in Wikisource it was deleted. I was told only authors get categories. --[[User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|RAN]] ([[User talk:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- )|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:34, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

: Create a Wikidata item for the obituary copy at Wikisource. The person is the subject of the obituary, and the person is described by that source. --[[User:EncycloPetey|EncycloPetey]] ([[User talk:EncycloPetey|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 01:36, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:Yup. You'll want {{P|921}}. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 04:07, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
== Notifying participants when creating properties ==

I am worried about our convention to ping all participants of a property proposal when the property is created. When creating many properties it generates a lot of notifications for people who are active in this sphere. People might hold back from property proposals because they do not want to be bothered by these pings. For instance {{U'|NMaia}} recently supported a proposal and [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Wikidata:Property_proposal/Supreme_Court_docket_number&diff=980090352&oldid=980056933 explicitly asked not to be pinged]. Would it not make more sense to just ping the proposer? Isn't the weekly summary sufficient to stay updated about this process?

For now I am sticking to the existing convention but I have set up a mechanism for people to opt out of my property creation pings: [[User:Pintoch/property_creation/ignored_pings]]. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:14, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
:Yeah, I'd rather have this opt-in than opt-out. Maybe the MediaWiki thing that preloads the property proposal could have an additional text instructing participants to explicitly state if they want to be pinged. [[User:NMaia|NMaia]] ([[User talk:NMaia|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:49, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
::Explicitly stating that on each proposal you comment on does not seem viable to me, it is going to be quite bureaucratic and heavy, and add to the cognitive burden of property creators (or the complexity of scripts to parse that information from proposal pages).
::Isn't this what watchlists are for? If someone is interested in keeping track of the status of a proposal, cannot we expect them to just add it to their watchlist? − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:31, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
: I don't mind the pings, I would definitely opt in. It's more noticeable than a watchlist item, and I find it useful to be aware of. I comment on a lot of property proposals and I can't say I find the notifications burdensome. [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:07, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
:I value them a lot. My watchlist is very busy, but new properties really matter to me.  I will find them anyway eventually, but I appreciate the (easy to dismiss) ping if I was interested enough to do the hard work of review the proposal. --[[User:99of9|99of9]] ([[User talk:99of9|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:57, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
:I like the pings. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:24, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
:I don't think that people hold back from voting because of pings. I am voting in proposals because I am interested in the outcome of the proposal (in some cases it can take months). I am not sure about the motivation of participants who are not interested in the outcome of a proposal.--[[User:Jklamo|Jklamo]] ([[User talk:Jklamo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:04, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
:Maybe make a template like: "{{s}} ''' and notify me'''". Send notification/ping to them and the property proposal user. - [[User:Premeditated|Premeditated]] ([[User talk:Premeditated|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:35, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
:: I see property creation as a collaborative process between the people who take part in a property discussion. The act of casting a vote comes with a certain amount of wanting to take responsibility for taking part in a property proposal. Removing the pings seems to encourage people to engage less deeply with the property proposal on which they are commenting which I don't see as going in the right direction. Especially, people who have the property creator right should frequently review the closing of proposal. That review process helps us having common standards when it comes to how proposals are closed. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 14:02, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
Ok, it looks like there is a pretty overwhelming consensus to keep these pings by default. Let us keep this convention then. Thank you all for your feedback! − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:24, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{ping|Premeditated}} FWIW, I made this: {{Tl|Don't ping}}, which produces {{Don't ping}}. [[User:NMaia|NMaia]] ([[User talk:NMaia|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:04, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

== Sample for everything ==

https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Special:WhatLinksHere/Q383541&namespace=120&limit=500

I'm sure we can find better samples. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 17:47, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
: I don't see a problem here. I just completed missing examples (3 required). Most of examples come from property proposal because why not. [[User:Eurohunter|Eurohunter]] ([[User talk:Eurohunter|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:18, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
:*There is no requirement to have three on the property itself. Ideally, they don't all illustrate the same. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 18:49, 24 July 2019 (UTC)
::*{{re|Jura1}} While I wouldn't have gone through the work of adding all those examples myself I don't see a problem with it. It has even has advantages when people want to see a showcase item that shows how a bunch of properties are used. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 13:16, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

== cleanup week? ==

Is there something like a cleanup week where bots/batches are prevented from creating/adding and fixing imports is encouraged (allowing fixing bots)? 
--[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:36, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:Nope, cleanup is a 24x7 thing and never stops. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:24, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::And careless imports are also a 24x7 thing which never stops, see above… More seriously, if you find issues with a bot, you should report it to get the bot fixed. If the bot owner is not cooperative, we can undo its actions or block it if necessary. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:30, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Lol! [[User:QuickStatementsBot]] has a hell of issues, but none of them is fixed. [[User:Steak|Steak]] ([[User talk:Steak|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:20, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:: I regularly do cleanups. I have started using bots that run 24x7 that alert me about issues, but also do a lot of manual cleaning. For example, for autocreation of items based on Wikipedia pages. For chemistry, I found Wikipedia a major source of (chemical) problems in Wikidata. Tools like [[User:QuickStatementsBot]] help me solve these problems. --[[User:Egon Willighagen|Egon Willighagen]] ([[User talk:Egon Willighagen|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:31, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
::: re.chemistry, I wouldn't trust PubChem data, either... --[[User:SCIdude|SCIdude]] ([[User talk:SCIdude|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:53, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

== To throw a stone.. ==

With amazement I read a diatribe because the work on their specific subset of Wikidata is seen as difficult because of work on another subset. From my point of view I am quite happy when people work on subjects that have imho little merit like sports. However when they see it as a problem that others work on science, it follows that they fail to perceive that any and all people who are imported are linked to papers, to co-authors. When they did they would appreciate that the necessary enrichment of the associated items has been a process that is well under way. 

Arguably sports is a niche of data that has as much right to be on Wikidata as any other part so I wont go there. I will point out that science and references is the key of why Wikipedia can be trusted. It has been indicated that all references need to find their way into Wikidata. So this nonsense of calling the data associated with this of no value is factually rather empty.

Wikidata is a project where people with notable data may expand Wikidata. There is a point to this. There is little point to many areas of interest including sports. So what is it that the stone throwers want to achieve? The deletion of data that cannot be argued to have intrinsic value as the notions of notability are to be reassessed?

Thanks, [[User:GerardM|GerardM]] ([[User talk:GerardM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:18, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:Wikidata is a general purpose free knowledge base that got completely hijacked by the people using it as a scientific article dumping ground. Almost half of our items are an instance of {{Q|Q13442814}}. This completely disrupted the balance. The integration of all these items with the rest of the knowledge base seems to be minimal. It's just a data island on it's own not making the knowledge base as a whole better. So yes, I and other people are critical of this. To restore balance, it would probably be best to fork it in a separate Wikibase instance and just link to it when we're in need of a reference. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:15, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:: "Dumping ground" is an accusation that is based on perception. My reality is that I seek specific subjects and scientists that are of interest, have a Wikipedia article, are in the news. Why? Because for one "Scholia" templates are increasingly found in Wikipedia articles. First of all what is included is notable by the current definitins, it serves a purpose. We know what papers are free to read and are seeking the best method to link the papers directly from a Scholia. So the objective of it all is very much that Wikipedia readers are enabled to read the sources themselves. With such a background, I the epithet "dumping ground" is problematic. 
:: The notion of balance is wrong as well because balance in what way. What I have indicated before is that we are not using our technology to be smart about disambiguation. We do not use automated descriptions. This has two negative effects: the labels are hardly meaningful and mostly absent. When the notion of balance is introduced, lets kill off sports at the same time. It does not lead people to practice sport, its value is debatable. Thanks, [[User:GerardM|GerardM]] ([[User talk:GerardM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:46, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I'd just like to point out that the effort to import scholarly articles has also brought in many, many articles about clothing, dress history, and textiles that have lead to the creation of items about curators and dress historians through the author disambiguation tool. And some of these articles, in turn, have been used to reference other items in Wikidata. - [[User:PKM|PKM]] ([[User talk:PKM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:21, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: A beautiful example of virtuous circle. [[User:Nomen ad hoc|Nomen ad hoc]] ([[User talk:Nomen ad hoc|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:59, 28 July 2019 (UTC).
::::How many items on Wikidata have at least one reference (via P248) to a scientific article? And how many scientific articles are used as references (via P248) on items? Exactly how much are we not taking advantage of the glut of scientific article items on Wikidata? [[User:Mahir256|Mahir256]] ([[User talk:Mahir256|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:29, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
::If you're going to talk about hijackers, then let them confront this accusation: [[User:Daniel Mietchen]], [[User:Harej]], to name a few. [[User:Mahir256|Mahir256]] ([[User talk:Mahir256|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:29, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:::With all due respect, this accusation says more about you. Hijacking of what? Wikidata is actually used and useful. Thanks to Scholia we now have an instrument that enables us to objectively assess the notability of scholars. The value of Wikidata is in its use, the scientific data is used, useful and I agree that this is a "mortal sin". Thanks, [[User:GerardM|GerardM]] ([[User talk:GerardM|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:37, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:Scholia is a very useful tool, that even got to the point where they managed to get the Sloan foundation to give them a grant to pay for more development. It's good for getting new users engaged with Wikidata if Scholia would have a separate Wikibase installation it would make it less likely that Wikidata profits from the new users that get engaged via Scholia. I'm not sure what this "balance" you are talking is about and why we should consider it to be valuable. The fact that half of our items are scientific articles doesn't cost us much. It would be a problem if half of vandalism fighting would deal with the items about scientific articles but that's far for the reality. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 12:05, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{Ping|ChristianKl}} in my opinion, the fact that Scholia got a grant is really irrelevant to this conversation - that does not give the Scholia project (or Wikicite in general) any special right on Wikidata. This attitude has been an issue since the beginning of Wikicite: having grants makes grantees feel entitled to bypass community rules. For instance {{P|2860}} was created during the Wikicite conference less than 3 hours after being proposed. Similarly, to import millions of publication items one could have expected to go through [[Wikidata:Requests_for_permissions/Bot]] - I do not remember seeing that (but I might be wrong).
::The fact that half our items are scientific articles does cost us a lot, both technically and socially. We have issues with the Wikidata Query Service which is put under a lot of strain (by Wikicite edits but probably also by Wikicite queries), we have issues with terms storage in Wikibase (in good part because of the immense duplication of machine-generated descriptions on publication items), publication items and ORCID items flood the search results, making it harder to find other items (reminder: WMDE had to manually tweak the search profile to reduce the prominence of scientific articles in search). We have a statement from WMDE about the unsuitability of Wikibase for publications with hundreds (thousands?) of authors stored as individual statements. At the same time, the Wikicite corpus is still extremely patchy, so we would need a lot more items to make it usable. Is that not enough evidence? − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:57, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I do agree that doublication of machine generated descriptions is a problem but I don't think it's limited to scientific articles. Having all those items might mean that it's more pressing to solve the issue by a clever description template system, but it's a problem we would also have without WikiCite activities. 
:::Handling publications with hundreds of authors feels to me like a technical problem that could be solved by only showing the user 5 authors by default in the interface and only showing more when the user queries for more. It sounds to me like it's a question of development effort. Scholia having their own grant money could be helpful here if that ability to have papers with multiple authors is considered important for them. 
:::I do agree, that it's unforuntate that WikiCite didn't went through the bot approval process. We don't have a formal policy that requires that. When thinking about the issue I advocated for batches being easy to undo. Batches that are easy to undo, are qualitatively different then bot edits that are by their nature often not be able to be undone via a single click. This allows for people to be bold with adding data but it still allows the community to find the consensus to undo edits that it doesn't like. If you think stopping WikiCite creates this many items is important, an RfC to find consensus would be a useful step forward.[[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫
::::Yeah, who cares about bot approval, we have QuickStatementsBot to bypass it entirely! Bot approval is only here to discourage newcomers from importing stuff. I wonder why we are not doing the same for properties by the way, I should create a self-service property creation bot and only leave [[Wikidata:Property proposal]] to the clueless newbies. I wonder who came up with this idea of "consensus" anyway… − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:58, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::::: "Seek consensus before editing" is not the general Wiki-way. "Be bold" is. We have approval processes for tasks where undoing the actions of someone who practices "be bold" is problematic. Solving the problems that come from badly modeled properties isn't as easy as pressing a button to undo a QuickStatement batch. I'm not opposed to creating a policy that actually requires approval for large QuickStatement batches but we would need to design a process that works in a timely fashion for that. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 16:21, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::Look, we are not talking about a few big QS batches - this import is split into hundreds (if not thousands) of relatively small batches, so it is clear that such a policy would not prevent anything. I don't think we need more policies here - we just need the basic decency of requesting community feedback before doubling the size of Wikidata with publications. That discussion could have happened anywhere on wiki. I am a big fan of the "be bold" policy, but this is another scale of boldness. Is it not common sense? − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:36, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::{{Ping|Daniel Mietchen|Egon Willighagen|Fnielsen|GZWDer}} Let's put this another way: if you can show me that there is a clear consensus both from the community and from WMDE that some set of publications can be imported (say Crossref), at a given rate (say 60 edits/sec), then I am happy to do this entire import for you. This will solve Scholia's coverage issues directly. If you are not able to show that this consensus exists, then try with a smaller set of publications or a slower rate. If this has already been discussed somewhere on this wiki, then apologies for the noise, just point me to that consensus. If you are not able to find such a consensus for any set of publications, then we should block SourceMD. It is just not okay to do such a large import in "who's-gonna-stop-me" mode. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 17:38, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::: I do consider your demand here reasonable given the millions of items involved. But I don't think the same should go for actual batches of 50,000 items that are also created by side-stepping the bot policy. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 06:59, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::I have created [[Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Bot/LargeDatasetBot]] to see how community feels in such an import.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:06, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:I very strongly opposes separate Wikibase instance for this. One purpose of Wikidata is getting concepts linked (including other items and papers as source, papers and other works they cited, papers and their authors, etc.) making a separate Wikibase instance does not make it simplier. Instead "scholarly article" is a good use case of Wikidata.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:33, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
: In this comment I try to reply to comments by others. First, Scholia != Wikicite != Wikidata != me. Second, please accept that Wikicite and Wikidata are communities and that I cannot be held repsonsible for actions done by another community member. I will not comment on mass import on articles, as I have not done that, neither have I been involved in the process that led to that. Now, to explain why I support the idea, despite the growing pains, is simple. Let me first phrase to starting points, assumptions if you like: First, just like Wikipedia, we want Wikidata to be a resource where the provenance of facts is known. Second, I hope we can all except that Wikidata needs to be able to support Wikipedia and that Wikipedia is very rich. Third, can should accept that 60M entities is nothing compared to what a resource like Wikidata needs to support. In that context I like to remind people that we have 100M chemical compounds on which there is data. If we seek balance, why not just add 100M chemicals. Last starting point: we all hate the growing pains, we all hate the problems. So, to some specific replies. 1. there is consensus that provenance is important. 2. scientific literature is important provenance. 3. a scholarly article exists to support facts (this is complex, because Wikipedia actually has a lot of literature cited just because some person with a Wikipedia page wrote it; does that make Wikipedia bad?). 4. Many of the Wikidata community have been working on linking topics to literature, via References, via "main subject", etc. Scholia tries to visualize those links. And this is way beyond Wikicite/Scholia, but involves several other Wikidata projects 5. Scholia does not import literature. 6. I'm not a QuickStatements expert, but as far as I know it is rate limited, {{User|Magnus_Manske}} has been more than responsive, and has seen repeated approval (and SourceMD != QuickStatements). (Besides his ongoing Rust work!) 7. The Scholia project has actively engaged to overcome growing pains. 8. Literature is provenance and should be a central part of Wikidata, just like it is in Wikipedia. No one has yet convinced me that putting that on a separate platform will actually solve any problems. Federated queries are not known to speed up SPARQL queries, for example. 9. I have been involved in a few discussions, and there is no consensus what actually the cause of the growing pains is. Some say the size of the edits, others say the tool. 10. Links between literature and scholarly articles is hard; using them as reference even harder, but that is caused by copyright law. If you want to know how many Wikidata items are linked to articles, you cannot exclude 'main subject' and related properties. 11. Finally, I don't have the solution to the current problem. But if provenance is not an option for Wikidata, if a general-purpose (with sport) is not an option, then the community which just happens to have made most use of it (with a of benefit to the community, scholarly (many projects around that; Scholia and Wikicite are only two of many) and non-scholarly (like Gerard), should not be scapegoated. My 2 cents --[[User:Egon Willighagen|Egon Willighagen]] ([[User talk:Egon Willighagen|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:07, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

== How to indicate parody? ==

I would like to indicate that one work is a parody of another work. I thought that using {{p|941}} with the qualifier {{p|1552}} {{q|Q170539}} would be a valid approach since parody is a form of literary/artistic influence, but [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q1059987&diff=988221675&oldid=988123084 apparently not]. Is there a better way or would it be necessary to create a new property? [[User:Alexander Doria|Alexander Doria]] ([[User talk:Alexander Doria|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:36, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:{{p|1552}} is the wrong qualifier. {{P|2868}} would be more fitting for this usecase. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 11:42, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:: {{ping|Alexander Doria}} My proposition: add {{p|136}} = {{Q|16669008}} with a reference claiming that. Theoretically this should be enough to infer what you plan to show. If you want to reinforce the link between both works, you can add as qualifier for {{p|136}} = {{Q|16669008}}, {{p|642}} = {{Q|Q1227693}}, but I don't really like this way of modeling. [[User:Snipre|Snipre]] ([[User talk:Snipre|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:34, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:: I don't like constructions with "of". The word "of" is very vague and not easy to translate into other languages like Chinese. "subject has role" sounds more technical but it doesn't rely on particularities of the English language. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 15:18, 29 July 2019 (UTC) 
: I agree with using {{P|941}}/{{P|P2868}}. A work can be a parody of one work and inspired by others without parodizing them. Just having the a statement {{p|136}} = {{Q|16669008}} and some {{p|941}}-statement does not make it clear what work (or other entity) a work is a parody of. But I would also support an own property, as this parody-relation is a quite frequent and distinctive relation. - [[User:Valentina.Anitnelav|Valentina.Anitnelav]] ([[User talk:Valentina.Anitnelav|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:12, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
Thanks a lot for all this feedback! {{ping|Snipre}} Using {{P|941}}/{{p|136}} was my first approach but wasn't any more successful. In my opinion theses qualifiers referred to the statement and not the object but I agree it creates some ambiguity. For the time being, I'll use {{ping|ChristianKl}}'s solution ({{P|941}}/{{P|P2868}}). I also think, like {{ping|Valentina.Anitnelav}} that in the long run, there may be enough parody relationships to justify a specific property (especially if Wikidata fiction coverage is extended beyond published books: there are millions of parodies in magazines and newspapers). [[User:Alexander Doria|Alexander Doria]] ([[User talk:Alexander Doria|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:32, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:: The great thing about {{P|941}}/{{P|P2868}} is that in case it gets used a lot it's easy to move the claims over to a newly created property. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 07:18, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

== newly created item resistance group ([[Q65971239]]) ==

Hi! I created the item ''' resistance group''' ([[Q65971239|Q65971239]]&nbsp;<sup>[https://tools.wmflabs.org/reasonator/?lang=eno&q=Q65971239&live R]&nbsp;[{{fullurl:d:special:whatlinkshere/Q65971239|limit=500}} WLH]</sup>) because most of the items linking now to it did not contain an instance of statement. I could not identify an appropriate article in any language project until now. If you are aware of one, please link it to this item.<br/>
There are many statements to be added at the various items. Articles about French resistance are using '''resistance movement''' ([[Q138796|Q138796]]&nbsp;<sup>[https://tools.wmflabs.org/reasonator/?lang=eno&q=Q138796&live R]&nbsp;[{{fullurl:d:special:whatlinkshere/Q138796|limit=500}} WLH]</sup>) which is not the same as a group of people, Please verify what you can do and ping me. Thanks in advance<br/>
<span dir="ltr">[[user:קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|no bias — קיין אומוויסנדיקע פּרעפֿערענצן — keyn umvisndike preferentsn]] <sup>[[user talk:קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|talk]] [[special:contributions/קיין ומוויסנדיק פּרעפֿערענצן|contribs]]</sup></span> 21:02, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:French resistance as a whole (or more broadly {{Q|2094191}}) is clearly a {{Q|138796}}, but specific french resistance ggroups shoudl probably be moved to your new item, which I have taken the liberty to rename to a more specific name. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]])
::It's bad to rename an item in only one language to a more specific name but not in the others that have labels. Why do you think it's important to rename it in one language and risk people misusing it? What's the issue with having a more general item? [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 06:45, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I did not "think it's important to rename it in [only] one language and risk people misusing it", and I'd appreciate you not making blanket accusations of the sort. If anything, the ''original'' name was the one likely to cause misuse. I just happen, like 99% of wikidata users, to not display all possible languages when editing names, and when I changed the name, it wasn't showing that there even ''was'' a name entered in German. I've put a quick'n dirty edit to it because I haven't really done with German much since my 2 years of it in Cegep 17 years ago. [[User:Circeus|Circeus]] ([[User talk:Circeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:49, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
::::{{re|Circeus}} By narrowing the scope of an existing item, you caused the names of the item in different languages to be out of sync. That's a reason why scopes normally shouldn't be narrowed if you don't think doing so is important. It's not something that should be done in a dirty way. If you think it's important enough to do, then put in the work. An item having no label is better then it having a wrong label.
::::I don't think the fact that I assume that you acted in good faith (you had a good reason for doing something that creates problems) to be a 'blanket accusation'. 
::::What kind of misuse do you expect to happen when there's an item called "resistance group" that analogous to {{Q|138796}} in name and scope? {{unsigned|ChristianKl}}

== Abuse filter ==

Any abuse filter for [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q11750&diff=951136794&oldid=931792891 that]? --[[User:Metrónomo|Metrónomo]] ([[User talk:Metrónomo|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:30, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
: I don't see how a abuse filter would help here. What exactly would you want to filter? [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 13:18, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
::Abuse filter is quite slow. I'll suggest to wait for a new ORES-feature that allows training the prediction system on the fly. [[User:Sjoerddebruin|<font color="#325186">'''Sjoerd de Bruin'''</font>]] [[User talk:Sjoerddebruin|<font color="#325186">(talk)</font>]]  14:58, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
== From the nonsense of data mass imports ==

[[File:Screenshot 2019-07-27 Suchergebnisse für „Tao Chen“ - Wikidata.png|thumb]]
I just tried to find out if Wikidata already has an entry for a certain Chinese athlete named "Tao Chen" (see image). It was not easy to find out, because there are a lot of entries for this or similar name. Who hides behind most entries is almost impossible to find out, as there are imports of ORCID and CBDB. Without further details. This data is now on Wikidata and lazy, because it is usable for nothing. The project Wikidata is currently at a crossroads. Continue with an unbridled, unchecked mass import of meaningless data, or finally, focus on creating high quality records. -- [[User:Marcus Cyron|Marcus Cyron]] ([[User talk:Marcus Cyron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:27, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

*So you are trying to say these people should bear a different name, just because you can't tell them apart? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 15:00, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

:::Wow! I'm impressed, what you read out of my words! OO -- [[User:Marcus Cyron|Marcus Cyron]] ([[User talk:Marcus Cyron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:35, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

::::I think you might just as well have written that we have plenty of items about taxons and this makes you unable to determine which football player is your athlete. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 12:46, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

:: I also find it sometimes hard to find an wikidata object for a person, because someone with the same name is included in a lot of scientific papers and some persons are listed not a the begin of the search result but somewhere inbetween. From my point of view it would be helpfull to have different sort options (e.g. list all items (not just some) that match that name first, than all papers which only include that name) and/or better filter options (e.g. only search for persons, exclude papers, ...). --[[User:M2k~dewiki|M2k~dewiki]] ([[User talk:M2k~dewiki|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:10, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

:::{{Ping|Daniel Mietchen|Fnielsen}} this thread is yet another indication that the indiscriminate import of ORCID profiles and scientific articles does more harm than good. It would be great if that effort could be limited to a well-defined scope which would limit the volume of the imports to reasonable levels. Such a scope would allow you to aim for completeness within that scope. Without completeness, Scholia's statistics are highly skewed. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:13, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::Can you explain how that is so? The users is looking for an athlete. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 16:16, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::Marcus explicitly mentions the ORCID import as one of the causes of the issue, by flooding the search results with namesake items. These items often do not have enough information to disambiguate them (ORCID profiles are often empty apart from the name of the person, being of little use for disambiguation). − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:39, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::Correct. This is my problem. The majority of the examples I take to fix issues were impossible to fix, because there were not enough informations to figure out, which person is meant. -- [[User:Marcus Cyron|Marcus Cyron]] ([[User talk:Marcus Cyron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:37, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::::What issue did you try to fix for your athlete in relation to ORCID and CBDB?  --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 23:42, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: {{Ping|Pintoch}} I am not sure why you drag in Scholia. Scholia is not a ORCID GUI. I don't understand your argument, btw: ORCID makes considerable effort to only have unique efforts (and part of the core design and purpose), and this involves many international publishers, organisations, community projects, etc. A different ORCID means a different person. Sure, they have errors too. Do you have support for a claim that the error rate in ORCID is unhealthy large? Purely anecdotal, I have more issues merging chemicals because of important from Wikipedia (or splits, for the matter) than I ever had for ORCID authors. I am not advocating mass imports, and have been very hesitant about that (I have an approved bot, but hesitant in putting it into action). I am not aware of any effort of indiscriminate import of ORCID profiles into Wikidata and I hope you can give me more info. I can only assume you refer to tools like SourceMD, but that does not make sense to me, as it cannot import data that is not in ORCID. Can you please add details? You cannot blame Scholia for everything you do not like; if there are actions you do not like, name them specifically. Thank you. --[[User:Egon Willighagen|Egon Willighagen]] ([[User talk:Egon Willighagen|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:28, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{Ping|Marcus Cyron}} You can search for "Tao Chen" and filter out the {{P|P496}} and {{P|P497}} junk and only get the humans with [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?sort=relevance&search=%22Tao+Chen%22+-haswbstatement%3AP496+-haswbstatement%3AP497++haswbstatement%3AP31%3DQ5&title=Special%3ASearch&profile=advanced&fulltext=1&advancedSearch-current=%7B%7D&ns0=1&ns120=1 this search]. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:23, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:::{{Ping|Multichill}} - thanks for this hint! :) This will help a bit, mainly when I work on sportspersons. For scientists this ofcourse can not fix the problem. But I'm really happy for having the half of my personal problems with this solved :). -- [[User:Marcus Cyron|Marcus Cyron]] ([[User talk:Marcus Cyron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:39, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:: In my opinion 1. ORCID profiles are useful for disambiguation as there're little duplicate and they provide a basis for future improvement. Author items without identifiers instead do not prevent duplicates from happening. 2. For checking the biases in Wikidata, we may track the completeness of data relative to a specific dataset/data dump. Before entries in these dataset/dump are complete Wikidata will always be biased. It will take years to complete the import of a huge dataset of bibliographic data (about 200 million).--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:29, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:::{{Ping|GZWDer}} I do not think the alternative is to create {{tq|author items without identifiers}}. The alternative is not to create these items at all! Or to take the time to curate them manually (so, only to create as many as we can afford to curate manually). − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:10, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: I said "author items without identifiers" is a bad workflow (and should be avoided). Even if we only curate the authors manually, we will eventually have more and more items with same names (labels). The "ORCID=..." is already enough to differentiate items for researchers and other items with the same name.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:25, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

:Marcus, the premise of your argument fails entirely. A search for ''Tao Chen'' brings back many ORCID and CBDB imports, all properly described as being ORCID or CBDB persons, such that the very few non ORCID and CBDB candidates can be identified and checked. It doesn't appear that the presence of hundreds of thousands of ORCID or CBDB imports impairs the search function in any meaningful way. To the extent a 'solution' to this supposed 'problem' is required, it is provided by items' description fields which can & should be used to disambiguate items in such a way as to facilitate the use of the search function: and as noted in your ''Tao Chen'' example, for CBDB and ORCID, this has been done without exception. Should there be import sets where descriptions are lacking, these can be added with minimal SPARQL and QuickStatements effort. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:30, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:+1 --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 22:39, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::It seems, you both did not want to understand, so you do everything to bring the disccussion into an other direction. Funny. OK, once more: in the moment you work on something and you look for maybe already existing here but you only find data junk, it's hard up to impossible to find something. But what I had learned is, that Wikidata is full of this data junk. What makes this project nearly unusable. It's so much …, when do you will bring these data together? The Wikidata clue is to bring all this together. And not to be a mirror of other databases. But OK, I'm out. Once more I need to learn, that every critic is unwanted. Mass before class. These are those moments I need to ask the universe, why editor as Multichill & Co to a so phantastic job on projects as Summ of all paintings, when at the end mass is wanted, not class. We would have had a one time opportunity to create something very big, very great, not to say phantastic, a collection of all world wide knowledge on one place in a multilingual project. This will only work, when it's possible to work with and within the project. -- [[User:Marcus Cyron|Marcus Cyron]] ([[User talk:Marcus Cyron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:54, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
:::The question above still stands: What issue did you try to fix for your athlete in relation to ORCID and CBDB? --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 00:31, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{re|Marcus Cyron}} it took me quite a while too to find out who this guy [[:c:Category:Tao Chen]] was. He's 陈涛 ([https://baike.baidu.com/item/%E9%99%88%E6%B6%9B/22552809 Baidu Encyclopedia]) [http://www.sohu.com/a/279045010_492691 from Hangzhou]. (His name should be Chen Tao, btw.) I think his item is not yet created.--[[User:Roy17|Roy17]] ([[User talk:Roy17|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:29, 27 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{re|Roy17}} - I'm working on it. I do it by hand (!) and check everything. I can't do mass edits with this. My work needs time, but you will know then who is who! But funny, that I hit the problem so much, that you follow my edits over the projects …. -- [[User:Marcus Cyron|Marcus Cyron]] ([[User talk:Marcus Cyron|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 23:54, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{Ping|Tagishsimon|Jura1}} Hang on, since when are descriptions from the ORCID imports satisfactory? Are you familiar with [[Help:Description]] at all? Adding ORCID ids in the descriptions is an ugly hack, descriptions are not supposed to be used for that at all. Assuming that everyone with an ORCID is a researcher is also a gross approximation. This has only become necessary because of the scale of the ORCID import and the lack of proper curation of these items. The description {{tq|researcher ORCID: 0000-0002-3941-1603}} is not satisfactory at all, a satisfactory description for {{Q|55979803}} would be something along the lines of {{tq|chemistry researcher at the University of Surrey, UK}}. Yes it takes some effort to produce these descriptions: if the Wikicite project is not capable of doing that, then it should not import these half-baked items at all.
:Moreover, athletes can have ORCID ids, so when looking for an athlete you cannot in principle discard all items with ORCID ids (take {{Q|26932946}} for instance, you can find plenty of others with SPARQL). It is just not acceptable at all to mass-import datasets carelessly and expect other users to adapt their workflows to deal with the inconvenience. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:10, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

::Its arrant bollocks to argue, as you appear to be doing, that if it's not possible to do an import job perfectly it should not be done at all. That's just not how wikidata works. No-one's arguing that {{tq|researcher ORCID: 0000-0002-3941-1603}} is optimal. It is a satisfactory method of disambiguating item X from item Y, and iirc [[Help:Description]] - if you've ben arsed to read it - makes clear the purpose of the description is disambiguation. Your suggested description {{tq|chemistry researcher at the University of Surrey, UK}} fails in just the same way as {{tq|researcher ORCID: 0000-0002-3941-1603}} to convey that item X is the athlete we're after, because descriptions cannot & should not amount to a full biography. Wikidata is a shared resource which proceeds incrementally. You're just going to have to live with the reality that your workflow will necessarily from time to time be impacted by the 'inconvenience' of other users. Apologies that the world doesn't give a shit about your solipcism, but there we are. --[[User:Tagishsimon|Tagishsimon]] ([[User talk:Tagishsimon|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:42, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

:::{{Ping|Tagishsimon}} I am sorry if I offended you. Can you have a good look at your reply above and confirm me that you think this language is acceptable on Wikidata? I am not sure my testicles have anything to do with the discussion here. I think you should apologize. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:34, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
::::The current descriptions "researcher ORCID: XXX" are not intended to be permanent, but is already enough to differentiate WikiCite items from others (If you think these description does not help for finding athletes, the full description like "chemistry researcher at the University of Surrey, UK" does not either). Once {{P|108}} having added (more than 200000 items had) the description can at least be improved to "researcher from XXX University" where the term "researcher" can be further refined using {{P|101}}.--[[User:GZWDer|GZWDer]] ([[User talk:GZWDer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:34, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::{{Ping|GZWDer}} sure, in general it is fine to work on imports in incremental stages. The problem in this case is the scale - this import is really big, and it makes it significantly harder for others to improve Wikidata. This is similar to the Cebwiki import: mass-creating lots of duplicates for geographical entities was meant to be a work in progress too, but it is massively annoying for people trying to add locations on other items, by having to filter out "Cebwiki items". Wikidata is a collaborative project, so it is better if people can be mindful of others when doing their imports. We should not have to teach people how to ignore "Cebwiki items", "ORCID items" or "CBDB items": let us just not create items that are meant to be ignored by the rest of the community. It would also be great if Wikicite could stop using the number of items created as a metric of its success as a project. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:23, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::I am curious at whether there is any rules against "too big file import" / "low quality import" ? I agree Cebwiki/SVwiki bot may be annoying, but they are stating often true (but poor quality) elements. And there should a button on a Qx element, that would say "Hey, look at this other Qx, they look to be very similar : please look at both of them and decide of a potential merge"  [[User:Bouzinac|Bouzinac]] ([[User talk:Bouzinac|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:01, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::::Whether an import is too big or whether its quality is too low is decided on an individual basis at [[Wikidata:Requests for permissions/Bot]]… but only when the authors actually use this space and respect the results. − [[User:Pintoch|Pintoch]] ([[User talk:Pintoch|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:21, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::::::*I think it depends on the type of items and the number of statements that are being imported. The two imports initially mentioned clearly have some issues, but oddly those don't seem relevant to the question at hand (an athlete). The PubMed items that were also mentioned are probably relatively numerous and our tools are not quite up to it, but I think the items have relatively few issues and don't overlap with other content. As such, I think they are fairly unproblematic and give a good basis to improve relevant features. If we actually absorbed most of it, I think it's a great achievement for the project. The problem with "Cebwiki items" is that they tend to overlap with some content, initially included few statements and have some quality issues when they do. For some regions, I think steps were taken to clean them up, e.g. the US. Obviously, a direct import from GNIS might have been the better route. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 13:54, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
: People searching for names in general should realize that matching by name is a highly complex task. Many names can be spelled many different ways - even ordinary English names with capitalization, middle names, initials etc. Chinese names probably should use the characters of the language, not the anglicized version of the name (especially with name parts reversed), but searching on those can be tricky too. Just because you've found no matches when searching by name doesn't mean an item doesn't already exist for that person; conversely you may find hundreds of matches on a common name; you should probably find some other way to filter your search, but it's work either way. This is a very general problem and complaining about the large number of people with the same name doesn't really help us address it. That's partly why identifiers like ORCID and ISNI are so important. [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:17, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:: If I am allowed to add further complexity to the Tao-Chen-problem: ORCID may not always have a one-to-one relation to a real world person. I believe https://orcid.org/0000-0003-4888-1292 and https://orcid.org/0000-0002-8371-779X are the same endocrinologist from Sichuan University West China Hospital, corresponding to {{Q|60032793}} and {{Q|60032792}}. &mdash; [[User:Fnielsen|Finn Årup Nielsen (fnielsen)]] ([[User talk:Fnielsen|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 16:20, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
Apart from Multichill's neat query, [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Search&limit=500&offset=0&ns0=1&search=tao+chen+-orcid+-scientific+-researcher&advancedSearch-current={} "tao chen -orcid -scientific -researcher"] seems also to give reasonable results.
:On Wikidata footballer generally have the occupation {{q|Q937857}} listed. If you seek for the item of a footballer named Tao Chen you can simply search "Tao Chen football" and you will see the two footballer with that name. 
: That said, sometimes you won't find the existing item and create a new one. Maybe, there are multiple variation of the name. That's also okay. Today, we have constraint reports when the single value constraint is violated for external ID and when you add decent external IDs, sooner or later we will merge the items. In the future we might have even better lists of candidates to be merged if someone gets around to writing machine learning code. 
: If we want Wikidata to grow, then we have to find ways to deal with having a lot of items of people with the same name. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 14:55, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

== 987,654,321 ==

Edit [[Special:Diff/987654321|987,654,321]] was done around the midnight (UTC). One bilion is near... --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:02, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

=== Special Wikidatalogo for 1 Billion Edits ===
[[File:One billion edits on Wikidata (plain).svg|thumb|Proposal 1]]
Hello,

what do you think about changing the logo shown on the Wikidatawebsite for a few days, when Wikidata reaches 1 Billion Edits. I think that were a way to show readers that Wikidata has 1 Billion Edits. The Special Logo should not contain a name for the number because in German Billion is something else as in English. -- [[User:Hogü-456|Hogü-456]] ([[User talk:Hogü-456|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:25, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
: Any graphics to suggest? [[User:Nomen ad hoc|Nomen ad hoc]] ([[User talk:Nomen ad hoc|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:02, 28 July 2019 (UTC).
: In SI terms Wikidata would have reached one gigaedit :) perhaps something based on that? --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:12, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Made some graphics suggestion in [[c:Category:Wikidata one billion edits]]. - [[User:Premeditated|Premeditated]] ([[User talk:Premeditated|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 22:02, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::: Personally I like this (the one linked above as "Proposal 1")! [[User:ArthurPSmith|ArthurPSmith]] ([[User talk:ArthurPSmith|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:55, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
:::: Same as for me. [[User:Nomen ad hoc|Nomen ad hoc]] ([[User talk:Nomen ad hoc|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:14, 30 July 2019 (UTC).
:::: Me too, nice logo variant, maybe the start of a monthly "Wikidata Doodle"-program?? ;) [[User:Moebeus|Moebeus]] ([[User talk:Moebeus|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 00:30, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
: I don't think we should use numbers of edits as a metric worth celebrating. Bot edits that add additional descriptions are not worth celebrating. If we change our logo it should be because of metrics such as monthly users with at least 1/5/100 edits that reach a milestone. [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 07:02, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
::As someone who will admit to having used QS very inefficiently, I do agree with Christian that this milestone in itself is not worth celebrating. [[User:Mahir256|Mahir256]] ([[User talk:Mahir256|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 03:56, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

== I'm not sure if this have been brought up before ==

Are trailers for movies, television shows or video games notable enough to warrant their own items? --[[User:Trade|Trade]] ([[User talk:Trade|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:40, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
*As per [[Wikidata:Notability]] I would say some trailers could possibly meet point 2. Probably not every trailer ever though. --[[User:SilentSpike|SilentSpike]] ([[User talk:SilentSpike|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:01, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::I made a quick example here {{Q|Q65972027}}. Are there any properties that you think i should or should not have used? I wish there was a way to indicate the soundtrack used but i cannot find such a property. --[[User:Trade|Trade]] ([[User talk:Trade|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:13, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::{{Ping|Trade}} Use {{P|6291}} to connect it to the movie. [[User:Thierry Caro|Thierry Caro]] ([[User talk:Thierry Caro|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 13:18, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
*Film items usually include them directly: [[Wikidata:WikiProject_Movies/lists/trailers]]. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 21:30, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::Was it ever revealed why they didn't created seperate items for film trailers? Given how popular some of these trailers are it just seems weird. I imagine it might be because we don't have third party databases to reference the information like we do with music videos and IMDB --[[User:Trade|Trade]] ([[User talk:Trade|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 21:50, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
:::At [[Wikidata_talk:WikiProject_Movies/Archive_1#Property_for_trailer_(Q622550)_?]] we discussed a possible property, but using existing ones worked out just as well. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 21:55, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

== series ordinal ==

{{P|1545}}. List of presidents according to chronological order: A B C D B E F G.

B was president two different periods. For the first period we can say that he/she is the 2nd president (P1545 -> 2). 

#What about the second period? Are we going to say that he/she is the 5th president (P1545 -> 5) or again the 2nd (P1545 -> 2)? 
#And what about president E? Is he/she the 5th or the 6th president? 

[[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 08:14, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

: {{reply to|Xaris333}} it might vary by office / country, but for the US presidency, for example, {{Q|Q35171}} is considered to be the 22nd and 24th president, and his successors are considered the 23rd and 25th president, respectively. But leaving that example aside – ultimately, that comes down to what the sources say, doesn’t it? --[[User:Lucas Werkmeister|Lucas Werkmeister]] ([[User talk:Lucas Werkmeister|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 09:55, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

::Sometimes the one source says different number than the other. I have to ask here just to know I am not doing something wrong. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 10:00, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I have seen Wikipedias using this when numbering Swedish royals. It is then often a "homemade {{Q|Q1152199}}". So add this only when you find ''good'' sources. Nobody know who was the first Swedish king. One list I have seen sets {{Q|3044}} as first. Another puts {{Q|43610}} as second. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 13:56, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

::::In my example, we know for sure who were the presidents and their order. [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]] ([[User talk:Xaris333|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:55, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::Yes [[User:Xaris333|Xaris333]], stay with those. The problems often comes when people who only know about US, tries to extend the idea to other areas. [[User:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|IP 62.20.170.74]] ([[User talk:Sextvå.tvånoll.ettsjunoll.sjufyra|Hej!]]) 07:59, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

== [[Wikidata:Database reports/Constraint violations/P301]] - inverse violations and references to deleted objects ==

Hello, [[Wikidata:Database reports/Constraint violations/P301]] contains a list of ''Inverse violations'' (current "violations count" is 28764). Is there a tool or bot to add the missing property for these 28764 entries? The list also contains or contained references to objects which have been deleted more than three years ago (for example [https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q6624293&diff=prev&oldid=989926586][https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q8211150&diff=prev&oldid=989924520][https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q7083006&diff=prev&oldid=989923041] and more). Is there (in general) a tool or bot to identify (and maybe also remove) references to deleted objects? --[[User:M2k~dewiki|M2k~dewiki]] ([[User talk:M2k~dewiki|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 14:59, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
: also see [[Wikidata:Forum#Nachtragung_von_Hauptkategorie_zum_Artikel_(P910)?]] (German) --[[User:M2k~dewiki|M2k~dewiki]] ([[User talk:M2k~dewiki|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:02, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

:There is [[Wikidata:Database reports/Deleted Wikidata entities that are still linked]] which should in principle list use of deleted items, but the old ones which you have just removed did not appear there for some reason. Do you have more linked deleted items which are not yet removed? --[[User:MisterSynergy|MisterSynergy]] ([[User talk:MisterSynergy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:14, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Hello {{Ping|MisterSynergy}} if found about 30 objects with deleted references in [[Wikidata:Database_reports/Constraint_violations/P301#"Inverse"_violations]] with a "Violations count: 28764" but the report also says "Too many results. 23763 records skipped.", so there might be more similar cases, which are not show/skipped in this report. --[[User:M2k~dewiki|M2k~dewiki]] ([[User talk:M2k~dewiki|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 15:18, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
:::Okay, I found some more cases on other covi reports. Seems like there are some entries missing in the [[:mw:Manual:Pagelinks table|pagelinks table]], thus the report mentioned earlier does not find them.  —[[User:MisterSynergy|MisterSynergy]] ([[User talk:MisterSynergy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 18:43, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
: For adding, use [https://query.wikidata.org/ SPARQL] and [[Help:QuickStatements|QuickStatements]]. But keep in mind that the property is often misused and confused with eg. {{P|971}}, so thoughtless import can cause problems (and annoy users). --[[User:Matěj Suchánek|Matěj Suchánek]] ([[User talk:Matěj Suchánek|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 19:52, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

== Link to depictions on Commons ==

When I am looking at the {{Q|9394}} item on Wikidata, it would be cool if I had a simple way to see all depictions of rabbits on Commons ([https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/api.php?action=query&list=search&srsearch=haswbstatement:P180=Q9394&srnamespace=6 API]). Either as a paged gallery on the main panel of the Wikidata item, or as a link in the side bar, for instance below "What links here". Cheers! [[User:Syced|Syced]] ([[User talk:Syced|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:52, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

: I was actually talking about this with a few of the guys on the Telegram group the other day. There seems to be a bit of controversy on whether or not {{P|18}} should allow multiple entries. While on one hand it is good to be able to have several images for a species like a rabbit, coming in different breeds, shapes and sizes; on the other it's a bit more desirable to have a single image to abstractly it overall.

: I'm no expert but right now you should be able to get multiple images if you're good at querying, but adding such a feature as this is likely not a change to be welcomed by everyone. I for one however, would like to support it. At the very least having a tool to do this would be pretty sweet. [[User:Themadprogramer|Themadprogramer]] ([[User talk:Themadprogramer|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 07:00, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
::Would be a nice gadget to build. Maybe something to work on in the upcoming Wikimania hackathon. [[User:Multichill|Multichill]] ([[User talk:Multichill|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:18, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{ping|Syced}} I just created a tool [https://tools.wmflabs.org/depicts https://tools.wmflabs.org/depicts] to show the depictions. Hope it helps! --[[User:Stevenliuyi|Stevenliuyi]] ([[User talk:Stevenliuyi|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 20:43, 5 August 2019 (UTC)

::Nice! I added the tool to my Wikidata sidebar, it works great. I hope it can one day become included by default for all users :-) [[User:Syced|Syced]] ([[User talk:Syced|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 02:06, 6 August 2019 (UTC)

== Follow-up on [[Wikidata:Requests for comment/semi-protection to prevent vandalism on most used Items|RFC]] ==

@Ivanhercaz, Nicereddy, MarioFinale, Kristbaum, -jem-, Abián:

As you protected or supported protecting a large number of items, what's your plan for edit requests like on [[Talk:Q987]]? Will you monitor these or just hope someone will eventually find them? It seems to be me that implementation of your approach needs some work. Can you share how you plan to go about it? 

If nothing is done, I suppose we just have to unprotect the pages. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 09:35, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
:The fact that those users have supported semi-protecting, or have semi-protected, some Items doesn't make them responsible, or at least not more responsible than any other user or the development team, for implementing unrelated measures such as an improved interface or new mechanisms for tracking requests for change of semi-protected Items, in fact it's a matter of opinion whether or not such new mechanisms should be introduced. Having said that, personally I do think new features in the interface, such as a new link for "feedback", would be useful. I was hoping more users would participate in [[Wikidata:Administrators' noticeboard/Archive/2019/06#Wikidata:Requests for comment/semi-protection to prevent vandalism on most used Items|this thread]] but, since it was already archived, I think I'll open some Phabricator tasks about these possible new features anyway and I'll link them from here. Thanks for the reminder! --<span style="font-size:95%;">[[User:Abián|abi]][[User talk:Abián|án]]</span> 10:23, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::Well, it's for us to ensure that WMF's goal of openness is upheld. It's clear that you feel that you aren't bound by protection policy, but I suppose you understand that edits need to be possible.
::If one approach doesn't work, we need to implement an alternative. One thing is sure: developers wont be doing the edits, even if you open a phab task. --- [[User talk:Jura1|Jura]] 10:38, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
::A solution would be placing instructions on talk page of protected items in which user can add a category in edit request so that those request can be tracked and dealt. &#8208;&#8208;[[User:1997kB|1997kB]]&nbsp;([[User_talk:1997kB|talk]]) 12:39, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
:::That would be similar as {{tl|edit request}} for fully protected pages. However, as far as I know we are not even able to determine which items should be protected according to the policy, and where protection needs to be removed again because the criteria are not met any longer. It seems very premature to me that we already apply this policy at this stage. --[[User:MisterSynergy|MisterSynergy]] ([[User talk:MisterSynergy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 12:50, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
:It only took a day for the page to be edited, no? That seems fine to me. [[User:Nicereddy|Nicereddy]] ([[User talk:Nicereddy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 05:18, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
::{{re|Nicereddy}} It was not only one protected I guess. And looks like it got handled because it was brought on noticeboard. Without a proper system to handle such requests, there's chances some will go unnoticed. &#8208;&#8208;[[User:1997kB|1997kB]]&nbsp;([[User_talk:1997kB|talk]]) 06:37, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
:[[phab:T229100|This]] is the task I opened on Phabricator. What do you think? We can redirect those links to a new page [[Wikidata:Edit requests]] or similar, which may be edited by preloading (<code>?action=edit&preload=...</code>) a template. Any auto-confirmed user should be able to participate in resolving requests. --<span style="font-size:95%;">[[User:Abián|abi]][[User talk:Abián|án]]</span> 09:26, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
:: Having a edit request page sounds like a good idea. At best the page should make it clear that the edit requests should include a link to the source for a claim and not just "change x to y". 
:: Do we want to have a different page for the requests for each language or a common page? [[User:ChristianKl|<font color="#0000EE">'''ChristianKl'''</font>]] ❪[[User talk:ChristianKl|✉]]❫ 15:16, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
:::I'd say we can have a single page; even if we create different pages for different languages we can't guarantee that the language chosen by users and the page on which they write match, and requests in minority languages, even in languages other than English, might be ignored. --<span style="font-size:95%;">[[User:Abián|abi]][[User talk:Abián|án]]</span> 21:27, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
:(Since the [[Wikidata:Administrators' noticeboard|administrators' noticeboard]] isn't the proper place for this thread, I'm [[Special:Diff/989762973|moving this thread]] to the project chat.) --<span style="font-size:95%;">[[User:Abián|abi]][[User talk:Abián|án]]</span> 09:34, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

[[User:Abián]], the other part which is still missing is the monthly evaluation of pages which need to be newly protected, and where protection needs to be lifted because the criteria for protection are no longer met. We cannot implement the outcome of the RfC as long as we do not have numbers easily available.<br>I also have concerns about the some thousand protections which you applied last year before starting the RfC, and which are still in place. To my understanding, those protections have never been evaluated, although it should have been done according to the RfC. Can you please lift protection of those which are not used by 500 pages any longer, as the [[Wikidata:Page protection policy]] does not support protection any more? --[[User:MisterSynergy|MisterSynergy]] ([[User talk:MisterSynergy|<span class="signature-talk">{{int:Talkpagelinktext}}</span>]]) 11:29, 5 August 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|MisterSynergy}} For now the Phabricator tasks for tracking the implementation of these regular checks and potential semi-protections are [[phab:T226883]] and its subtasks, [[phab:T226882]] and [[phab:T226885]]; I think I can take care of the latter. The Items that I semi-protected before the RfC were based on the data described in [[phab:T210664]] and are just a subset (the most sensitive subset) of those that should be semi-protected right now according to the results of the RfC, so we probably don't have to worry about old semi-protections. Thanks for your interest! --<span style="font-size:95%;">[[User:Abián|abi]][[User talk:Abián|án]]</span> 21:27, 5 August 2019 (UTC)